quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
You didn't blame just one side, Jeff. You didn't play it right. Your attempt at being the villain sucked.

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

LOL.. a rate that has been dropping for 10 years... and he has been in office how long? Yeah.. all Obama.

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ORIGINAL: Yachtie
Dems blame Bush for being, well, Bush. Isn't it time to give Obama equal consideration?

quote:

ORIGINAL: JeffBC

quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie
Dems blame Bush for being, well, Bush. Isn't it time to give Obama equal consideration?

Well damnit, I tried to throw DS a bone and failed so let me give it another go. I voted for Obama first election and I've been a solid democrat since lewinsky. Before then a moderate. But yeah, i'm perfectly willing to let the buck stop exactly where it ought to. Obama's in the chair. It stops at his desk. That was true from minute one of his tenure in the oval office in my opinion. I don't really give a rat's ass what Bush may have contributed. I care about our current glorious leader and I want the buck to stop in exactly one place.

• A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  
• Personal Responsibility
  
• Help for the truly needy
  
• Limited Government
  
• Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)
  

quote:

You can't place all blame on Obama (yeah, I said it) for everything that has happened since 2009, even though he's the one in the Oval Office. You can't even blame Bush and Obama for all that's happened since 2002. A lot of this shit was years in the making. That housing bubble was huge and had started in the 70's. Bush 43 and Obama have wielded an awful lot of power, but even I don't think either one is devious or evil enough to have caused shit to happen when they were still in their teens/20's. Both parties have owned power and the political capital to have righted the ship of state. Neither has done so, working to improve the party standing, hurt the other party's standing, and/or worked towards getting re-elected instead. Both parties are at fault.

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

quote:

You can't place all blame on Obama (yeah, I said it) for everything that has happened since 2009, even though he's the one in the Oval Office. You can't even blame Bush and Obama for all that's happened since 2002. A lot of this shit was years in the making. That housing bubble was huge and had started in the 70's. Bush 43 and Obama have wielded an awful lot of power, but even I don't think either one is devious or evil enough to have caused shit to happen when they were still in their teens/20's. Both parties have owned power and the political capital to have righted the ship of state. Neither has done so, working to improve the party standing, hurt the other party's standing, and/or worked towards getting re-elected instead. Both parties are at fault.

Thank you!

• A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  
• Personal Responsibility
  
• Help for the truly needy
  
• Limited Government
  
• Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)
  

quote:

ORIGINAL: sloguy02246
Maybe companies outsourcing jobs to various nations in Asia is also a factor in the declining labor rate?

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux
Taz,
Your desire to point the finger equally at both parties is a fine egalitarian principle. But it is *wrong*.
It is impossible to argue with completeness in this venue. However, the fundamental cause of this recession was a housing bubble exacerbated by foreign competition, exacerbated by government debt.
The community redevelopment acts which required the issuance of sub-prime loans were done at the behest of democrat constituencies. The banks that benefited have primarily supported democratic candidates. The mortgaged backed industries - fannie mae and freddie mac primarily backed democratic candidates.
Its only when this blew up that it became - "bipartisan". I was one of the people that wrote my congressman *against* allowing/requiring the issuance of sub-prime loans. I wrote my congressman opposed to the repeal of seagal. When the bill came up in congress trying to tighten mortgage standards in the early 2000's I wrote in favor of it.
So as someone with a long history of paying attention to this issue - if you want to see truly who was at fault here, don't accept blindly the idea of "all the parties are the same". Follow the money.
And, for the record, this scandal is so large that it will be possible to find many egregious examples of republican malfeasance as well - from firms that marketed CDO's to attempts to obtain favorable treatement for constitutents.
Finally, while you may not agree that Obama is the cause of the problem, one thing is clear from the graph:
5 years of Obama rule have done nothing to stop the decline.

