RE: Happy Europeans Are A Riot

RE: Happy Europeans Are A Riot (Full Version)

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pahunkboy -> RE: Happy Europeans Are A Riot (3/4/2007 6:04:22 AM)
Our small town has a homeless shelter- I volunteered many times to do the overnight. a % of them- put em on a greyhound bus- and it is the next towns problem. meanwhile- thats same town, puts a throwaway person on the bus- to arrive in your town. the US got rid of alot of mental health programs. so now a portion is in jails/ a portion lives on greyhound buses/ a portion live on teh street- Blame the victem.... police know that businesses pay their salary, not the homeless. so of course- they jump to the tune of the business community. Think it is bad now? you aint seen nothing yet! mark my words. 20 years from now- jails will be needed- and it all will backfire. the ruling elite dont care- they live in gated communities- with guards......

Sanity -> RE: Happy Europeans Are A Riot (3/4/2007 6:08:22 AM)
The police aren't the heavy-handed ones, meat. The police aren't the ones who are torching cars, schools, and other buildings - your beloved anarchists are. This, in one of the most Liberal countries on the planet!!! How long can these radical Leftists go on literally biting the hands that feed them before the Socialist States of Europe finally say "enough"? It looks like it's finally beginning to happen. quote: ORIGINAL: meatcleaver You're trying to make a big thing out of a little thing. I support the Ungdomshuset squat because it is an experiment in an alternative life style which is the reason for most of its support from none residents. You will find that many bourgeois Danish folk didn't have a problem with it. However, when you get a heavy handed government wanting to impose its will at all costs then you get what you get in Danmark. The government has created a rallying point for mainly young people regardless of whether they are left ot right. It's no big deal, Europe isn't a fire, its just people out on a jolly. I hope the government gets a bloody nose and I hope the squatters take the Danish government to the European court of human rights because the government is making them homeless. I heard about this on the radio but its so big, it doesn't seem to have made any of the papers. British/Dutch/ German or French, well not the internet versions.

Dtesmoac -> RE: Happy Europeans Are A Riot (3/4/2007 6:16:38 AM)
Sanity - there is a long way to go before many Europen nations will start to move further towards the American Model. It may be that they are realising that they can not afford the provisions of the last 20 years but do not expect them to transform into the "me first formost and only" approach of American society. The local policing model of some parts of the US is one that I see as being beneficial if brought into the UK. Haveing coparatively large numbers of police devoted tolocal nuisance crime and beahviour does result in a safer feeling in parts of the public spaces and particularly in more affluent areas. Of course I'm not sure if it is helped by the inability of other parts of society to reach these areas.

Sanity -> RE: Happy Europeans Are A Riot (3/4/2007 6:25:28 AM)
They can't afford their pie-in-the-sky Socialism, but if they try to turn back towards reality there are riots. Looks like they're pretty much screwed! quote: ORIGINAL: Dtesmoac Sanity - there is a long way to go before many Europen nations will start to move further towards the American Model. It may be that they are realising that they can not afford the provisions of the last 20 years but do not expect them to transform into the "me first formost and only" approach of American society. The local policing model of some parts of the US is one that I see as being beneficial if brought into the UK. Haveing coparatively large numbers of police devoted tolocal nuisance crime and beahviour does result in a safer feeling in parts of the public spaces and particularly in more affluent areas. Of course I'm not sure if it is helped by the inability of other parts of society to reach these areas.

Dtesmoac -> RE: Happy Europeans Are A Riot (3/4/2007 6:54:40 AM)
Go look around the US. I travelled 5000 miles on a recnt round trip for work and saw levels of squalor and depravation that at times are thrid world. I dealt with people that have little or no health care, found capable people that because they do not have a bit of paper with college education on it are not advanced into better paying jobs and kids with $ 000s of dept who have bits of paper saying college but were actually f#+g useless and others whos moms and dads had paid who were even worse. The MBAs many had should be given out with cereal packets. The amount of human potential that is wasted in the US is enormous. Whilst there are hotspots of tallent in to many parts of the country there is mediocraty that has an expectation of aquirng wealth. The same applies in many parts of Europe the real argument is should a capital invetment for "Country X" be based upon a corporate business plan or should every person go off and try and fund every little item locally and then hope it makes sense and comes together as a coherent plan. Health Care, Education, Transport Infrastructure, Safety Net are about the macro econmics and competitiveness of the country. Best available for most cost effective investment....... The US health care system is about people without the knowledge getting shafted whislt to many others make too much money and a large number of people get nothing and so their productivity falls. Neither Europe or America has it right but European model is closer.

sleazy -> RE: Happy Europeans Are A Riot (3/4/2007 6:55:15 AM)
The story does not really confirm it, but generally a squat is a building that is unlawfully occupied. Therefore it matters not if they were leftists, rightists or martians, there was no reason why they should not have been evicted. The lack of anywhere to live is a moot point if the Danish welfare system really is that good.

