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murderer get sex reassignment at taxpayer's expense. - 1/17/2014 7:54:02 PM

LafayetteLady

Posts: 7683
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Northern New Jersey
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I read an artcle today that a convicted, incarcerated murderer is going to receive sex reassignment surgey on the taxpayer's dime. Since I post from my POS cell phone, I can't provide a link, but I'm sure someone else ca find and be kind enough to post it.

The argument was that the killer's gender identity disorder was so severe that the surgery was necessary as in life saving necessary. Sorry, but I have limits as to what things prisoners should be permittrf to receive at the cost of taxpars. Don't get me wrong, I do understand how GID can really screw up one's psycholgical wellbeing. If this killer ( yes I will keep repeating the offense) wanted the surgery and would be paying for it herself, I would be all for it. But when you go on a rampage and kill your wife, you don't get to sit in prison and tell the court you wontbe happy and whole until you can make the final transition.

For the record, when she killed her wife, she had begun the process with hormones and such, and continues to receive the hormones while in prison, which I don't have a problem with. But prior to the murder, who was going to pay for the surgery? Does insurance cover that, or is it self pay? If it is self pay and the killer had to spend the money saved on a defense attorney, I think he should be SOL.

The concept that she can't be "complete" without the surgery doesn't wash. What about treatment for the mental illness that made her kill her wife? No mention of that, just how the GID is so severe, this "life saving " surgery is necessary and the state should pay for it, because it constitutes "cruel and unusual punishment" not to.

What about all the law abiding citizens with severe GID? The state doesn't step in on their behalf and pay for surgery, they have to figure out how to foot the bill on their own.

Sorry, but you are in prison because you did something wrong, yet you get treated better than the poor in this country.

Post #: 1

RE: murderer get sex reassignment at taxpayer's expense. - 1/17/2014 7:58:50 PM

kalikshama

Posts: 14805
Joined: 8/8/2010
Status: offline

Federal appeals court upholds Mass. inmate's right to taxpayer-funded sex change surgery

A federal appeals court in Boston today upheld a judge’s ruling that a transsexual inmate convicted of murder is entitled to a taxpayer-funded sex change operation as treatment for her severe gender identity disorder.

In a ruling that was a first of its kind, a three-judge panel of the US Court of Appeals for the First Circuit said courts must not shy away from enforcing the rights of all people, including prisoners. “And receiving medically necessary treatment is one of those rights, even if that treatment strikes some as odd or unorthodox,” the court said.

“Having carefully considered the relevant law and the extensive factual record, we affirm the judgment of the district court,” the court said in a 2-1 ruling, which could still be appealed to the full appeals court or to the US Supreme Court.

...But in a controversial September 2012 decision in the second case, US District Court Judge Mark Wolf ordered the surgery to take place, finding that Kosilek had a serious medical need that could only be adequately treated with the surgery. Wolf also found there was no legitimate reason to deny the surgery and that doing so would be a violation of Kosilek’s right to adequate prison medical care under the Eighth Amendment, which bars cruel and unusual punishment.

The appeals court found today that Wolf was “well-placed to make the factual findings he made, and there is certainly evidentiary support for those findings. Those findings — that Kosilek has a serious medical need for the surgery, and that the DOC [Department of Correction] refuses to meet that need for pretextual reasons unsupported by legitimate penological considerations — mean that the DOC has violated Kosilek’s Eighth Amendment rights. The court did not err in granting Kosilek the injunctive relief she sought.”

The appeals court ruling is the first time an appeals court has ruled that a sex change operation was necessary for a prisoner suffering from gender identity disorder, though it follows a series of rulings in Massachusetts and across the country that have affirmed that some type of medical care is constitutionally required.

Read more: http://www.boston.com/news/local/massachusetts/2014/01/17/mass-appeals-court-upholds-inmate-right-sex-change-surgery/22b7dO1vPQKnrJNjP6kLRN/story.html

(in reply to LafayetteLady)

Post #: 2

RE: murderer get sex reassignment at taxpayer's expense. - 1/17/2014 8:00:40 PM

RavenKittenSub

Posts: 15
Joined: 1/1/2008
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In the world of stupid things the government wastes money on, this is pretty insignificant.

(in reply to LafayetteLady)

Post #: 3

RE: murderer get sex reassignment at taxpayer's expense. - 1/17/2014 9:30:14 PM

LafayetteLady

Posts: 7683
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Northern New Jersey
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Thanks Kalikshama!

(in reply to RavenKittenSub)

Post #: 4

RE: murderer get sex reassignment at taxpayer's expense. - 1/17/2014 10:12:19 PM

TheHeretic

Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline

FR

We had a thread on this when the ruling was first issued. My position from then remains unchanged - just make sure this government contract gets awarded to the lowest bidder.