• A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  
• Personal Responsibility
  
• Help for the truly needy
  
• Limited Government
  
• Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)
  

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux
It is impossible to argue with completeness in this venue. However, the fundamental cause of this recession was a housing bubble exacerbated by foreign competition, exacerbated by government debt.

quote:

The community redevelopment acts which required the issuance of sub-prime loans were done at the behest of democrat constituencies. The banks that benefited have primarily supported democratic candidates. The mortgaged backed industries - fannie mae and freddie mac primarily backed democratic candidates.

quote:

Your desire to point the finger equally at both parties is a fine egalitarian principle. But it is *wrong*.
It is impossible to argue with completeness in this venue. However, the fundamental cause of this recession was a housing bubble exacerbated by foreign competition, exacerbated by government debt.

quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

How to fix it?
1. Stop putting oposing cheap energy for political reasons- keystone, fracking, coal.
nobody is opposing cheap energy, we are a net exporter.why? cuz that is where the money is, energy is not ever going to be cheap.


2. End the back log at the patent office.

What will that do, why is there a backlog, and what will be gained? And how are you going to do that under smaller government and sequestration?

3. End the disastrous obamacare, which is forcing small businesses to cut hours and employees.

This of course has been repeatedly shown to be nutsuckerism and felching.


4. Force big banks and big businesses to divest.

That will require removing the nutsuckers from the government, Hank Paulson and the republican congress made them too big to fail.


5. End TARP and all similar programs.

Perhaps a bill such as this could be introduced in the house, ONCE, instead of a dogshit bill having nothing to do with anything introduced over 40 times. That would be a nutsucker problem all the way there, it is their constitutional responsibility.


6. Start paying down the national debt.

We dont collect revenue to fund what we do, even at sequestered levels, or even with a massive reform.


7. Quit playing with China. Declare them to be currency manipulators.


Why? There are far worse manipulators than they, and look, what you are doing is, by doing that, weakening the dollar, if you want to weaken the dollar, why not just--------------weaken the dollar? we can do that you know takes one statement from the fed, along the lines of.........we want to weaken the dollar, and then we can let inflation fly.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

LOL.. a rate that has been dropping for 10 years... and he has been in office how long? Yeah.. all Obama.

See, that smacks as ostensibly giving Obama a pass. No, it's not all Obama! But he sure is in his second term now, isn't he?

Dems blame Bush for being, well, Bush. Isn't it time to give Obama equal consideration?

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

quote:

Your desire to point the finger equally at both parties is a fine egalitarian principle. But it is *wrong*.
It is impossible to argue with completeness in this venue. However, the fundamental cause of this recession was a housing bubble exacerbated by foreign competition, exacerbated by government debt.

None of which would have been possible had those three acts not went into effect. This was all decades in the making. Made worse by the greed of the last 15 years.

Oddly enough, Pittsburgh has a long, long history of being a union town... Considered the birthplace of the national Republican Party.

Since 1934, this city has been Democrat run. And we weathered the housing bubble bust and unemployment drops pretty damn well.

http://www.forbes.com/2010/02/19/best-housing-prices-personal-finance-real-estate-affordable-homes.html

So the notion that the Democrats cant run a successful city is bunk. A republican state, yet a liberal city. Our saving grace, my opinion, are the colleges, hospitals and banks (at least 4 are headquartered here) helped the city survive while cities like Detroit went bust.

Your problem is, you want to pin a blame on Obama for all this. Its just not working the way you had hoped. You have both liberals and conservatives telling you the same thing, and you still want to finger point.

Fine. You want to point a finger? Stand up.. walk to a mirror.. and point at your own reflection. So should everyone else. WE (the people) have the ability to toss out every congressman, senator, mayor, governor, ect ect ect.. and we dont.

And THAT is the root cause of all this.

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ORIGINAL: MrRodgers
I've been voting people out of office for 20-30 years...hasn't worked.

quote:

I agree with all of this except the last. I've been voting people out of office for 20-30 years...hasn't worked.