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RE: First the IRS and now the Justcie Department - 5/15/2013 8:53:30 AM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

In this matter, yes.  Unintended consequences.  But you should know that being the nattering legal scholar. 



lets see your facts and evidence that it is "UNINTENDED", so the creation of a positive, or at least a presumed positive law is unintended?

I suppose in your dictionary willfully and knowingly negligent means: "unintended".

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: First the IRS and now the Justcie Department - 5/15/2013 8:57:27 AM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: hot4bondage

This seems to be the only thread here about the Justice department seizing AP phone records, and there hasn't been a new post for nearly two days. Seriously? Maybe it just needs a catchier title, like "Obama vs Journalism."

We can't have a free press if the press isn't free to talk to its sources. Two months of phone records from at least a hundred journalists...



if you think thats bad check cases to see what they do to "individuals"!


In the video below we see what a police state looks like. Cops looking for a 19-year old supposed terrorist raid a house and force citizens out at gunpoint with their hands over the heads. If not for the distinctly American houses in the video, this could be Iraq or Afghanistan.

Warrantless Raids In Boston


adolf would be so proud!

new precedence has been set.

coming to a theater near you soon!

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to hot4bondage)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: First the IRS and now the Justcie Department - 5/15/2013 8:59:08 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		Nope, I have given you the USC, your responsibility to fumble and bumble around in it and mess it up into uncohesive asswipe as per usual.  He signs an affidavit the law is met.  There is no penalty, it could go to SCOTUS I suppose, and they could rule him wrong and say don't do it again, but........really.........so fuckin what?

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: First the IRS and now the Justcie Department - 5/15/2013 9:06:36 AM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

Nope, I have given you the USC, your responsibility to fumble and bumble around in it and mess it up into uncohesive asswipe as per usual.  He signs an affidavit the law is met.  There is no penalty, it could go to SCOTUS I suppose, and they could rule him wrong and say don't do it again, but........really.........so fuckin what?



so "FACTLESS" agency affidavits are now a substitute for a court order determining a "probable cause" in your world.


yeh thats what I'm talkin bout!








< Message edited by Real0ne -- 5/15/2013 9:10:13 AM >

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: First the IRS and now the Justcie Department - 5/15/2013 9:17:19 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		Nope, not at all, I did not write the law, and it isn't like probable cause or bench warrants are necessary in alot of cases, thanks to SCOTUS, even in your world. 

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: First the IRS and now the Justcie Department - 5/15/2013 9:25:44 AM   
FrostedFlake


Posts: 3084
Joined: 3/4/2009
From: Centralia, Washington
Status: offline 		Wow. I don't recall ever agreeing Boehner before

quote:

"The First Amendment is first for a reason," said Michael Steel, a spokesman for House Speaker John Boehner. "If the Obama administration is going after reporters' phone records, they better have a damned good explanation."


Speaking of explanation, why were the subpoenas not front and center. Shouldn't that explanation be written right there?

Call me a fool.

_____________________________

Frosted Flake
simul justus et peccator
Einen Liebhaber, und halten Sie die Schraube

"... evil (and hilarious) !!" Hlen5

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: First the IRS and now the Justcie Department - 5/15/2013 9:26:12 AM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

Nope, not at all, I did not write the law, and it isn't like probable cause or bench warrants are necessary in alot of cases, thanks to SCOTUS, even in your world. 



they are necessary in ALL cases as are fully empowered jurys with not only the power to determine and try FACT but also NULLIFY law without coercion from black robed state priests. Neither was it ever waived, and if you believe it was show your facts and evidence.

The US government was not created by the inhabitants by vote.

No referendum ever circulated in ANY state.

If it existed you could easily cite it.







_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: First the IRS and now the Justcie Department - 5/15/2013 9:28:12 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		Not so, show me probable cause and warrant in the constitution.  What the SCOTUS giveth, the SCOTUS can taketh away (as can the legislature).

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: First the IRS and now the Justcie Department - 5/15/2013 9:30:09 AM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: FrostedFlake

Wow. I don't recall ever agreeing Boehner before

quote:

"The First Amendment is first for a reason," said Michael Steel, a spokesman for House Speaker John Boehner. "If the Obama administration is going after reporters' phone records, they better have a damned good explanation."


Speaking of explanation, why were the subpoenas not front and center. Shouldn't that explanation be written right there?

Call me a fool.



officials cannot publically know anything, it all has to be a surprise to maintain plausible deniability.

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to FrostedFlake)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: First the IRS and now the Justcie Department - 5/15/2013 9:33:02 AM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

Not so, show me probable cause and warrant in the constitution.  What the SCOTUS giveth, the SCOTUS can taketh away (as can the legislature).



however scotus didnt giveth nonetheless it declareth the power to taketh away and the statist backeth upeth with jack booted thugeth.

if you believe the rights of man are granted through scotus cite it.

