RE: Misogyny is classified as a hate crime in England (Full Version)

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Greta75 -> RE: Misogyny is classified as a hate crime in England (7/13/2016 4:26:14 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1
Your statement that thought crime is criminalised in your country is utter tosh and nonsense.

It is true. If you miss the news on the orlando shooting thread that I posted. A local man talked about shooting at all the pink dot people. Pink Dot is a gay rights protest event in Singapore. And the police arrested and jail him, for simply posting on facebook, suggesting that, they should be shot. My country does criminalize thought crime. You must never say online you want to kill someone or a group of people. And our law minister even gave a public statement about the arrest of this guy that the government will protect LGBT people.




Kirata -> RE: Misogyny is classified as a hate crime in England (7/13/2016 4:27:34 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75

The force defines misogyny hate crime as: "Incidents against women that are motivated by an attitude of a man towards a woman and includes behaviour targeted towards a woman by men simply because they are a woman."

I get the misogyny aspect of targeting a woman simply because she's a woman, but incidents "motivated by an attitude of a man towards a woman" seems exceedingly broad and vague.

K.





Greta75 -> RE: Misogyny is classified as a hate crime in England (7/13/2016 4:30:02 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata
I get the misogyny aspect of targeting a woman simply because she's a woman, but incidents "motivated by an attitude of a man towards a woman" seems exceedingly broad and vague.

I think they need to say, "motivated by a harmful attitude of a man towards a woman".

After all, attitude can be positive things. So they should specific specifically harmful attitude.




Termyn8or -> RE: Misogyny is classified as a hate crime in England (7/13/2016 4:33:52 AM)

"Since when? Since a young teenager, it has always freak me out! Not done by local men though, as they would never distress a woman by wolf whistling around here, they know it's disrespectful. It's always done by foreign men who were not brought up to understand wolf whistling makes women uncomfortable! "

Then why do you try to make yourself look attractive ? Makeup, get hair done and all that ? It you're already married or seriously shacked up, unless you are going out on the town with the olman then keep that shit at home.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UcvjXAtzaMU

"What?? a pretty girl show interest in you and you think she's pretty and you do nothing about it? Why? Just enjoy and get to know her! I introduce my brother to any guy I like or have a crush on because my brother is my best friend and I want his opinion. Plus, ya know if I like a guy, I can get my brother to befriend the guy, and then ask him out to go out with like my brother's friends and I can tag along and get to know the crush better! See! Brothers are useful, very useful, especially to hang out with men I like. "

Now I know I am in trouble LOL.

Thanks for the info. So she is probably sweet on me. Damn, I might just have to get another job. See, I don't even want sex anymore, and I definitely don't want a relationship.

Maybe she has low self esteem and sees me as gettable. I hope not but it could be. Really, I am a fat ugly slob. Well she hasn't seen the slob part yet...

No matter what, nothing is going to happen. Not that she is not doable, she is, but I ain't doing it. I just hope that doesn't cause any problems.

T^T




crazyml -> RE: Misogyny is classified as a hate crime in England (7/13/2016 4:41:18 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75

The force defines misogyny hate crime as: "Incidents against women that are motivated by an attitude of a man towards a woman and includes behaviour targeted towards a woman by men simply because they are a woman."

I get the misogyny aspect of targeting a woman simply because she's a woman, but incidents "motivated by an attitude of a man towards a woman" seems exceedingly broad and vague.

K.




Yes, it is vague, but the courts will establish a test.

I think there are plenty of examples of verbal, email, and social media threats that are unambiguously harassment and misogynistic.

E.G. "Fuck you you feminazi cunt, I know where you work"





LadyPact -> RE: Misogyny is classified as a hate crime in England (7/13/2016 4:42:31 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75
I think for example, like those wolf whistling is something NOBODY does to men! Needs to stop!

Even gay men don't wolf whistle at each other.

Why would you perpetuate this horse hockey? Exactly when was the last time you were at the leather bar and/or LGBT event that men weren't whistling at each other? I'll be glad to discuss the cultural differences between what happens at gay bars in this country compared to yours.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Termyn8or

FR

Yes, this looks like an attempt to create a "thought crime".

Also crap. You and I seem to have obvious differences in the definitions between thoughts and actions.

As the famous line from the movie goes... "How do you whistle? You put your lips together and blow."

Something that is just going on between your ears doesn't cause that action to happen. In order to wolf whistle, a person must flex the muscles in their face to a certain extent and exhale to a certain degree. It is not an instinct. It is not a self defense mechanism. It's a choice.






Termyn8or -> RE: Misogyny is classified as a hate crime in England (7/13/2016 5:23:57 AM)

"Exactly when was the last time you were at the leather bar and/or LGBT event that men weren't whistling at each other?"

