Pondering "Real" vs. "Fake"... (Full Version)

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OfDarkInnocence -> Pondering "Real" vs. "Fake"... (3/6/2007 9:54:33 PM)

There seem to be so many tirades among the profiles on CollarMe regarding the lack of "real" people on here. I hope to offer perhaps another perspective for everyone to consider.
 
I spent about 10 months of the last year of my life getting to know two very "real" Dominants. They were who they said they were, they came with references, they hold multiple advanced degrees between them, and they are truly beautiful, amazing people. Everything seemed perfect, but slowly things began to unravel and be revealed. In the end, I have come to realize that while they are so remarkably "real", they are perhaps among the most psychologically dangerous people I have encountered in my life. The mindfuck was elaborate, and the lies had nothing to do with who they were but were ones they played on me, specifically me, to cause desired results.
 
Instead of seeking out "real" people on here, I would like to offer that maybe we should look a little deeper. I personally am a seeker of the honest, moral, dedicated, communicative, respectful, passionate, deep, sincere, stable, loving, intelligent, and whole people. There are many ways to find the truth within people, and there are so many qualities that must be present for success in any relationship but especially a D/s one. Two of the most real people I have ever encountered in my life turned out to be the most dangerous. I would rather have gone up against one you refer to as "fake" any day.
 
I would also like to encourage you to reconsider why you label people as less than "real". Being young and uncertain doesn't make someone "fake". Changing your mind about a situation doesn't make someone "fake". Becoming scared or unsure doesn't make someone "fake". Exploring all the options around you doesn't make someone "fake". Being unwilling to commit to making a decision that will effect the rest of your life within a short time of knowing someone doesn't make someone a "fake". I think so many people on this site are exploring things within themselves. They may not be entirely sure of what they want, but when they find it they will know. Perhaps they are not the best at communication, but all of us deserve patience. There are some this truly is a game to, and they will never take it seriously as we'd like them to. But compared to those who take it very seriously and use their power to mindfuck people into loss of identity and do harmful things...
 
On a positive note... I have met many amazing people here on CollarMe. I have gained true friendships that will likely last a lifetime.  And not just a few, many. I have met multiples of them in person. I am nearly at a point where I cannot accept anymore friends! I am overwhelmed, but very happy. I have beautiful people who add to my life and help me learn further as I walk this journey into D/s on a deeper level. They comprise all of the characteristics I listed above. And while I would also consider them very "real", at the same time I find that such a lame and worthless term. I have encountered many "real" people on here and in the world... few of them would I trust with my life or my heart.



juliaoceania -> RE: Pondering "Real" vs. "Fake"... (3/6/2007 10:02:49 PM)

I have to say I do not get the whole "references" thing. I rely much more on my inner voice than I do on the voices of people hand picked to represent the integrity of others... especially if all are strangers to me. What exactly does the word of one stranger to the integrity of another stranger benefit me?

It all comes down to one person's fake is another person's dream and I would hope more people would read your wise words and realize that an establishished reputation should not shadow our own judgment about the rightness or the wrongness of a situation and how it will impact our lives. Thank you for such a heart felt thread. I hope others take it the way you intended... it is all about trusting ourselves, because our perceptions are just as valid as what the person we are feeling about looks like on paper.



AquaticSub -> RE: Pondering "Real" vs. "Fake"... (3/6/2007 10:03:29 PM)

Brava!



MsParados -> RE: Pondering "Real" vs. "Fake"... (3/6/2007 10:05:11 PM)

I'm not too clear on what your experinces with a couple of nut jobs have to do with fakes but I am sorry to hear of your negative experience.
While yes it is human to change your mind and have doubts, but how you handle that situation is what gets you labeled by someone as "fake". When we get spurned for NO reason- no goodbyes, this isn't working, I met someone else- we look to identify a reason ANY reason; the easiest being the person was a fake or player.



SusanofO -> RE: Pondering "Real" vs. "Fake"... (3/6/2007 10:09:38 PM)

I have come to rely on my intuition, even when-if everyone is telling me a situation is Not what I perceive it to be. I have rarely been wrong. I always thought my ex-Dominant had a potential screw loose somewhere. And I turned out to be 100% right about that, in the end.

Of course, I am a Pisces, and we can spot someone who is a bit strange (in a bad way) at 1,000 paces, even if almost the entire rest of the word thinks they are "just fine". Usually.

The unfortunate part is that, until earlier this year, that had rarely stopped me from ever getting to know someone better, because I many times think weird can be so intriguing. Which it can. Just as someone who looks totally "normal" (whatever that is) can also seem so very "safe". Both can be wonderful. Both can be sometimes dangerous as well (in bad ways you don't intend). Be careful out there, people.  