_____________________________

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(in reply to LafayetteLady)

Post #: 5

RE: murderer get sex reassignment at taxpayer's expense. - 1/17/2014 11:47:55 PM

LafayetteLady

Posts: 7683
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Northern New Jersey
Status: offline

Well, I only read about it today.

As for who will do it, the article I read said that they have only been able to locate one surgeon from out of stae willing to perform the surgery and he lacks the certification.

(in reply to TheHeretic)

Post #: 6

RE: murderer get sex reassignment at taxpayer's expense. - 1/19/2014 11:07:56 AM

absaeulm

Posts: 37
Joined: 7/27/2013
Status: offline

THIS.IS.BULLSHIT!!

(in reply to LafayetteLady)

Post #: 7

RE: murderer get sex reassignment at taxpayer's expense. - 1/19/2014 11:29:42 AM

Phydeaux

Posts: 4828
Joined: 1/4/2004
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Which part?

If you think sex reassignment surgery which costs BEAUCOUP bucks, paid for by the tax payer is bullshit
you need to get three of your friends and spread the word .. .and vote republican. or teaparty.

one wonders why someone that wanted a sex reassignment surgery wouldn't go out and do a petty felony. Get in jail - and then get the taxpayer to foot the bill.

its the latest trend. jail as a health spa.
3 square, a place to sleep and complimentary healthcare.

(in reply to absaeulm)

Post #: 8

RE: murderer get sex reassignment at taxpayer's expense. - 1/19/2014 12:02:47 PM

TheHeretic

Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux

its the latest trend. jail as a health spa.
3 square, a place to sleep and complimentary healthcare.

After learning a bit about the Norwegian penal system a while ago, I'm considering committing a string of street crimes in Oslo, as an emergency fallback retirement plan.

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.

(in reply to Phydeaux)

Post #: 9

RE: murderer get sex reassignment at taxpayer's expense. - 1/19/2014 12:46:45 PM

ResidentSadist

Posts: 12580
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From: a mean old Daddy, but I like you - Joni Mitchell
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Anyone willing to get GRS from a prison surgeon deserves it. Seriously, they'll probably just lop his dick off, tattoo a V shape of pubic hair over his asshole and tell him to walk backwards from now on.

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Post #: 10

RE: murderer get sex reassignment at taxpayer's expense. - 1/19/2014 1:24:04 PM

PeonForHer

Posts: 19612
Joined: 9/27/2008
Status: offline

quote:

If you think sex reassignment surgery which costs BEAUCOUP bucks, paid for by the tax payer is bullshit
you need to get three of your friends and spread the word .. .and vote republican. or teaparty.

So, the GOP and the Tea Party want to put fewer people into prison and/or for shorter periods, then? That's not something I'd have expected, I must say.

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(in reply to Phydeaux)

Post #: 11

RE: murderer get sex reassignment at taxpayer's expense. - 1/19/2014 10:33:47 PM

Phydeaux

Posts: 4828
Joined: 1/4/2004
Status: offline

read more.

(in reply to PeonForHer)

Post #: 12

RE: murderer get sex reassignment at taxpayer's expense. - 1/19/2014 11:06:49 PM

TheHeretic

Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux

read more.

And from different sources.

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.

(in reply to Phydeaux)

Post #: 13

RE: murderer get sex reassignment at taxpayer's expense. - 1/20/2014 3:41:40 AM

PeonForHer

Posts: 19612
Joined: 9/27/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux

read more.

And from different sources.

Why? Is Phydeaux not telling the truth? I cannot credit such a foul slur.

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Post #: 14

RE: murderer get sex reassignment at taxpayer's expense. - 1/20/2014 3:52:31 AM

Politesub53

Posts: 14862
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux

read more.

And from different sources.

Why? Is Phydeaux not telling the truth? I cannot credit such a foul slur.

You might very well think that; I couldn't possibly comment. ~ Francis Urquhart

(in reply to PeonForHer)

Post #: 15

RE: murderer get sex reassignment at taxpayer's expense. - 1/20/2014 8:06:40 AM

LafayetteLady

Posts: 7683
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Northern New Jersey
Status: offline

If the surgery was going to be performed by a prison surgeon, you would have a point. However, they are suching for an outside specialist.

(in reply to ResidentSadist)

Post #: 16

RE: murderer get sex reassignment at taxpayer's expense. - 1/21/2014 5:57:41 PM

slavekate80

Posts: 362
Joined: 7/4/2013
Status: offline

I can understand how that might be upsetting to taxpayers, but realistically, the number of prisoners with such severe GID that reassignment surgery is a necessary expense will be very small. I'd be surprised if there were a dozen nationwide. As far as "wasteful" government expenses goes, even if it was entirely frivolous, it's basically nothing. We're blowing billions on wars that are getting people killed, and who knows how much spying on our own people through phone records and other freedom-destroying crap. $50,000 or whatever it would take to take care of a handful of prisoners' mental health needs is barely even a rounding error.