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: First the IRS and now the Justcie Department - 5/15/2013 9:35:54 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		If you believe that probable cause and warrants are cited in the constitution, cite it.   You have at best an EPHEMERAL DOCTRINE.  And you just saw that it was cited in the law as exception.  Legally.  All in, all done.

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: First the IRS and now the Justcie Department - 5/15/2013 9:43:27 AM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

If you believe that probable cause and warrants are cited in the constitution, cite it.   You have at best an EPHEMERAL DOCTRINE.  And you just saw that it was cited in the law as exception.  Legally.  All in, all done.



probable cause comes under "DUE PROCESS", which IS stated in the constitution.

dont quit your day job



_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: First the IRS and now the Justcie Department - 5/15/2013 9:44:47 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		nope, not even close, thanks for playing.  

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: First the IRS and now the Justcie Department - 5/15/2013 9:54:50 AM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

nope, not even close, thanks for playing.  



said by the resident shit house lawyer


5th

No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.[1]


14th

All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the state wherein they reside. No state shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.



those are the rules in which people "presumably" "consented" to be governed.

remedy-less violation of the agreement renders it null and void.

indictments, fully empowered juries, the right to declare your rights have never been recognized hence the agreement with the governed is breached, starting with the several omissions of the states.





< Message edited by Real0ne -- 5/15/2013 10:02:17 AM >

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: First the IRS and now the Justcie Department - 5/15/2013 10:03:43 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline
Yeah, what is due process of law? 

Legal Dictionary:

A fundamental, constitutional guarantee that all legal proceedings will be fair and that one will be given notice of the proceedings and an opportunity to be heard before the government acts to take away one's life, liberty, or property. Also, a constitutional guarantee that a law shall not be unreasonable, Arbitrary, or capricious.
 
Well, what horseshit have we here when our resident shithouse lawyer says it means warrants and probable cause ..

The Supreme Court has ruled that the Constitution expresses a preference for searches, seizures, and arrests conducted pursuant to a lawfully executed warrant (see Mincey v. Arizona, 437 U.S. 385 [1978]).

*NB: PREFERENCE, not REQIREMENT.


The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized
 
Nowhere does it require warrants.... and probable cause.  Again, Legal dictionary:

Apparent facts discovered through logical inquiry that would lead a reasonably intelligent and prudent person to believe that an accused person has committed a crime, thereby warranting his or her prosecution, or that a Cause of Action has accrued, justifying a civil lawsuit.
 
So, within 18 USC 2701-11 it appears that Mr. Holder can by certificate order his own warrant and probable cause based on himself.  That is the law.

You may take it to court if you think you got a shot.


< Message edited by mnottertail -- 5/15/2013 10:06:45 AM >

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: First the IRS and now the Justcie Department - 5/15/2013 10:16:45 AM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:


A fundamental, constitutional guarantee that all legal proceedings will be fair and that one will be given notice of the proceedings and an opportunity to be heard before the government acts to take away one's life, liberty, or property.


so they called those people up and hey boys and gurls in about 1 week we are going to raid your fucking house and stomp all over and trespass on your private property and person and take your liberty because eric holder said we should in his affidavit of NONFACT.

time to lift the corporate veil!

quote:


You may take it to court if you think you got a shot.


the same government court that denies people fully empowered juries, grand jury indictments, the right to declare their rights, and allodial title?

the our way or the hiway court?

yeh that will work!




< Message edited by Real0ne -- 5/15/2013 10:20:37 AM >

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: First the IRS and now the Justcie Department - 5/15/2013 10:21:58 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		Nope, they didnot and no one has lost life, liberty, or property.  When they charge someone, they will have a warrant, miranda rights and all that asswipe.

So, howling in circles, hows that working out for you?  Them posse comitatus marshals unseat the 50 governors yet? 

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 37
RE: First the IRS and now the Justcie Department - 5/15/2013 10:29:24 AM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

Nope, they didnot and no one has lost life, liberty, or property.  When they charge someone, they will have a warrant, miranda rights and all that asswipe.

So, howling in circles, hows that working out for you?  Them posse comitatus marshals unseat the 50 governors yet? 


Oh that right they are sitting in front of their tv watching the simpsons eating bons bons right now.

No liberties were violated in a shit house lawyers world.


but thats ok because you have major media supporting the terror state.







< Message edited by Real0ne -- 5/15/2013 10:30:35 AM >

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: First the IRS and now the Justcie Department - 5/15/2013 10:45:21 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		Well, being a shit house lawyer of demonstrably little account such as you are with these buffooneries what do you propose?

Hows that working out for ya?  

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: First the IRS and now the Justcie Department - 5/15/2013 4:03:38 PM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline 		hows it workin for you?

~ american dream!

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 40
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