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Simply a slave? - 1/21/2007 2:56:08 PM

julietsierra

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"The idea of a slave bride is a beautifull thing. Of course, this makes her more than simply a slave."

This was in another thread and I thought I'd just ask people...

Is this how you perceive those who claim and who you might call "slave?"

juliet

Post #: 1

RE: Simply a slave? - 1/21/2007 3:39:38 PM

adaddysgirl

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i didn't see the thread you are referring to but if a submissive is somehow less than a slave, and now a slave is less than a 'slave bride'....i guess it's all that same kind of reasoning. So is this the latest hierarchy?

So many have said a sub is less committed than a slave. So now is a slave bride more committed than a mere slave? Is this now the ultimate in submission? Sorry, but i really have to get a chuckle out of all this....people defining others based on the dynamics of their relationships. Where does it end?

DG

< Message edited by adaddysgirl -- 1/21/2007 3:40:40 PM >

(in reply to julietsierra)

Post #: 2

RE: Simply a slave? - 1/21/2007 3:47:40 PM

julietsierra

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quote:

ORIGINAL: adaddysgirl

i didn't see the thread you are referring to but if a submissive is somehow less than a slave, and now a slave is less than a 'slave bride'....i guess it's all that same kind of reasoning. So is this the latest hierarchy?

So many have said a sub is less committed than a slave. So now is a slave bride more committed than a mere slave? Is this now the ultimate in submission? Sorry, but i really have to get a chuckle out of all this....people defining others based on the dynamics of their relationships. Where does it end?

DG

I was struck by the inference of inconsequentiality. That might not be how the person meant it, but that's what struck me.

And I was comparing that against the expressions that I see submissives/slaves making regarding their relationships.

I don't think I was thinking about it being a hierarchical thing, but there you go - one person's statement can mean so many things to others who read it.

juliet

(in reply to adaddysgirl)

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RE: Simply a slave? - 1/21/2007 3:51:58 PM

DominaSmartass

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I think you might have misread what the OP meant. "more than simply a slave" is not the same as saying "more than a simple slave" (or mere) I'm not saying that being a slave is simply anything, I think being a slave is one of the most amazing things a person can be in life, but I do understand (I think) what the person was trying to say, maybe that being someone's slave and spouse entails something different? But then again I haven't seen the OP you referred to so I have no idea.

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(in reply to julietsierra)

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RE: Simply a slave? - 1/21/2007 4:06:43 PM

adaddysgirl

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It is kinda hard to tell based on that one sentence, and since i obviously did not read that other thread. But in regards to this OP, i guess i am not getting what is meant by a slave bride is more than simply a slave. i could see if someone says it is different than being a slave then perhaps giving some examples of support....but i never do quite understand what being 'more' means. Do you? lol

DG

(in reply to DominaSmartass)

Post #: 5

RE: Simply a slave? - 1/21/2007 4:07:34 PM

goodpet

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The statement "... this makes her more then simply a slave. " is a valid one.

I am a slave and live it 24/7 inside and out, upside and down.. and... my Owner and i are domestic partners. Being in the spouse or domestic partner role adds to the dynamics then when our relationship was "simply" Owner and slave. It does not mean less then or better then, only that there is more to it now.

I think the OP has a good question and did not imply anything negative.

My perception of a slave is my view of myself, which gets me in trouble when i project that on others who call themsleves slaves too. i hold myself to a very high standard and often project that on other, (regardless of their title: slave, submissive, bottom, Dom, Top, Master or gender or date of purchase).

i have what i expect of myself in the slave role/relationship in my mind and i get in trouble when i expect others using the title to have somewhat the same standard. Many do not, but that is OK, since that is their standards for what they feel is right for their relationships.

This is not to say i am better then anyone, or my standards are correct. They are mine.

(in reply to julietsierra)

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RE: Simply a slave? - 1/21/2007 4:16:08 PM

cariad

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From: Calgary, Alberta
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quote:

The statement "... this makes her more then simply a slave. " is a valid one.

I am a slave and live it 24/7 inside and out, upside and down.. and... my Owner and i are domestic partners. Being in the spouse or domestic partner role adds to the dynamics then when our relationship was "simply" Owner and slave. It does not mean less then or better then, only that there is more to it now.

I think the OP has a good question and did not imply anything negative.

My perception of a slave is my view of myself, which gets me in trouble when i project that on others who call themsleves slaves too. i hold myself to a very high standard and often project that on other, (regardless of their title: slave, submissive, bottom, Dom, Top, Master or gender or date of purchase).

i have what i expect of myself in the slave role/relationship in my mind and i get in trouble when i expect others using the title to have somewhat the same standard. Many do not, but that is OK, since that is their standards for what they feel is right for their relationships.

This is not to say i am better then anyone, or my standards are correct. They are mine.

i too have my version of being a slave and have gotten in trouble for "projecting" my views of what a slave should be or should not be on others.

