RE: Partriarch/Matriarch/Mutual D/s

RE: Partriarch/Matriarch/Mutual D/s (Full Version)

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KnightofMists -> RE: Partriarch/Matriarch/Mutual D/s (11/12/2006 8:51:59 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: PiercedDaz Ok, fair point. BUT.... My friend who believes in male superiority is a male Dom and my friend who believes in female superiority is a female Domme. And what about male subs who fill thier profiles claiming that they wish to submit to the superior female sex? I guess you two friends are proof that each other is wrong.... Superiority based on Gender is no different than Racism in my books

daddysprop247 -> RE: Partriarch/Matriarch/Mutual D/s (11/12/2006 8:53:11 AM)
i wouldn't say that i believe in "male superiority", as that implies a mindset that i simply do not have. however D/s for me is one way to live out what i feel to be the natural order. and by that i mean woman, in ultimate submission to man. that's nothing i was ever taught or trained to believe, it's just something that has always made sense and felt right to me. no, i don't feel that ALL women are submissive, or that ALL men are Dominant. there are exceptions to every rule, even within the natural order. but i do feel that male submission and female dominance are anomalies, whereas female submission and male dominance are natural. to use a tired old analogy: giving birth to two separate twin babies...normal, natural. giving birth to conjoined twins...yes it still occured naturally, but it's abnormal...something went wrong in the wiring somewhere. that is how i view femdom/malesub. there was a time in life when i was seriously considering converting to orthodox islam, because of their beliefs on the natural order between man and woman. unfortunately the god part was a bit more difficult to accept, lol. but around that same time i discovered the D/s lifestyle (i discovered D/s before ever knowing what bdsm was, so to me they have always been very very separate and different)....and i discovered that i was not alone in my views, and that i could be in a relationship and live a lifestyle true to my beliefs without having to sacrifice or accept things that i did not believe, as i would have to with any religion. sometimes my Master and i will describe ourselves as traditionalists, to non-lifestylers, because it describes in a very simple way why we believe and live as we do. we believe there is such a thing as a woman's place. we believe in man being the ultimate authority over woman, in woman submitting to man, in woman being the property of man. we don't believe that woman are less valuable or less intelligent that men, not hardly. we are equally valuable within our respective places. He needs me to serve him...i need him to protect and guide me. that is not simply because i am his slave and he is my Master, but because i am "his woman". again, this is not something we feel applies to every soul in the world, not anymore. it's more about getting back to the basics/where we come from and how we got here, and not rejecting gender roles just because that is the politically correct thing to do. i understand it's not a popular view, and i mean no offense to anyone at all, these are just my beliefs, and i have no desire/intention to argue any of it, although open respectful discussion is always nice.

KnightofMists -> RE: Partriarch/Matriarch/Mutual D/s (11/12/2006 8:59:32 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MsKatHouston I do not believe in gender based superiority. Some are and some aren't. I also agree that superiority is not the same as dominance. I have relationships that are not equal as far as power is concerned. But that does not mean I think myself superior to those with whom I am in a relationship. I agree with this.... I also find that no matter what the gender... when they speak as they are of a superior nature than the other gender... I find myself distancing myself from the stink or getting out some really powerful odor spray.

thetammyjo -> RE: Partriarch/Matriarch/Mutual D/s (11/12/2006 9:02:27 AM)
I believe that both males and females can be dominant or submissive, I think most human beings tend toward submissive, a herd mentality. If it appears that males are more dominant I think that is primarily a factor of training and expectation -- not biology and not psychology. In my personal life anyone who would come to me to serve me because I'm female first and foremost will first and foremost be told "no thanks". I have enough differences with other females and enough similaritie with males to know that I am a human being first, just one who happened to be born female too.

KnightofMists -> RE: Partriarch/Matriarch/Mutual D/s (11/12/2006 9:08:31 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: thetammyjo If it appears that males are more dominant I think that is primarily a factor of training and expectation -- not biology and not psychology. I agree... Gender Oppression has been the norm in many cultures through the passage of time. Fortuanately, sometimes to slowly, this gender oppression is being changed to the benefit of society. But, unfortunately there is those that wish to continue this oppressive mentality and those that wish to actions of vindication on the past. Neither is good for a healthy culture.

thetammyjo -> RE: Partriarch/Matriarch/Mutual D/s (11/12/2006 9:16:42 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: KnightofMists quote: ORIGINAL: thetammyjo If it appears that males are more dominant I think that is primarily a factor of training and expectation -- not biology and not psychology. I agree... Gender Oppression has been the norm in many cultures through the passage of time. Fortuanately, sometimes to slowly, this gender oppression is being changed to the benefit of society. But, unfortunately there is those that wish to continue this oppressive mentality and those that wish to actions of vindication on the past. Neither is good for a healthy culture. I completely agree. I was so sad this weekend when it was reported on the news that the rate of girls involvement in violent gang behavior had increased at 30X the rate of boys. On the one hand, HURRAY they aren't just sexual objects but on the other hand BOO for just falling into the trap of violence, anger and hatred. I can write stories set in matriarchical worlds but in them both people stretch to get beyond those confines to some degree. I think that how we are raised is a HUGE factor in our lives and our societies will always limit us so my stories never have completely happy endings (at least not to me).

toservez -> RE: Partriarch/Matriarch/Mutual D/s (11/12/2006 9:24:30 AM)
On the whole a higher percentage of males are more dominant then a percentage of females but superiority has zero to do with it. Judging another person inferior let alone a gender or a group is just lame. Now I do think you see things like this in this life but I often chalk it up to fantasy role playing between the participating parties and there is nothing wrong with that. For those who truly deeply believe a gender is superior to another then I would suggest there is a self esteem issues at work.

