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[Poll]

Legalize?


Legalize it, period.
  73% (28)
It should be illegal.
  7% (3)
Legalize for personal use only.
  7% (3)
Pass it, Bogart.
  10% (4)


Total Votes : 38
(last vote on : 4/23/2013 3:37:19 PM)
(Poll will run till: -- )
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Legalize? - 4/20/2013 4:54:42 PM   
Level


Posts: 25145
Joined: 3/3/2006
Status: offline 		http://www.cnn.com/2013/04/20/opinion/reiman-marijuana-day/index.html?c=us

Today is 4/20, a day to tell your buds "hi!".

But not all states want that; what do you think?

_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots
Profile   Post #: 1
RE: Legalize? - 4/20/2013 5:15:19 PM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Level
http://www.cnn.com/2013/04/20/opinion/reiman-marijuana-day/index.html?c=us
Today is 4/20, a day to tell your buds "hi!".
But not all states want that; what do you think?


Legalize it. Find a way to distribute, regulate, and tax it.

Then, set up the system to include the rest of the, currently illegal, illicit drugs.


_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to Level)
Profile   Post #: 2
RE: Legalize? - 4/20/2013 5:23:03 PM   
Level


Posts: 25145
Joined: 3/3/2006
Status: offline 		Hey DS.

It'd get some people out of jail, too; hopefully alleviating overcrowding, which could help keep some bad guys in jail longer.

Do you worry about making the harder stuff legal at all?

_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 3
RE: Legalize? - 4/20/2013 5:24:09 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline 		I just need to run down to the store for M&Ms and beef jerky, right quick.

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If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.


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Profile   Post #: 4
RE: Legalize? - 4/20/2013 5:26:05 PM   
Level


Posts: 25145
Joined: 3/3/2006
Status: offline

_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 5
RE: Legalize? - 4/20/2013 5:26:39 PM   
Kirata


Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline
Unh, you have legalize it period, and legalize it for personal use only.

What would constitute "impersonal" use?

K.

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Profile   Post #: 6
RE: Legalize? - 4/20/2013 5:32:05 PM   
Level


Posts: 25145
Joined: 3/3/2006
Status: offline 		I was trying to think of a way to phrase that; personal being for individual use, smaller amounts, and "period" being able to grow your own, which generally involves larger amounts.

_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots

(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 7
RE: Legalize? - 4/20/2013 7:06:46 PM   
muhly22222


Posts: 463
Joined: 3/25/2010
Status: offline 		FR

Legalize it. Then regulate and tax it.

The benefits: money coming in from "sin tax" (like alcohol and tobacco), and less money going out (fewer prosecutions and jail sentences). It also gives law enforcement, including prosecutors, more time to focus on more serious crimes.

With that being said, I'm still ok with there being a crime for selling without a license/permit (like there is with liquor in my state), or for driving under the influence.

_____________________________

I have always been among those who believed that the greatest freedom of speech was the greatest safety, because if a man is a fool, the best thing to do is to encourage him to advertise the fact by speaking.
-Woodrow Wilson

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Profile   Post #: 8
RE: Legalize? - 4/20/2013 7:13:59 PM   
erieangel


Posts: 2237
Joined: 6/19/2011
Status: offline 		Can you imagine the taxes the government could put on pot and people would still buy it?

Smokers (like me) complain every time there is a new cigarette tax, but a lot of us keep smoking. And Obama wants to add another $.09 to a pack.

Even without a high tax, legal pot will help all local, state and the federal budget.




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Profile   Post #: 9
RE: Legalize? - 4/20/2013 7:39:59 PM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Level
Hey DS.
It'd get some people out of jail, too; hopefully alleviating overcrowding, which could help keep some bad guys in jail longer.
Do you worry about making the harder stuff legal at all?


I'm not exactly sure what you're asking me. If you're asking me if I'm worried at all about what happens once the harder stuff is legalized, no. I take a long run view of it, though. It'll likely be a bit chaotic initially, but the novelty of taking the harder stuff will wear off, though. Tax the shit out of it and use those taxes to fund rehab.


_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to Level)
Profile   Post #: 10
RE: Legalize? - 4/20/2013 7:42:23 PM   
erieangel


Posts: 2237
Joined: 6/19/2011
Status: offline 		That doesn't make since. Taxes already fund rehab and all of it is illegal.


