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RE: Anyone here tried the paleolithic diet? - 9/28/2011 1:58:45 PM

zephyroftheNorth

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FR

You know I don't understand these fad diets. Eat modestly from all food groups, exercise, and the weight comes off. No denial of this or that food, just eat properly and get some exercise. Simples and yet people just can't resist these diets.

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RE: Anyone here tried the paleolithic diet? - 9/30/2011 11:40:00 AM

NiceGuyNihilist

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quote:

ORIGINAL: zephyroftheNorth

FR

You know I don't understand these fad diets. Eat modestly from all food groups, exercise, and the weight comes off. No denial of this or that food, just eat properly and get some exercise. Simples and yet people just can't resist these diets.

Zeph

Well, if the assumptions which undergird the Paleo diet are correct--and that's a big "if"--its advocates may have a pretty good case for it being not a fad diet, but a return to the diet that humans are evolutionarily designed for. Assumption: agriculture did not exist before 10,000 years ago, at least not to such an extent that it impacted human evolution in any significant way. (In other words, human before 10K years ago could not have been eating rice, legumes, wheat, oats, etc. much, because without agriculture, those foods would have hardly been available.) I haven't done a whole lot of research on this point, but I know the assumption is disputed. Some think agriculture began much earlier.
Assumption: No significant evolutionary change in what humans are equipped to eat could have taken place in the last 10,000 years. In some cases, this is demonstrably false; for example, the evolution of lactose tolerance.

I tried a couple of Paleo recipes and liked them--but always added a portion of brown rice, potatoes, or whatever, which means I'm not really eating Paleo. I don't think I'll ever be giving up (what are commonly regarded as) healthy, carbohydrate-dense foods.

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RE: Anyone here tried the paleolithic diet? - 9/30/2011 12:44:51 PM

LaTigresse

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One thing to consider is that..........there are a few years between the Paleo time and now. Humans tend to evolve. I remember a programme I saw once about the dramatic increase in the number of obese Eskimos, in the last few decades, and the struggle they were having in losing the weight. What worked great for some people down here in the lower 48 was not working at all for them, in their weight loss attempts.

Apparently, because so many generations of their people had eaten a certain way, a very high calorie diet composed primarily of seal blubber and whatever else they had been eating, the change in types of foods was the culprit. Their bodies didn't metabolize in the way that humans who's generations of ancestors had been eating differently. They could exercise and eat extremely low calorie, and yet still, be obese. Basically it wasn't how many calories they were eating, but the addition of junk food, processed foods, and all around different foods than their people had been eating since their exposure to the more modern world.

Then the scientists after learning that, began exploring the same issues with other cultures that were more recently modernized and found the same issue. It didn't matter as much what they were eating currently, but that it was dramatically different than what they had been eating previously, in their culture's recent history. If an Eskimo went back to their ancestral diet they lost weight. If a person who's ancestors prior to modernization of junk and processed foods went back to the previous diet, even if it was mostly vegetarian, mostly meat............whatever it was.......they tended to lose the weight.

The problem is the junk and processed stuff that is a very new addition to our human diet. As is the abundance of foods not native to where we live. We simply have too many choices!

And after all that........my point is that for SOME the Paleo diet MIGHT be their current weight balancing diet but if their more recent ancestors ate differently, it might do the opposite.

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RE: Anyone here tried the paleolithic diet? - 9/30/2011 12:52:04 PM

LadyHibiscus

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Besides that the Paleolithic was what, over 10K years ago? Humans lived in all types of environments, and different races really do have different metabolisms. One group of folks might eat fish and seaweed all the time, another group might never see a fruit, another might live on whatever. Burials of local native tribes show utterly rotted teeth--because MAPLE SUGAR was a dietary staple.

It's a fun idea, but it doesnt fly. Just eat a variety of foods, as fresh and unprocessed as possible. Do what your stomach likes (ie if you are ME stay the hell away from raw veg, cooked ONLY) and listen to your cravings.

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RE: Anyone here tried the paleolithic diet? - 9/30/2011 9:47:31 PM

erieangel

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I've given up on diets. I eat when I'm hungry. And I eat what my body is telling me to eat. If that happens to be a piece of chicken, then that's what I eat. If it happens to be something sweet I'm craving, I go for something nutritious and sweet (unless it is chocolate I want). Ice cream--yep, though I prefer frozen yogurt for the taste and texture. Candy, yep. Lots of protein, carbs and fruits and veggies. I tend to lose weight when I eat this way incorporating my favorite foods into 4-6 small meals a day rather than 2-3 larger ones. One of my favorite snacks happens to be saltines and peanut butter. So no paleo-anything for me.