I am sorry to hear what happened to the OP. It is really unfortunate. Best of luck in the future, and good healing to you.

- Susan 



hisannabelle -> RE: Pondering "Real" vs. "Fake"... (3/6/2007 10:16:41 PM)

i see so many "real" people posting real and amazing things on this board (like the op, for example), and i wonder why we get so many people bitching about "fakes" on this site.

thank you for this post. i was going to write a more in-depth response, but i'm feeling a bit like falling asleep at my keyboard.



MasterNdorei -> RE: Pondering "Real" vs. "Fake"... (3/6/2007 10:21:57 PM)

Pisces to Pisces, SusanofO, you said it best! Wierd can be so intriguing! It is learning to view it from a safe distance that is the trick. For me it was learning to not let "wierd" get stuck to my shoe, so to speak.

To the OP, you relayed your situation eloquently. i am glad to hear you are surrounded with friends. It is no wonder good people have made their way to you.

Be Well~*
Master's dorei



SusanofO -> RE: Pondering "Real" vs. "Fake"... (3/6/2007 10:28:06 PM)

Yes, I think Piceans (and Scorpios, and possibly Cancers too) have some of the best, most reliable intution on the planet (but I admit I am predjudiced). Distance is probably better (emotionally) if one can manage it, until someone has proved reliable (easy to say, but sometimes...well it does make sense).

I think there are many real people, well-intentioned people here. I am not letting one bad apple spoil the barrel, and it doesn't sound like the OP is either. But it is very unfortunate that it happened to her (or anyone). 

Maybe one cannot tell how "real" or "fake" someone is, until having been with them a while (like months and months). I'd been w/my ex-Dominant over a year, when he turned on me (but don't want to re-hash that, I'm over it and don't want to discuss it).

Although I really do believe there are many men who are never going to consider pounding on a female, bdsm-oriented or not (non-consensually, that is).

People like that will "get theirs" in the end. He is going to end up old and lonely and I dunno, I am just glad we never have to see eachother on a regular basis again. Good luck to the OP. I know how much that situation (or one like it, sounds like), can suck.

If he really physically harmed you non-consensually, or financially screwed you over, get a lawyer. There are some that operate "pro-bono" (for free) and who might help you.

My sis is an attorney - and when she found out my ex-Dom beat me to a pulp and almost broke my ribs, and pushed me down a flight of stairs, she insisted I prosecute (or she threatened to tell my father, and I didn't want that, so I sued him in court, and got a restraining order. He got fined $500, too. No jail time - he'd never done that before.) But he could have killed me, and my body was screwed up for weeks afterward.

If the OP's Dom did anything similar, maybe consider legal action. I would never have pursued it if my sister hadn't insisted, but in retrospect, my guess is he'll think twice before ever doing that to someone else, again, so am glad I did. 

- Susan



OfDarkInnocence -> RE: Pondering "Real" vs. "Fake"... (3/6/2007 11:06:01 PM)

By the way, I have been on CollarMe for 14 months. This is merely a new profile due to a change of ownership, obviously. ::smiles:: Just thought I'd better say that before you discount my words because I have seemingly been here a short time!

Blessings A/all... and yes, do follow your heart. Sometimes the heart has greater reasoning than our minds.



Attendedkarma -> RE: Pondering "Real" vs. "Fake"... (3/6/2007 11:11:26 PM)

whoooooo hooooooo more piscenians.............and HAPPY BIRTHDAY TO ME [:D][:D][:D][:D][:D][:D][:D][:D][:D][:D][:D][:D][:D][:D]



WhiplashSmile -> RE: Pondering "Real" vs. "Fake"... (3/6/2007 11:53:07 PM)

I would only be able to give personal references to my character at this point in time.  The last 12 years of my life were occupied with two long term relationships. Oh yeah, I can see it now, having somebody from this site contact either one of them.  Yes, I was in vanilla with shades of BDSM. 

I could give a list of friends, and people which know me.  I would provide enough information for somebody to run a background check on me.  I don't have a police record, don't one.  But I'll provide the person with enough information to check me out.  I'm not handing that info out all at once right away.

Yes, I'm into BDSM.. and it's always been a part of my life.  Different degrees.  Hell, some of my past BDSM based relationships I've had, I have lost contact with altogether.  One is Married, Another one last I knew became a stripper and she got married, then divorced.    

I just don't do BDSM with every Jane, Mary and Judy I encounter or see.  I tend to only play with those, I am involved with.   I don't like to play with complete strangers, thank god I've turned some of them, because they were nut jobs to begin with...