(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 11
RE: Legalize? - 4/20/2013 7:48:52 PM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: erieangel
Can you imagine the taxes the government could put on pot and people would still buy it?
Smokers (like me) complain every time there is a new cigarette tax, but a lot of us keep smoking. And Obama wants to add another $.09 to a pack.
Even without a high tax, legal pot will help all local, state and the federal budget.


Isn't it $0.94 per pack?


_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to erieangel)
Profile   Post #: 12
RE: Legalize? - 4/20/2013 7:49:54 PM   
Kirata


Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: muhly22222

I'm still ok with there being a crime... for driving under the influence.

Medical Marijuana Laws, Traffic Fatalities, and Alcohol Consumption
    Using data from the Fatality Analysis Reporting System (FARS) for the period 1990-2009, we find that traffic fatalities fall by nearly 9 percent after the legalization of medical marijuana
Marijuana use had little effect on simulated driving skills, according to a Hartford Hospital study
    Marijuana use had little effect on simulated driving skills
Psychomotor Impairing Effects Of Cannabis Are Nominal In Experienced Users
    "THC did not affect performance of heavy cannabis users in the critical tracking task, the stop-signal task, and the Tower of London," authors wrote. "These tasks have previously been shown to be very sensitive to the impairing potential of THC when administered to infrequent cannabis (users). The lack of THC [effect] on these tasks basically confirms the previous notions that heavy cannabis users can develop tolerance to behaviorally impairing effects of THC."
Marijuana and Actual Driving Performance, USDOT
    The foremost impression one gains from reviewing the literature is that no clear relationship has ever been demonstrated between marijuana smoking and either seriously impaired driving performance or the risk of accident involvement... Very importantly our city driving study showed that drivers who drank alcohol overestimated their performance quality whereas those who smoked marijuana underestimated it. Perhaps as a consequence, the former invested no special effort for accomplishing the task whereas the latter did, and successfully.
K.


< Message edited by Kirata -- 4/20/2013 7:54:35 PM >

(in reply to muhly22222)
Profile   Post #: 13
RE: Legalize? - 4/20/2013 8:05:20 PM   
Aylee


Posts: 24103
Joined: 10/14/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: muhly22222

I'm still ok with there being a crime... for driving under the influence.

Medical Marijuana Laws, Traffic Fatalities, and Alcohol Consumption
    Using data from the Fatality Analysis Reporting System (FARS) for the period 1990-2009, we find that traffic fatalities fall by nearly 9 percent after the legalization of medical marijuana
Marijuana use had little effect on simulated driving skills, according to a Hartford Hospital study
    Marijuana use had little effect on simulated driving skills
Psychomotor Impairing Effects Of Cannabis Are Nominal In Experienced Users
    "THC did not affect performance of heavy cannabis users in the critical tracking task, the stop-signal task, and the Tower of London," authors wrote. "These tasks have previously been shown to be very sensitive to the impairing potential of THC when administered to infrequent cannabis (users). The lack of THC [effect] on these tasks basically confirms the previous notions that heavy cannabis users can develop tolerance to behaviorally impairing effects of THC."
Marijuana and Actual Driving Performance, USDOT
    The foremost impression one gains from reviewing the literature is that no clear relationship has ever been demonstrated between marijuana smoking and either seriously impaired driving performance or the risk of accident involvement... Very importantly our city driving study showed that drivers who drank alcohol overestimated their performance quality whereas those who smoked marijuana underestimated it. Perhaps as a consequence, the former invested no special effort for accomplishing the task whereas the latter did, and successfully.
K.



I do not really care to go through all of those links right now, but it was my understanding that the influence of Mary Jane on driving skills was effected by how new the person was to smoking pot.

Unfortunately I cannot think of any way to TEST for it in driving cases. Of course, just throwing out the DUI laws would clear this up in a hurry.

_____________________________

Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam

I don’t always wgah’nagl fhtagn. But when I do, I ph’nglui mglw’nafh R’lyeh.

(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 14
RE: Legalize? - 4/20/2013 8:26:23 PM   
Kirata


Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee

it was my understanding that the influence of Mary Jane on driving skills was effected by how new the person was to smoking pot.

True with regard to all skills. Third link.

K.