Celeste43 -> RE: Partriarch/Matriarch/Mutual D/s (11/12/2006 11:28:03 AM)
No, I don't believe one sex, or one race, or one ethnic group is inherently superior to another. As far as mutual authority. I like that phrase. He has final decision making authority but I have the ability to choose to agree with his thinking or not. We both have the authority to decide whether or not we will remain in this relationship and if we are individually happy in it.

Kirei -> RE: Partriarch/Matriarch/Mutual D/s (11/12/2006 12:04:14 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: PiercedDaz I am genuinely interested in finding out the general consencus on peoples views of the reasons behind D/s. Do some believe in male superiority? Female superiority? Mutual authority? I personally believe in mutual authority but know of two people who genuinely believe in male/female superiority respectively. I know that this is a very contentious issue that could cause some real disagreements, I'd just like to know your honest personal points of view. Thanks, Daz. The problem is your trying to put it all into a certain specific box, and only given three. I could add a fourth one of trans superiority by saying that because we are apart of both worlds(male&female), yet not fully in both worlds we hold a unique perspective on it. Now do not go assume that I think I'm better than anyone else...I don't think that way. What about the dominants of failed leadership. The ones who followed who they thought were dominant but then turned out to not be dominant at all! Later they might have become dominant just because they never wanted to repeat pervious mistakes, or because it was lacking around them. Now I'm getting outside of gender entirely. While your question is valid, I would ask you are the 3 possibilites you gave the only answers to the question you will accept? ....or are there others that you haven't thought of also valid as well? Your answer not only will determine what you believe the lifestyle to be, but will also define how you see it and live it as well. Koneko

ExSteelAgain -> RE: Partriarch/Matriarch/Mutual D/s (11/12/2006 1:20:53 PM)
You can get into all kinds of definitions of strength and superiority. I know a female submissive who is one of the strongest and most superior people I know. She has a full time, high pressure career, attends classes for a PhD Saturdays and Sundays all day and raises two young kids, essentially alone. That takes strength and superior character.

Sub03 -> RE: Partriarch/Matriarch/Mutual D/s (11/12/2006 1:57:02 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: kyraofMists quote: ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY But, regardless of "dominance" it's not about "Superiority" at all. I agree. We each have our own strengths and mine are best exhibited in a relationship through submission and his are best exhibited through dominance. This does not make me inferior to him, just different. Knight's kyra I agree

prettiekitten -> RE: Partriarch/Matriarch/Mutual D/s (11/12/2006 3:50:36 PM)
daddysprop247: What a wonderfully written response. I applaud you for taking the unpopular route.. and I completely agree with you!

Aileen68 -> RE: Partriarch/Matriarch/Mutual D/s (11/12/2006 3:58:01 PM)
I believe in both male superiority and female superiority. I just happen to only be interested in male dominance when it comes to a D/s relationship.

MistressTruth -> RE: Partriarch/Matriarch/Mutual D/s (11/12/2006 5:55:59 PM)
Scientifically it's been proven that there are more than two genders. But as far as male or female superiority goes I think it's pretty much a fantasy in a lot of ways. Basing whether or not someone is superior to another around what their gender is seems silly. There's a lot of not-so-fabulous males and females (and other genders). I'd rather base whether or not I judge superiority on other aspects of a person. I like what MsKatHouston said about how superiority is different than dominance, although a lot of times superiority goes hand-in-hand with it but sometimes not the case.

stef -> RE: Partriarch/Matriarch/Mutual D/s (11/12/2006 6:23:50 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MistressTruth Scientifically it's been proven that there are more than two genders. Really? Scientifically proven by whom? ~stef

MistressTruth -> RE: Partriarch/Matriarch/Mutual D/s (11/12/2006 6:32:54 PM)
You have heard of intersex people right? Read this article for starters. http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/gender/fs.html There's a whole realm of gender studies that often doesn't get talked about, and for good reason. Many people get defensive about the idea that gender is a social construct, and quite often don't want to hear about it. Oh well.

KnightofMists -> RE: Partriarch/Matriarch/Mutual D/s (11/12/2006 6:40:08 PM)
Thanks for providing the link

ExSteelAgain -> RE: Partriarch/Matriarch/Mutual D/s (11/12/2006 6:44:38 PM)
I was willing to buy the third sex, but five is hard to fathom. From your article: "In 1993 I published a modest proposal suggesting that we replace our two-sex system with a five-sex one."

MistressTruth -> RE: Partriarch/Matriarch/Mutual D/s (11/12/2006 6:58:16 PM)
I didn't write the article, my personal viewpoints on the actual quantity of different sexes aren't very solid except that there's more than two. I think the individual that wrote the article probably has a lot more sound evidence behind why the author thinks that there are five sexes that I'd love to hear. It was more or less a way of putting a very limited amount of information out about different sexes, biologically speaking. As far as the number of gender stereotypes go there's many more. Gender is supposedly different than biological sex, which makes a lot of sense to some degree because gender is more of a psychological thing whereas biology is a physiological thing. But then that gets into transgender/transsexual issues... Eh, this is getting off-topic.

stef -> RE: Partriarch/Matriarch/Mutual D/s (11/12/2006 7:32:08 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MistressTruth You have heard of intersex people right? Oh, once or twice. quote: Read this article for starters. http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/gender/fs.html There's a whole realm of gender studies that often doesn't get talked about, and for good reason. Many people get defensive about the idea that gender is a social construct, and quite often don't want to hear about it. Oh well. As someone who would fall into the gender variant pool, I have a great deal of interest in gender studies so I wasn't getting defensive in the least. I was just interested in seeing what that scientific proof was as I hadn't heard of anyone reaching such a conclusion. ~stef

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