quote:

ORIGINAL: BoscoX


Joe and Mary had premarital sex. Mary got pregnant, a sin for which she and Joe would have been stoned to death.

So they made up a fantastic story, and even Jesus was conned. He really believed, right up until the very end...

His final words? "Father, why have you forsaken me?" (Mark 15:34)

quote:

ORIGINAL: BoscoX
Joe and Mary had premarital sex. Mary got pregnant, a sin for which she and Joe would have been stoned to death.

quote:

ORIGINAL: BoscoX


"Still in her fathers house" isn't literal in that sense - it simply means unmarried.

There would have been at the very least shame when Joseph impregnated Mary, as sex during betrothal wasn't permitted.

Do you really believe that God Himself fucked Mary? Did he at least buy her dinner first?

Was there kink involved?

And what were her orgasms like, considering it was God himself who was fucking her.

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ORIGINAL: BoscoX
The simplest explanation is almost always the correct one, and Mary getting laid by God Himself is super complicated.

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And how dare I ask questions, or point out the obvious. "HERESY! BURN HIM at the stake..."

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You believe in sky fairies, and I do not - which explains a lot, especially regarding your blind devotion to your cult. Do you also believe that Mohammad flew to heaven on a winged horse after he died? Or do you only believe in CERTAIN ridiculous fairy tales.

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ORIGINAL: MasterJaguar01

This is just ridiculous in the truest sense of the word.

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ORIGINAL: BoscoX
Again - do you also believe that Mohammad flew to heaven on a winged horse after he died?

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ORIGINAL: MasterJaguar01

NO

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ORIGINAL: BoscoX
As to Jesus, he obviously believed he was the King of the Jews, Old Testament style.

He thought he was destined to lead Israel's epic comeback

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ORIGINAL: MasterJaguar01

Actually, he was specific about NOT being an earthly king at all.
He never got involved in politics at all, and even know. it was politics that would be his end, he did nothing to intervene.

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ORIGINAL: BoscoX

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterJaguar01

Actually, he was specific about NOT being an earthly king at all.
He never got involved in politics at all, and even know. it was politics that would be his end, he did nothing to intervene.

The ancient prophesies make it complicated, but long story short, I didn't post anything about "earthly".

I wrote "Old Testament style".

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterJaguar01

Old Testament Jewish Kings were earthly. Hence my comment.

quote:



Christians often point to several Old Testament prophecies they believe refer to Jesus as the promised Jewish Messiah or King. These prophecies, primarily from the Hebrew Bible (Tanakh), are interpreted by Christians as foreshadowing Jesus’ life, death, and role. Below is a concise overview of key passages commonly cited, with their Jewish and Christian interpretations:Isaiah 7:14 - “Therefore the Lord himself will give you a sign: The virgin will conceive and give birth to a son, and will call him Immanuel.”Christian View: This is seen as a prophecy of Jesus’ virgin birth (Matthew 1:22-23), with “Immanuel” (meaning “God with us”) pointing to his divine nature.
Jewish View: The Hebrew word translated as “virgin” (almah) means “young woman” and may not imply virginity. Jews often see this as referring to a child born in the time of King Ahaz, not a future messiah.

Micah 5:2 - “But you, Bethlehem Ephrathah, though you are small among the clans of Judah, out of you will come for me one who will be ruler over Israel, whose origins are from of old, from ancient times.”Christian View: This is linked to Jesus’ birth in Bethlehem (Matthew 2:1-6), with the “ruler” seen as the Messiah.
Jewish View: This refers to a future Davidic king from Bethlehem, not necessarily divine, and some Jewish interpretations argue it’s about King David himself or a historical figure.

Isaiah 9:6-7 - “For to us a child is born, to us a son is given... He will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace... He will reign on David’s throne...”Christian View: Christians apply this to Jesus, emphasizing his divine titles and eternal kingship.
Jewish View: Many Jews interpret this as referring to King Hezekiah or another Davidic king, with the titles being symbolic of God’s power, not a divine messiah.

Psalm 22 - “My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?... They pierce my hands and my feet... They divide my clothes among them and cast lots for my garment.”Christian View: This is seen as describing Jesus’ crucifixion, including his cry from the cross (Matthew 27:46) and the soldiers casting lots for his clothes (John 19:24).
Jewish View: The psalm is understood as David’s personal suffering, not a messianic prophecy. The “piercing” translation is disputed, with some Jewish scholars arguing it refers to being “like a lion” at his hands and feet.

Isaiah 53 - “He was pierced for our transgressions, he was crushed for our iniquities... By his wounds we are healed... He was led like a lamb to the slaughter...”Christian View: This “Suffering Servant” is interpreted as Jesus, who died for humanity’s sins and was resurrected (Acts 8:32-35).
Jewish View: The servant is often seen as Israel itself or a righteous remnant, suffering for the nations, not an individual messiah.

Daniel 9:24-26 - “Seventy ‘sevens’ are decreed... to anoint the Most Holy Place... An Anointed One will be put to death and will have nothing.”Christian View: The “Anointed One” (Messiah) is Jesus, whose death aligns with the timeline described.
Jewish View: This refers to a historical figure, possibly a high priest or king, and the timeline is debated, often tied to the Second Temple’s destruction.