< Message edited by Kirata -- 4/20/2013 8:28:27 PM >

(in reply to Aylee)
Profile   Post #: 15
RE: Legalize? - 4/20/2013 9:08:09 PM   
LizDeluxe


Posts: 687
Joined: 10/2/2011
Status: offline 		I voted to legalize it, period. I can't see any rational reason for pot to be illegal while alcohol is legal. I'm not interested in pot but I think it should be legal. I'm not sure I get the whole "tax the shit out of it" mentality. People have been either buying it illegally or growing it themselves for decades. They're just going to stop doing that and buy government joints particularly if they are more expensive because they taxed the shit out of them? Somehow I don't see that happening.

Extending legalization to harder drugs is just an all around bad idea, in my opinion. Once you get past pot, legalization just solves the drug crime problem (for the most part). It doesn't deal with the drug problem - it only makes it worse if anything. I guess taxing it to fund rehab is one strategy if you like solving one problem to create another.

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While is there no liberal talk radio? There are at least five conservative talk radio shows available over the air every day in the radio market I live in. Why does the liberal message fail to attract listeners?

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Profile   Post #: 16
RE: Legalize? - 4/20/2013 9:14:34 PM   
MasterCaneman


Posts: 3842
Joined: 3/21/2013
Status: offline 		Heyyyyyy....






Attachment (1)

< Message edited by MasterCaneman -- 4/20/2013 9:15:32 PM >

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Profile   Post #: 17
RE: Legalize? - 4/20/2013 9:23:28 PM   
Powergamz1


Posts: 1927
Joined: 9/3/2011
Status: offline 		Weed Cards for all!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CRm1yqSmsGY

_____________________________

"DOMA is unconstitutional as a deprivation of the equal liberty of persons that is protected by the Fifth Amendment" Anthony McLeod Kennedy

" About damn time...wooot!!' Me

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Profile   Post #: 18
RE: Legalize? - 4/21/2013 5:20:17 AM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LizDeluxe
I voted to legalize it, period. I can't see any rational reason for pot to be illegal while alcohol is legal. I'm not interested in pot but I think it should be legal. I'm not sure I get the whole "tax the shit out of it" mentality. People have been either buying it illegally or growing it themselves for decades. They're just going to stop doing that and buy government joints particularly if they are more expensive because they taxed the shit out of them? Somehow I don't see that happening.
Extending legalization to harder drugs is just an all around bad idea, in my opinion. Once you get past pot, legalization just solves the drug crime problem (for the most part). It doesn't deal with the drug problem - it only makes it worse if anything. I guess taxing it to fund rehab is one strategy if you like solving one problem to create another.


The entire legalization process might allow the actual price of marijuana to drop below what it is now (even after taxing the shit out of it). The current price isn't just the cost of growing the plant and the processing. It's not the same as growing a legal crop. You have other impacts on cost, like securing your operation, guarding your operation and the risks involved in the sourcing to selling business is also part of that price.

State and Local Alcohol Taxes

2010 the amount of money taken in the US for State and Local Alcohol Taxes was just over $6B.

Federal Tax Rates on Alcohol
  • $0.02-0.05/ 12 oz can of beer
  • $0.21-0.67/ 750 ml bottle ($0.04/ 750 ml of hard cider)
  • $13.50/ Proof Gallon** ($2.14/ 750 ml bottle at 80 proof)

**A proof gallon is a gallon of liquid that is 100 proof, or 50% alcohol. The tax is adjusted, depending on the percentage of alcohol of the product.

Considering the economy of mass production, even with the taxes levied on alcohol, it's still generally more expensive (especially if you consider the time involved) to produce your own alcoholic beverages in your own home.

In the short term, legalizing hard drugs will have bad results. But, that's due to simply lifting the restrictions and making it easier to get. For some people, easy access will cause in increase in use, but that will wane as they come to realize that access isn't going to be restricted like it used to be. People will be able to "medicate" at lower levels of ingestion because it won't be illegal to use and have. Putting the taxes towards rehab for those that want it will help defray that cost.


_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to LizDeluxe)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: Legalize? - 4/21/2013 5:39:06 AM   
Level


Posts: 25145
Joined: 3/3/2006
Status: offline 		If they did legalize harder drugs (and I'm not at all convinced that's a good idea), I would want harsh sentences for anyone harming anyone else while high.

_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 20
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