We all have our own idea of what the "Perfect slave," should or should not be. i recently did an essay for my Mentor and He read it, promised to help me achieve the goals i wish to achieve and told me that i did very good job with the essay.

i will not project my ideals of a slave/submissive on anyone but i have lived it 24/7 before and although it is hard at times i did my best and that's all any of us can do.

to the OP: perhaps clarifying your question or post so that others are not confused by it may help get some more varied responses...best of luck to you on your query.

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(in reply to goodpet)

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RE: Simply a slave? - 1/21/2007 4:21:57 PM

adaddysgirl

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quote:

ORIGINAL: goodpet

The statement "... this makes her more then simply a slave. " is a valid one.

I am a slave and live it 24/7 inside and out, upside and down.. and... my Owner and i are domestic partners. Being in the spouse or domestic partner role adds to the dynamics then when our relationship was "simply" Owner and slave. It does not mean less then or better then, only that there is more to it now.

So i guess this is the part i am trying to understand. How is there more to it now? (in your relationship of course)

DG

(in reply to goodpet)

Post #: 8

RE: Simply a slave? - 1/21/2007 4:26:51 PM

ownedgirlie

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My views seem to be different than the views of others. Sure, "simply a slave" works for me because to me a wife is of a more equal stature than a slave is. I am not his equal. A wife is his equal. I am simply his slave, and I will never be more than simply his slave.

I do not view this as a negative. I think it is wonderfully positive, in fact. Because being his slave holds me to a much, much higher standard in his eyes than being his wife. In turn, being his wife could be referred to as "simply his wife," as she will never achieve for him the things I do.

If whomever wrote what you quoted meant that in a derogatory way, it affects me not, as it has no bearing whatsoever on my situation and on my views and beliefs. I've been referred to as far worse because I am a slave. The only opinion that truly matters to me is his. Being "simply his slave" is the greatest, most difficult, most fulfilling and rewarding feat I have yet to accomplish in my life.

I see a lot of people get sucked into the compare and compete thing around here. I never really understood it. If one is true to oneself...does anyone else's opinion really matter? Someone may as well tell me I suck at my job. Well unless they work with me and have seen what I do and what I am capable of, what merit does such an opinion have? Let it go, I say, let it go!

(in reply to julietsierra)

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RE: Simply a slave? - 1/21/2007 4:30:15 PM

BeingChewsie

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Well in my case it would be valid. I am simply his slave..not his lover, not his girlfriend, not his wife..just his slave..so if by some MIRACLE, he decided to marry me and make me something other than just his slave..I'd be more than simply a slave..I'd be his wife too.

quote:

ORIGINAL: julietsierra

"The idea of a slave bride is a beautifull thing. Of course, this makes her more than simply a slave."

This was in another thread and I thought I'd just ask people...

Is this how you perceive those who claim and who you might call "slave?"

juliet

_____________________________

"In fact, it is my contention that most women are accepting of way less than optimal circumstance constantly, and are lucky to be 'snagged' by the right man, if ever. But it is more by happy accident than by their design. "
~Ron and Hup

(in reply to julietsierra)

Post #: 10

RE: Simply a slave? - 1/21/2007 4:30:17 PM

bandit25

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Kudos

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RE: Simply a slave? - 1/21/2007 4:38:19 PM

BRNaughtyAngel

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I must have missed the thread where that was posted, but the only thing I can think of that he/she may have been implying is that as his wife and his slave, the committment between them now adds the legalities of marriage to their dynamic.

Look at the recent posts in threads in the sub/slave forum where ladies were released from long term relationships without a hint that it was coming. Not that this doesn't happen in marriages, but obviously ending a marriage is more complicated than just kicking your slave to the curb. I know it's not the case for everyone, but perhaps they just consider it a deeper level of committment to the relationship? (don't pounce on me for that, I'm just sayin')

I dunno if that's what they meant or not. *shrugs*

(in reply to ownedgirlie)

Post #: 12

RE: Simply a slave? - 1/21/2007 4:44:23 PM

KnightofMists

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no one is just simply a slave

they could be woman, man, son, daughter, father, mother, employer, employee, friend, lover, husband, wife, partner, confident, and I am sure the list goes on.

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An Optimal relationship is achieved when the individuals do what is best for themselves and their relationship.

(in reply to julietsierra)

Post #: 13

RE: Simply a slave? - 1/21/2007 5:06:12 PM

adaddysgirl

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Well i just went and read that thread (it's only one page). The post that juliet is referring to says just that one line....with no further comment. But it gets better. A subsequent post says : makes her more than a slave?
Makes her more the slave!

Now, i can see where someone says it makes her his wife in addition to his slave.....so that makes her more than his slave in that sense....she now carries an additional title, so to speak. But i'm not getting the 'makes her more slave' or 'there's more to it now' comments and probably won't unless those posters can give me more of an idea of what they mean.

DG

(in reply to BRNaughtyAngel)

Post #: 14

RE: Simply a slave? - 1/21/2007 8:15:53 PM

Wildfleurs

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From: Connecticut
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quote:

ORIGINAL: julietsierra

"The idea of a slave bride is a beautifull thing. Of course, this makes her more than simply a slave."

This was in another thread and I thought I'd just ask people...