Dtesmoac -> RE: Happy Europeans Are A Riot (3/4/2007 7:20:52 AM)
I'm not sure of the squatting laws in Denmark but on the whole I agree with you. In most Western European Countries there are options for places to live, in the US it seems to be go live in a trailer park - in the UK you may not want to move to some of the social housing areas but there are other alternatives to squats for many. But short term for some people squats are the only option, it is when they become longer term that any excuse to being there should stop. And any degree of damage should result in immediate eviction. That should also apply to squatting on land as well as in buildings.

Sanity -> RE: Happy Europeans Are A Riot (3/4/2007 7:52:26 AM)
Venezuela is getting rid of all THEIR pesky rich people. http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070303/ap_on_bi_ge/venezuelan_flight_1 Maybe all those Leftist squatters can go THERE and find their little slice of heaven!

Dtesmoac -> RE: Happy Europeans Are A Riot (3/4/2007 8:00:36 AM)
Look at Zimbawi for a real colapse of a country. Venezuala may go the same way. I have no problem with Rich people and he opporunity to aquire wealth. I simply believe that the American Dream of going from poverty to Affluence is far from the reality for most but that the system appears to be too focussed on individual wealth creation rather than wider wealth generation. The European squaters wouldn't cooe in Venezuela they require liberal laws on enforcement to protect them.

meatcleaver -> RE: Happy Europeans Are A Riot (3/4/2007 9:10:18 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Sanity They can't afford their pie-in-the-sky Socialism, but if they try to turn back towards reality there are riots. Looks like they're pretty much screwed! You are reading something into the situation that isn't there. The Ungdomshuset squat has been going on since the middle of the sixties, the building that has been evicted has been occupied by squatters since 1982. It is internationally famous amongst European youth and alternative life stylers. This isn't about lack of housing, it is about people wanting to opt out, its more hippydom than socialism. http://news.independent.co.uk/europe/article2326223.ece

sleazy -> RE: Happy Europeans Are A Riot (3/4/2007 9:53:35 AM)
So why should such people be allowed to inflict their hippydom on others who want no part of it? According the OP they were told to leave years ago and have had plenty chance to go find somewhere else to drop out of society. Its not being hippy, its being an anarchist sod you I dont care kind of person. Perhaps they should set up camp in the homes of some of the more liberal types and see how long such people remain quite so liberal

meatcleaver -> RE: Happy Europeans Are A Riot (3/4/2007 10:16:15 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: sleazy So why should such people be allowed to inflict their hippydom on others who want no part of it? According the OP they were told to leave years ago and have had plenty chance to go find somewhere else to drop out of society. Its not being hippy, its being an anarchist sod you I dont care kind of person. Perhaps they should set up camp in the homes of some of the more liberal types and see how long such people remain quite so liberal I suppose you could ask why should people inflict their bourgeois values on them? Both sides are doing the imposing. The city council has been happy for the squat to be there for decades and allow a community to grow and now they want to destroy it. If they didn't want a community there and the solidarity that brings, they shouldn't have allowed it in the first place.

Sanity -> RE: Happy Europeans Are A Riot (3/4/2007 10:30:13 AM)
The Associated Press called them Anarchists, Leftists, and Punk Rockers. You call them Hippydomers. I think I'll go with what the AP says, if you don't mind. But regardless of what we choose to call them, if they want to "opt out" as you say, why is it that they deserve to have anything just given to them. So they've been there since 1982 - they've obviously worn out their welcome, and so now their rent is due. quote: ORIGINAL: meatcleaver You are reading something into the situation that isn't there. The Ungdomshuset squat has been going on since the middle of the sixties, the building that has been evicted has been occupied by squatters since 1982. It is internationally famous amongst European youth and alternative life stylers. This isn't about lack of housing, it is about people wanting to opt out, its more hippydom than socialism. http://news.independent.co.uk/europe/article2326223.ece

meatcleaver -> RE: Happy Europeans Are A Riot (3/4/2007 11:16:16 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Sanity The Associated Press called them Anarchists, Leftists, and Punk Rockers. You call them Hippydomers. I think I'll go with what the AP says, if you don't mind. But regardless of what we choose to call them, if they want to "opt out" as you say, why is it that they deserve to have anything just given to them. So they've been there since 1982 - they've obviously worn out their welcome, and so now their rent is due. The building in question which was built as a community youth centre and owned by the council, in a working class area so the squatters have never occupied anyone's private property. When they originally squatted the building it was vacant and being left to fall into disrepair. I don't see a problem of people utilizing a building left abandoned. The problem started when the council wanted to unabandon it after years of not caring what happened to it.

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