I am as Real as Real can get.  I don't have a portfolio to show you, but I will be open about my experiences, good and bad. How I was drawn into BDSM, things which appeal to me and don't.  Talk about limits and activities... Hell, I might even exchange fantasies.  I'm open to message exchange, followed by a little chat, if it seems good, go phone... if that goes good.. meet in public somewhere... if that goes good.. then perhap meet in private in a neutral territory...  You get the idea!  I'm in no rush to do Hard Core Play right away either.  It take trust and time to develop a relationship.    Everything needs to evol, not some speedy Rush to get into things.  Hell, I want to know what the Hell I am getting into.  I want to make certain the other person know what they are getting into as well.

I really don't think much has changed in 12 years.  I started doing BDSM things when I was 13 years old, I'm 41 now, the last 12 were playing around trying to figure out the vanilla world.  Yikes!! I've come running back.  I'm glad I am home again!..

No place like home!



azzmaster -> RE: Pondering "Real" vs. "Fake"... (3/7/2007 12:39:53 AM)

most people are pretty self involved... so we tend2 see "real" people as those ost like us and who share the same values, style, manners, way of speaking etc etc and tend to see people who do not act like us as "fake"the downside of BDSM however is there are alot more manipulative people that get involved... not for the sake of exploring their dominance or submission, but momre exploitive reasons. caution is always advised



Quivver -> RE: Pondering "Real" vs. "Fake"... (3/7/2007 2:34:07 AM)

~Real~ is something I pondered for a long long time. 
What ingredients have to be present to make something ~real~ vary with each of us.
What I came to after years of following the band wagon is no different then saying your
kink isn't my kink, it's just your real isn't mine.  So often people point fingers in shame
as they shake and call someone ~Fake~.  Yet, many times it's simply an unmet need
the other can not provide.  Sure there are those only out for them, but they walk the same
way in the Nilla world. 

In my personal experience what I've seen in me when I want to scream ~fake~ has
been a perception problem.  My problem, that is.  I have perceived an emotional
safe spot.  My trade or exchange for my emotional safely being that I'm female is paid
sexually.  Something I think happens any time a heterosexual relationship moves beyond
a simple experience.  As I gain what I perceive ~real~ my limits fall away with the pieces
of the self protective coating I wear.  The energy exchange when I find Someone I can be
myself with, no holes barred (no pun intended) is intoxicating.  And this is the time where
confusion can sneak in and create havoc.  Havoc feeds on thoughts of ~fake~. 

I honestly think the only weapon we have to battle ~fake~ and keep ~real~ alive is
our words that we form into questions.  The answers for the most part need to come
by action rather then more words.  Words are cheap when they are used as a reply.
It's hard sometimes to ask the right questions, sometimes the right question is one we
  don'tknow to ask.  But it's those questions and answers that keep things ~Real~. 

Great Post, your wisdom is beyond your years..........





BeachMystress -> RE: Pondering "Real" vs. "Fake"... (3/7/2007 3:02:47 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: azzmaster

most people are pretty self involved... so we tend2 see "real" people as those ost like us and who share the same values, style, manners, way of speaking etc etc and tend to see people who do not act like us as "fake"the downside of BDSM however is there are alot more manipulative people that get involved... not for the sake of exploring their dominance or submission, but momre exploitive reasons. caution is always advised

This is exactly what I was composing in my mind as I read the thread. I was going to elaborate more, but I think he's said it concisely enough that I don't need to add to it. I'm just surprised I'm agreeing with azzmaster. Does this mean he is real?[8D]



toservez -> RE: Pondering "Real" vs. "Fake"... (3/7/2007 8:46:48 AM)

If you ask a person to define fake they will probably include words like fraud and liar. When the word fake is often used on the board or in messages on the other side it is in a person did or did not do something that did not go how I wanted it to. So whenever I see the term fake, to me the definition I use for myself is a person using it as a generic put down/negative acting out of frustration thing.

I found very little trouble finding sincere people who I found respecting and interesting on the message boards or on the other side when I was looking. Human connections and trusting of others is not some tangible things that can be typed out and case closed. People who thump their chest telling the world how “real” they are at best looking for a shortcut to move along a potential relationship and at worst have shown low IQ points and not shown the capability to communicate in some way there understanding of what it takes to be “real” to the other person which is about time and actions and not statements.

I also find this obsession with references not that hot as well. I really am less interested that you have friends in the local community and play nice with them but how you are with a person when we are together alone which is only 99% of the time. So references outside of former submissives who lived with the person do not do me much good.