(in reply to LafayetteLady)

Post #: 17

RE: murderer get sex reassignment at taxpayer's expense. - 1/21/2014 7:36:48 PM

LafayetteLady

Posts: 7683
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Northern New Jersey
Status: offline

It isn't a matter of how many, nor do any of the other ways government spends money matter.

This is the first case I've heard of. I do understand how GID can be difficult, but considering she is also receiving hormones and living in the men's prison as a woman, the sugery isn't "necessary" for her mental health.

How many people desiring sex change sugery can afford it? I'm going to go out a limb and say there are quite a few who have severe GID, and that having this surgery would be very psychologically beneficial, but they lack the funds to do so. They are law abiding citizens and they must suffer through their problem for financial reasons.

In this case, we have a convicted murderer who thinks they deserve to have their operation paid for. Because they are incarcerated. Bull shit. Lif saving? Only if the prisoner were to attempt suicide, which isn't the easiest thing to do in prison. This isn't like heart surgery where without it, you will die. The only way this murderer will die from not having the surgery is by her own hand. Regardless how horrible, out of place, etc. A person with GID feels, it isn't life threatening other than suicide.

Now the people are supposed to feel sorry for her plight? What about the woman she killed? Is there remorse? Or are we seeing someone trying to make the most of their prison stay by having this surgery paid for?

She is likely somewhat segrated from gen pop because of her status. Once she has the surgery, if they put her in a female prison, she will still need to be segregated for her own safety. The women will just as easily beat her senseless as the men. The only difference is that she will have gotten what she needed. Many transgendered don't have the final sugery. Some by choice, others because of expense. I'm sure she receives anti-depression and anti-anxiety meds along with the continued hormones.

I realize the LGBT community believes this is a great thing, so how about this: how about they all chip in so that this murderer can have her surgery? I have no problem with her having the surgery, I have a problem with who pays for it.

(in reply to slavekate80)

Post #: 18

RE: murderer get sex reassignment at taxpayer's expense. - 1/21/2014 9:14:15 PM

LookieNoNookie

Posts: 12216
Joined: 8/9/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LafayetteLady

I read an artcle today that a convicted, incarcerated murderer is going to receive sex reassignment surgey on the taxpayer's dime. Since I post from my POS cell phone, I can't provide a link, but I'm sure someone else ca find and be kind enough to post it.

The argument was that the killer's gender identity disorder was so severe that the surgery was necessary as in life saving necessary. Sorry, but I have limits as to what things prisoners should be permittrf to receive at the cost of taxpars. Don't get me wrong, I do understand how GID can really screw up one's psycholgical wellbeing. If this killer ( yes I will keep repeating the offense) wanted the surgery and would be paying for it herself, I would be all for it. But when you go on a rampage and kill your wife, you don't get to sit in prison and tell the court you wontbe happy and whole until you can make the final transition.

For the record, when she killed her wife, she had begun the process with hormones and such, and continues to receive the hormones while in prison, which I don't have a problem with. But prior to the murder, who was going to pay for the surgery? Does insurance cover that, or is it self pay? If it is self pay and the killer had to spend the money saved on a defense attorney, I think he should be SOL.

The concept that she can't be "complete" without the surgery doesn't wash. What about treatment for the mental illness that made her kill her wife? No mention of that, just how the GID is so severe, this "life saving " surgery is necessary and the state should pay for it, because it constitutes "cruel and unusual punishment" not to.

What about all the law abiding citizens with severe GID? The state doesn't step in on their behalf and pay for surgery, they have to figure out how to foot the bill on their own.

Sorry, but you are in prison because you did something wrong, yet you get treated better than the poor in this country.

This person is not a him....or a her....it's an it.

The best incarceration for it would be....no sex change....just strap "it" up and let the "citizens" of the community have at....."it".

(in reply to LafayetteLady)

Post #: 19

RE: murderer get sex reassignment at taxpayer's expense. - 1/21/2014 9:43:49 PM

tweakabelle

Posts: 7522
Joined: 10/16/2007
From: Sydney Australia
Status: offline

Whatever the rights and wrongs of the case in question, if the US is going to incarcerate so much of its population - there are over 2 million Americans in prison at any given point in time, with millions more on parole etc - it is inevitable that cases such as this will arise.

I've never seen a compelling analysis that accounts for why the US feels it necessary to imprison so many of its own people. I refuse to believe that Americans are intrinsically any more- or any less law-abiding than the citizens of any comparable county. So can anyone tell me why so Americans are locked up?

One obvious implication of this level of incarceration is that imprisonment is not successful as a crime deterrent policy. Locking up so many people seems to have had little effect on crime rates. Is a new approach needed?

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Post #: 20

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