Zechariah 9:9 - “See, your king comes to you, righteous and victorious, lowly and riding on a donkey...”Christian View: This is fulfilled in Jesus’ triumphal entry into Jerusalem (Matthew 21:5).
Jewish View: This describes a humble Davidic king, not necessarily a divine messiah, and may refer to a historical or future figure.

Context and ConsiderationsChristian Interpretation: These prophecies are seen as fulfilled in Jesus’ birth, life, death, and resurrection, establishing him as the Messiah and King. Early Christians, like the Gospel writers, frequently quoted these passages to support their claims.
Jewish Interpretation: Jewish scholars often argue these verses are either historical, referring to figures like Hezekiah or Israel itself, or describe a future messiah who will restore Israel politically and spiritually, not a divine figure like Jesus.
Translation Issues: Differences in Hebrew-to-Greek (Septuagint) translations, used by early Christians, contribute to interpretive divides (e.g., “virgin” vs. “young woman” in Isaiah 7:14).
Contextual Reading: Jews emphasize reading these passages in their immediate historical context, while Christians often see them as having dual or ultimate fulfillment in Jesus.

quote:

ORIGINAL: BoscoX

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterJaguar01

Old Testament Jewish Kings were earthly. Hence my comment.

You're unaware of the prophesies. Or you're playing stupid? I tried to clarify for you, and for reasons known only to you, you refuse to understand my point.

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt, and try one more time: Here's what Grok said when queried, "Which Old Testament prophesies talk about a Jewish king or whatever that Christians claim was Jesus?"

quote:



Christians often point to several Old Testament prophecies they believe refer to Jesus as the promised Jewish Messiah or King. These prophecies, primarily from the Hebrew Bible (Tanakh), are interpreted by Christians as foreshadowing Jesus’ life, death, and role. Below is a concise overview of key passages commonly cited, with their Jewish and Christian interpretations:Isaiah 7:14 - “Therefore the Lord himself will give you a sign: The virgin will conceive and give birth to a son, and will call him Immanuel.”Christian View: This is seen as a prophecy of Jesus’ virgin birth (Matthew 1:22-23), with “Immanuel” (meaning “God with us”) pointing to his divine nature.
Jewish View: The Hebrew word translated as “virgin” (almah) means “young woman” and may not imply virginity. Jews often see this as referring to a child born in the time of King Ahaz, not a future messiah.

Micah 5:2 - “But you, Bethlehem Ephrathah, though you are small among the clans of Judah, out of you will come for me one who will be ruler over Israel, whose origins are from of old, from ancient times.”Christian View: This is linked to Jesus’ birth in Bethlehem (Matthew 2:1-6), with the “ruler” seen as the Messiah.
Jewish View: This refers to a future Davidic king from Bethlehem, not necessarily divine, and some Jewish interpretations argue it’s about King David himself or a historical figure.

Isaiah 9:6-7 - “For to us a child is born, to us a son is given... He will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace... He will reign on David’s throne...”Christian View: Christians apply this to Jesus, emphasizing his divine titles and eternal kingship.
Jewish View: Many Jews interpret this as referring to King Hezekiah or another Davidic king, with the titles being symbolic of God’s power, not a divine messiah.

Psalm 22 - “My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?... They pierce my hands and my feet... They divide my clothes among them and cast lots for my garment.”Christian View: This is seen as describing Jesus’ crucifixion, including his cry from the cross (Matthew 27:46) and the soldiers casting lots for his clothes (John 19:24).
Jewish View: The psalm is understood as David’s personal suffering, not a messianic prophecy. The “piercing” translation is disputed, with some Jewish scholars arguing it refers to being “like a lion” at his hands and feet.

Isaiah 53 - “He was pierced for our transgressions, he was crushed for our iniquities... By his wounds we are healed... He was led like a lamb to the slaughter...”Christian View: This “Suffering Servant” is interpreted as Jesus, who died for humanity’s sins and was resurrected (Acts 8:32-35).
Jewish View: The servant is often seen as Israel itself or a righteous remnant, suffering for the nations, not an individual messiah.

Daniel 9:24-26 - “Seventy ‘sevens’ are decreed... to anoint the Most Holy Place... An Anointed One will be put to death and will have nothing.”Christian View: The “Anointed One” (Messiah) is Jesus, whose death aligns with the timeline described.
Jewish View: This refers to a historical figure, possibly a high priest or king, and the timeline is debated, often tied to the Second Temple’s destruction.

Zechariah 9:9 - “See, your king comes to you, righteous and victorious, lowly and riding on a donkey...”Christian View: This is fulfilled in Jesus’ triumphal entry into Jerusalem (Matthew 21:5).
Jewish View: This describes a humble Davidic king, not necessarily a divine messiah, and may refer to a historical or future figure.

Context and ConsiderationsChristian Interpretation: These prophecies are seen as fulfilled in Jesus’ birth, life, death, and resurrection, establishing him as the Messiah and King. Early Christians, like the Gospel writers, frequently quoted these passages to support their claims.
Jewish Interpretation: Jewish scholars often argue these verses are either historical, referring to figures like Hezekiah or Israel itself, or describe a future messiah who will restore Israel politically and spiritually, not a divine figure like Jesus.
Translation Issues: Differences in Hebrew-to-Greek (Septuagint) translations, used by early Christians, contribute to interpretive divides (e.g., “virgin” vs. “young woman” in Isaiah 7:14).
Contextual Reading: Jews emphasize reading these passages in their immediate historical context, while Christians often see them as having dual or ultimate fulfillment in Jesus.