Connections come from effort and communications. Those willing to do both and in an effective way will always have a much better chance of finding a “real” person for a relationship or friendship as opposed to the many who are looking for something with little effort, poor communication skills and wanting it as soon as possible and not when it is right.



innatedesire -> RE: Pondering "Real" vs. "Fake"... (3/7/2007 8:56:59 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: azzmaster

most people are pretty self involved... so we tend2 see "real" people as those ost like us and who share the same values, style, manners, way of speaking etc etc and tend to see people who do not act like us as "fake"the downside of BDSM however is there are alot more manipulative people that get involved... not for the sake of exploring their dominance or submission, but momre exploitive reasons. caution is always advised


Very well said!!



azzmaster -> RE: Pondering "Real" vs. "Fake"... (3/7/2007 9:03:01 AM)

i run n2 alot of subs with major issues that basically come from dealing with some doms who were out 2 exploit rather than guide and protect. takes them awhile 2 trust and i try 2 b patient with that



Mysti -> RE: Pondering "Real" vs. "Fake"... (3/7/2007 9:11:19 AM)

I'm real in the sense that I am a living breathing human being, not merely a phantom with exceptional typing skills. Where I am experience wise and identity wise within the BDSM Lifestyle I'm sure makes me fake to some, and very real to others. I chose not to fit into any preconcieved "labels" and only label myself on my profile becuase CM states I have to.

We always hear "from a lifestyle thats supposed to be so accepting of alternative kinks and choices, we sure are closed minded".
It makes me laugh because yes, we have all the fun, and the hot clothes and the great sex, but underneath the corsets and chest harnesses we are human beings that will judge anything. I'm not universally accepting of all kinks. I think some of y'all are freaks, but I also have the common sense to respect you for it and keep my opinions to myself and not think any less of you as a human being.

And now I'm rambling so I'll stop now



OfDarkInnocence -> RE: Pondering "Real" vs. "Fake"... (3/7/2007 11:52:02 AM)

Wow, thank you A/all for such great responses. ::smile:: It is very true... what is "real" is very relative to us as individuals, and we do tend to judge others based on our own realities, desires, kinks, needs, etc. We call people fakes because they don't fit into what we feel is right or ultimately good. We are all different people. No one is right exclusively and the only wrongs are when something surpasses the realm of what is safe, sane, and consensual. That is the beauty of life, and this lifestyle. There is no one way to live, and there is no one way to practice D/s. Thank gods for that, too. We need to remember that for each of us, there does exist somewhere a very ideal and almost perfect situation/relationship. By not being willing to compromise along the way to finding that, it makes us in fact more honest and true to ourselves and our own path. We are not, by doing so, trying to make those around us miserable by considering them and then deciding it is not what we desire.

Personally, I don't just want a D/s relationship. I don't just want scenes, sex, kink, etc. I refuse to compromise or just be whatever someone desires me to be so I can find a situation that works but isn't exactly what I wanted or need. I cannot truly serve someone that I do not absolutely respect and adore on every level. I want the deep relationship, the absolute trust, the mutual respect and open communication. Sometimes I feel so many people, Dominants and submissives alike, get in such a hurry that they set their standards far lower than they should be. There is no need to settle, ever! There are many wonderful people in this world, and if you approach it with the right attitude and patience (and you yourself are whole and have something to really offer) you will find them.

Another word of wisdom... be very careful of those you might discount or disregard based on one factor or another. Reality is relative, and you really do need to get a feel for an entire person before you make any assumptions or judgements. In my case, I have a beautiful and amazing Mentor who I can't imagine not having in my life. I am learning so very much from her. On first, second, third thoughts I didn't imagine we'd ever be compatible on most levels. But she is now probably one of the only Dominants I would currently consider trusting my life and heart to. Sometimes we need to give situations time. Sometimes we just need to get to know people, with no immediate expectations involved whatsoever. The way I see it, in the very least I will have invested in a friendship.

Blessings...




hereyesruponyou -> RE: Pondering "Real" vs. "Fake"... (3/7/2007 12:22:03 PM)

The only people I feel are fake are the ones who make promises and don't keep them. I've had several friends hurt by people who have played them oh too well. I've been called a fake myself because i don't cam or give out my personal info immediately, and by people who just kinda gave me that "uh oh" vibe. Gotta let it roll off the back. I know there are some who go amazingly far to reach a certain point (getting you to watch their cam etc) and the more you say no the more they try to seem "real", then when they get what they wanted all along, they go poof. But as has been said here before, it's no different than any other site. The anonymity of the internet encourages this more with some people. We live, we learn



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