Well not being Gay I wouldn't know. But being at a bar is different than taking your kids out for a stroll to the icecream parlor. I think they should not be offended. It is a compliment. Perhaps they don't like they way it is delivered but would they rather a guy run at them and say "You are good looking" ? These days they would probably call the fucking police thinking they were about to get raped.

"Also crap. You and I seem to have obvious differences in the definitions between thoughts and actions. "

I see it as something that could be expanded. They always do. A whistle from a construction worker across the street is a compliment but he is not going to rape anyone, he has bricks to lay or whatever, and probably an olady at home. But I see that this is an attempt to use your writings against you. Everything everyone posts online or emails is copied by the NSA, except Hillary Clinton of course. Now if you get in a fight with your olady and she goes ballistic and calls the law for nothing, those writings about male superiority can bite you in the ass. And Women, remember something - WE GAVE YOU THOSE RIGHTS. So by saying that, the NSA can pull up this post and even if she hit me first and I simply restrained her and called the law, that could be charged as a hate crime.

As such, they have hurt Women's rights because there are Men who will just bury them in the backyard. You make the laws too tough on someone they stop g3tting obeyed, and half the murders in this country are unsolved. What would you do ? Put up with all this, get a lawyer, not bondable, can't carry a gun, all because she got pissed off ? Bullshit, get a shovel. See where that shit got you ?

"Something that is just going on between your ears doesn't cause that action to happen. In order to wolf whistle, a person must flex the muscles in their face to a certain extent and exhale to a certain degree. It is not an instinct. It is not a self defense mechanism. It's a choice. "

Actually I have never been able to whistle. Can't sing all that great either. I know this hillbilly tune called "The Ride" and in it are the words "Mister can you make folk cry when you play and sing" and I chuckle every time I hear that because I can say yes, but not the way you think...

Anyway, this shit should not be an issue. I b3elieve Men should run the world but not these overgrowed boys we got now. Real Men like 100 years ago who had foresight and wisdom. these assholes today coule not run a convenience store. They lack the maturity and wisdom to run a country and that is why we are all fucked up.

And what Greta and the other ultraliberals do not get is that the more a government protects a certain class, the more of a target they become. Affirmative action accomplished what ? Special interest groups accomplished what ? Even Al Sharpton, all he can do is plan a riot and get more of his people killed. No fucking sense, no fucking reason.

Every group looking for rights is not looking for equal rights, they are looking for special rights. If I was Black and found out I was hired because of affirmative action I would be ashamed of myself and probably quit. I got every job I ever had on merit, and every raise, I have never been in a union.

And Women do not seem to realize, maybe because they have not experienced it, that there is a glass ceiling for Men as well. If you ain't in that ole boy network you are not getting to top floor. They bitch about it and expect something to be done, what ? Force companies to vote Women into the board of directors ? What kind of law that would pass Constitutional muster you think you could write to make that happen ?

Far as I am concerned, do what you want in Singapore. If I ever go there I will obey their laws. But don't try to bring that shit here.

T^T




crazyml -> RE: Misogyny is classified as a hate crime in England (7/13/2016 5:29:21 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Termyn8or
And what Greta and the other ultraliberals...


Shit my pants.

That is right up there on the list of funniest things I have ever read on these boards.




crazyml -> RE: Misogyny is classified as a hate crime in England (7/13/2016 5:30:49 AM)

Oh god. I am weeping here. Weeping and laughing. I can't breathe.




freedomdwarf1 -> RE: Misogyny is classified as a hate crime in England (7/13/2016 5:34:18 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75


quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1
You are wrong Greta.
Harrassment has always been investigatable and prosecutable here.
Just the nature of the harrassment and the effort of the investigation has been shifted slightly.

But in the past it would have to be physical harassment. Now it's just verbal harassment.

Not true Greta.
The harassment could be physical, verbal, mental or emotional.
You can even report harassment by noise, light, or anti-social activity.
That has been the situation here for many years.




Greta75 -> RE: Misogyny is classified as a hate crime in England (7/13/2016 5:39:10 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Termyn8or
Then why do you try to make yourself look attractive ? Makeup, get hair done and all that ? It you're already married or seriously shacked up, unless you are going out on the town with the olman then keep that shit at home.

If you read my other non-political thread termy. I am anti-make up for woman. I am proud of my natural face and very comfortable with it. I have never worn make up ever, I have no need to and have still got beauty compliments without it, so I never needed it. Except in situations where I was told I was gonna be fired from job if I don't put a lipstick on. Then I may put it on IF I still wanted the job, but I have resigned over such things because of my refusal to wear make up. I even once had professional make up artist done my face for a magazine shoot article, as they were just featuring ladies in my career, and I remembered my male stupid manager who kept bugging me to put some make up, told me, "Now I understand why you don't wear make up! You look so much better without it!" Because he has already seen me for like 4 or 5 years without make up, seeing me with make up makes me look weird to him. When I was a teenager, my mom was in advertising and got me a few gigs doing TV advertisements. Of course they got a professional artist doing your make up, and I always thought I look like shit with their make up and can't wait to take it off.