Is this how you perceive those who claim and who you might call "slave?"

juliet

I would guess that what he meant is that a slave bride would be more than just a slave it would be slave + wife. By more than I mean more labels, more things layering onto being a slave (i.e. being a wife and the legal and societal implications). I didn't take it to mean more as in greater than a slave.

C~

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The heart of it all - http://www.wildfleurs.com
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(in reply to julietsierra)

Post #: 15

RE: Simply a slave? - 1/21/2007 8:18:27 PM

Wildfleurs

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ownedgirlie
I see a lot of people get sucked into the compare and compete thing around here. I never really understood it. If one is true to oneself...does anyone else's opinion really matter? Someone may as well tell me I suck at my job. Well unless they work with me and have seen what I do and what I am capable of, what merit does such an opinion have? Let it go, I say, let it go!

I agree with this, and I've seen it plenty of places besides collarme. I think it has more to do with security in position, place, and identity more than anything else.

C~

P.S. Sorry for the diversion from the original topic but I did want to acknowledge and comment on... ownedgirlie's comment on this.

_____________________________

"Just because you've always done it that way doesn't mean it's not incredibly stupid." -despair.com

~~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
The heart of it all - http://www.wildfleurs.com
~~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~

(in reply to ownedgirlie)

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RE: Simply a slave? - 1/21/2007 8:28:09 PM

LuckyAlbatross

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We all know this is how it goes in the bdsm heirarchy (from lowest to highest):

switch
bugs
lizards
service top
top
bottom
dominant
sex submissive
submissive
masochistic submissive
polyamorous masochistic submissive
master
slave
masochistic slave
polyamorous masochistic slave
TRUE polyamorous masochistic slave
REAL polyamorous masochistic slave
slut
wife who pretends to be a slave whenever convenient for the husband

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Post #: 17

RE: Simply a slave? - 1/21/2007 8:37:48 PM

juliaoceania

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From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
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quote:

ORIGINAL: julietsierra

"The idea of a slave bride is a beautifull thing. Of course, this makes her more than simply a slave."

This was in another thread and I thought I'd just ask people...

Is this how you perceive those who claim and who you might call "slave?"

juliet

To be completely honest I perceive them the same as I do myself in many ways. There are a few here I know that think much differently about their relationships than I think about mine, not a measure of commitment, I have no words for it... they just think differently (and I respect these individuals greatly btw, and I think they know who they are

).

Most of the time when people say the word slave they say it with the thought that slaves are more this or more that than submissives... mostly it is all in label from what I can see... and I have zero clue how someone can state that one person is more committed than another because of a freakin label... it seems pretty insecure when I see others do that on here, but that is just my opinion.

I mostly see it just as a words, except in a couple of instances. It really brings nothing to mind to be honest. I think of the terms submissive and slave as almost interchangeable.

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to julietsierra)

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RE: Simply a slave? - 1/21/2007 10:01:07 PM

MasterFireMaam

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I think that the wording might have been dealing with the complexities of a wife+slave relationship. As an analogy, a cake is a cake. But, you can make one kind of cake (let's say chocolate chocolate chip) or another kind (angel food). One cake is simpiler in texture and flavor, but it's not any less delicious. Having someone who is both wife and slave can be a more complex relationship emotionally and legally than someone who is a wife or someone who is a slave. None are better than the other. Simplicity isn't necessarily a rank.

Kinda see where I'm going?

Master Fire

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RE: Simply a slave? - 1/21/2007 10:23:28 PM

Noah

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quote:

ORIGINAL: BeingChewsie

Well in my case it would be valid. I am simply his slave..not his lover, not his girlfriend, not his wife..just his slave..so if by some MIRACLE, he decided to marry me and make me something other than just his slave..I'd be more than simply a slave..I'd be his wife too.

I'm confused.

Is "wife" the only thing that destroys the purity of the "simple slave"'s status or do other things destroy it just as well?

If he orders you to shine his shoes, do you become more than just a slave? His Shoeshine boy, too? If he orders you to clean his house do you become more than just his slave? His housekeeper too?If he orders you to get him a glass of water do you become more than just his slave? His Watergetter too?

So if he orders you to marry hime, and yo obey, yes, you become his wife. Once person calls this more than just a slave. Another person (above, and also very confoundingly to me) calls it eversomuch less than a slave.

And what about the woman who has been a wife along, and only latterly becomes enslaved to the man she married perhaps years before? Is she forbidden by circumstances (or at least by some theories flying around in this thread) form ever having the experience of simply being a slave, since she bears the awful stain or golden aura (depending upon whom you listen to) of being a wife?

What's up with this urge to categorize things into and out of slavehood and then to declare the existence of hierarchies?

{Thanks, LA, your post illustrated this point way better than mine}

Why can't a slave who is married to her master simply be a slave who obeyed his command to be married to him, or a wife who was eventually--and very simply--enslaved?

Why must there be two separate pigeonholes? Why must their respective "slavehoods" be seen as unequal to that of a slave whose life path hasn't crossed a wedding altar?

(in reply to BeingChewsie)

Post #: 20

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