When I was a teenager, I was a tom boy. My hair is always in a pony tail. And I dress like a punk skater chick. I wear baggy jeans and female cut t-shirt. I don't think it was sexualised at all. I don't wear jewellery or make up at all. It doesn't make a damn difference to wolf whistling. Until today, I don't even bother to groom my eye browns, or paint my nails. I do absolutely zero female grooming that women do. I'm pretty natural looking.

Being Asian with natural black shiny straight long hair. I never had to do anything with it, no extensions, nothing, but just let it down. I also never do up my hair in any other way.


quote:

Now I know I am in trouble LOL.

Thanks for the info. So she is probably sweet on me. Damn, I might just have to get another job. See, I don't even want sex anymore, and I definitely don't want a relationship.

Maybe she has low self esteem and sees me as gettable. I hope not but it could be. Really, I am a fat ugly slob. Well she hasn't seen the slob part yet...

No matter what, nothing is going to happen. Not that she is not doable, she is, but I ain't doing it. I just hope that doesn't cause any problems.

T^T

I like alot of men that women here may find unattractive. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I knew an American man once who keeps calling himself an ugly fuck too, and he was beautiful to me, like physically beautiful. Sometimes a rougher look is nicer than a pretty boy look too. A man who looks manly is attractive.




Greta75 -> RE: Misogyny is classified as a hate crime in England (7/13/2016 5:44:13 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact
Why would you perpetuate this horse hockey? Exactly when was the last time you were at the leather bar and/or LGBT event that men weren't whistling at each other? I'll be glad to discuss the cultural differences between what happens at gay bars in this country compared to yours.

Really? Gay men whistle at each other?

Maybe in a drag show, they whistle to show appreciation for a drag, but gay men whistle to each other at gay bars? Like men who dress as men whistles at other men who dress as men?





Greta75 -> RE: Misogyny is classified as a hate crime in England (7/13/2016 5:50:15 AM)

quote:

And what Greta and the other ultraliberals do not get is that the more a government protects a certain class, the more of a target they become. Affirmative action accomplished what ? Special interest groups accomplished what ? Even Al Sharpton, all he can do is plan a riot and get more of his people killed. No fucking sense, no fucking reason.

Every group looking for rights is not looking for equal rights, they are looking for special rights. If I was Black and found out I was hired because of affirmative action I would be ashamed of myself and probably quit. I got every job I ever had on merit, and every raise, I have never been in a union.


I did mentioned I wanted it to be equal for male and female. The law only protects female. But it should be equally protecting males from harassment too. It's too female specific.
I want all protection to be equally melted out. It doesn't have to be special treated. Everyone can be protected equally.




Awareness -> RE: Misogyny is classified as a hate crime in England (7/13/2016 5:51:18 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44

while I am certainly not for harassment, I see this as just one step closer to "thought police."

[image]http://getrealphilippines.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/thoughtpolice_gallery_2078_15_5577-300x227.jpg[/image]
Yep. This is why Britain is a hell-hole for straight white men. An influx of Muslims and special privileges for women - I can't wait to see what happens when THAT cocktail goes off.




LadyPact -> RE: Misogyny is classified as a hate crime in England (7/13/2016 10:31:09 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75
Really? Gay men whistle at each other?

Maybe in a drag show, they whistle to show appreciation for a drag, but gay men whistle to each other at gay bars? Like men who dress as men whistles at other men who dress as men?

As astonished as you seem to sound at the idea, yes.

Drag shows, absolutely, and that goes for drag kings as well as drag queens. And, yes, it's still called drag when the purpose of dressing is for a performance.

Certain bars, especially leather bars, definitely.

Events like Pride, Folsom, and so on where (I almost hate to use this term) there's a safety in numbers feel to it, meaning there are more LGBT and ally folks around than het folks that could be seen as a problem, sure.

Will you see it (men cat calling men) on the street a whole lot? No. In certain neighborhoods in certain cities that are more predominantly non het, you might.





LadyPact -> RE: Misogyny is classified as a hate crime in England (7/13/2016 11:53:39 AM)

I swear the minute I get back from this upcoming trip, thing one on the agenda is getting the new computer set up. This one is eating more posts than I'm managing to get up.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Termyn8or
Well not being Gay I wouldn't know. But being at a bar is different than taking your kids out for a stroll to the icecream parlor. I think they should not be offended. It is a compliment. Perhaps they don't like they way it is delivered but would they rather a guy run at them and say "You are good looking" ? These days they would probably call the fucking police thinking they were about to get raped.

Speaking as a straight chick, I can promise you that they let us het folks in there, too. They don't look me over for the gay gene when I'm going through the door. The beer tastes the same, too.

As for the rest of that, I think you and I have two different perspectives on two different fronts. One being that you seem to think the cat calling thing *doesn't* happen at the ice cream parlor or taking your kids (or grandkids, yes, I'm serious) to the park. Two, I'm not likely to take it as a compliment. If a friend tells me I look pretty today, that's a compliment. Not some random stranger.

quote:

I see it as something that could be expanded. They always do. A whistle from a construction worker across the street is a compliment but he is not going to rape anyone, he has bricks to lay or whatever, and probably an olady at home.

Term, I'm not going to get into the 'all men are potential rapists' thing. There are so many angles wrong with it that I don't know where to begin. It's not a gender thing. Plenty of women sexually assault people, too, so I'm probably not the person to debate it with. We'd be stupid to ignore the fact that some people assault other people, but that's the world we live in.

At the same time, it's probably not a good idea to think that all of the asshats who will sexually assault other people are single, unemployed, good for nothings, who have a scarlet letter on their forehead so we can tell the difference between them and decent people. Fair enough?

quote:

But I see that this is an attempt to use your writings against you. Everything everyone posts online or emails is copied by the NSA, except Hillary Clinton of course. Now if you get in a fight with your olady and she goes ballistic and calls the law for nothing, those writings about male superiority can bite you in the ass. And Women, remember something - WE GAVE YOU THOSE RIGHTS. So by saying that, the NSA can pull up this post and even if she hit me first and I simply restrained her and called the law, that could be charged as a hate crime.

Ya know, you're trying to make it sound like every altercation where a guy gets arrested is just because they tried to "restrain" someone. You do realize that's not the majority, right? No matter how many posters rant and rave about how the male is always the person going to jail, even though he supposedly didn't do anything, isn't how it goes, no matter how many threads get started about it.

quote:

As such, they have hurt Women's rights because there are Men who will just bury them in the backyard. You make the laws too tough on someone they stop g3tting obeyed, and half the murders in this country are unsolved. What would you do ? Put up with all this, get a lawyer, not bondable, can't carry a gun, all because she got pissed off ? Bullshit, get a shovel. See where that shit got you ?

My position on this has been exceptionally clear. If not, I could elaborate.

quote:

Actually I have never been able to whistle. Can't sing all that great either. I know this hillbilly tune called "The Ride" and in it are the words "Mister can you make folk cry when you play and sing" and I chuckle every time I hear that because I can say yes, but not the way you think...

That's kind of a shame. When I was writing this post earlier, I had this neat, little idea.

I was going to suggest to you that, if you could whistle, you go ahead and cat call ten men you don't know as they are walking down the street. According to you, it's a compliment, right? Maybe try it at the local swimming pool with a few guys dressed in trunks. If it's really not an issue, let me know how those ten guys react.

quote:

Anyway, this shit should not be an issue. I b3elieve Men should run the world but not these overgrowed boys we got now. Real Men like 100 years ago who had foresight and wisdom. these assholes today coule not run a convenience store. They lack the maturity and wisdom to run a country and that is why we are all fucked up.

Not a great idea. Do you really think those "real men" from a hundred years ago were doing a great job? The 'foresight and wisdom' that led to people being terrorized, beaten, and killed? You might want to think the whole thing through.

quote:

And what Greta and the other ultraliberals do not get is that the more a government protects a certain class, the more of a target they become. Affirmative action accomplished what ? Special interest groups accomplished what ? Even Al Sharpton, all he can do is plan a riot and get more of his people killed. No fucking sense, no fucking reason.

Just integration of schools, no more crosses burning in people's front yards, half the people on this site not knowing what "rolling" somebody means and why certain people were targeted for that activity.

quote:

Every group looking for rights is not looking for equal rights, they are looking for special rights. If I was Black and found out I was hired because of affirmative action I would be ashamed of myself and probably quit. I got every job I ever had on merit, and every raise, I have never been in a union.

Keep every home you've ever had based on merit or could your landlord bounce you out because he didn't approve of who you were sleeping with? When the parents of the kids in a certain neighborhood were protesting because that 'different' kid was allowed to attend public school, did you see that as "special" rights, too?

quote:

And Women do not seem to realize, maybe because they have not experienced it, that there is a glass ceiling for Men as well. If you ain't in that ole boy network you are not getting to top floor. They bitch about it and expect something to be done, what ? Force companies to vote Women into the board of directors ? What kind of law that would pass Constitutional muster you think you could write to make that happen ?

Do you really think we need laws to make sure white men are sitting on the board of Fortune 500 companies?

The good ol' boys club is alive and well in certain areas. We have no disagreement there.

quote:

Far as I am concerned, do what you want in Singapore. If I ever go there I will obey their laws. But don't try to bring that shit here.

T^T

Pretty sure that's for Greta. On that note, I hope you have a good day.




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