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RE: Anyone here tried the paleolithic diet? - 10/1/2011 5:55:46 AM

Anaxagoras

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quote:

ORIGINAL: NiceGuyNihilist
Well, if the assumptions which undergird the Paleo diet are correct--and that's a big "if"--its advocates may have a pretty good case for it being not a fad diet, but a return to the diet that humans are evolutionarily designed for. Assumption: agriculture did not exist before 10,000 years ago, at least not to such an extent that it impacted human evolution in any significant way. (In other words, human before 10K years ago could not have been eating rice, legumes, wheat, oats, etc. much, because without agriculture, those foods would have hardly been available.) I haven't done a whole lot of research on this point, but I know the assumption is disputed. Some think agriculture began much earlier.
Assumption: No significant evolutionary change in what humans are equipped to eat could have taken place in the last 10,000 years. In some cases, this is demonstrably false; for example, the evolution of lactose tolerance.

Farming appeared in some regions in 8,000 BC but came to most areas a good bit later, especially colder climes like Northern Europe. A few sites in the East show planned cultivation a bit earlier but it didn't take off or seemingly lead to a significant change in lifestyle. Where farming established itself many early farmers still relied on a hunter-gatherer activity to a fair extent. It certainly is right to say that human beings would have changed to some extent since then but would probably be modest given the time frame because the old style hunter-gatherer diet which partly drove the modern human body to evolve into its modern form is thought to have been approximately the same since the times of Homo Erectus.

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RE: Anyone here tried the paleolithic diet? - 10/1/2011 7:18:09 AM

ghita

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I do a zoned version of paleo.....with some minor modifications.

I focus a lot more on the Zone diet...with a darn good attempt at staying away from the processed foods. Which is basically where I see the benefit of "paleo" being. Obviously we are going to have some foods that just arent quite the same as what was available back then....Im not going to go crazy (or broke) insisting that everything I eat have been available 10k years ago. (and dammit I am not giving up ice cream either!!)

I still eat oatmeal every morning, and I still drink coffee. At dinner time I occasionally have a beer (or 6). When Daddy and I go out on datenight, we definitely keep our traditional stop at ColdStone on the way home.

(the beer and ice cream is probably the reason Im still overweight after 3 years of CrossFit and Zone)

But honestly, even though I could definitely stand to lose another 30 pounds, I know I'm HEALTHIER now than Ive ever been before. Ive cleaned out a lot (almost all) of the processed stuff out of my diet, and the diet of my kids. Most of my meals are some sort of lean protien (fish, chicken, turkey, wild game...if your going to go this route, make friends with hunters), with a good portion of veggies (most of the world seems to forget veggies and berries and such are carbs), and a good healthy fat, like nuts. I cut out dairy a LONG time ago (except the ice cream). I just dont think people need it (I eat eggs). Cutting dairy out of my families diet has solved SOOOO many problems. Both medically and oddly, behaviorally. (anyone with ADHD kids, look into the correlation with milk...honest. Im not going to get into a fight about whether or not there is such a thing as ADHD, I think there really is and I dont think cutting dairy is a miracle cure for everyone, but I think a lot of what gets MISTAKEN for ADHD, is actually a diet issue)

I do nutrition plans at work now for people, and while most people come into the gym with the goal of losing x amount of weight, I usually sit down and explain to them that losing weight isnt healthy, look at the fad diets and eating disorders. Once I teach people to just be healthy, I promise them the excess body fat will start to go away. Thats kind of what you get with Zone/Paleo. Depending on your body type/current composition, you may actually be eating MORE than you do now. I see people come in and GAIN weight. But when it comes right down to it, if you actually care about your health, you arent going to give a shit about what the number on the scale says. What you start to care about is your body composition. Zone/Paleo works on that...

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RE: Anyone here tried the paleolithic diet? - 10/1/2011 7:25:02 AM

zephyroftheNorth

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I cut out dairy a LONG time ago (except the ice cream). I just dont think people need it (I eat eggs). Cutting dairy out of my families diet has solved SOOOO many problems.

The problem with this is the need for calcium, at least 50% of which should be from a dietary source. This is what I meant about diets that limit or eliminate one of the food groups. Dairy IS necessary to be truly healthy. I would be careful about doing that especially since pre-menopause and on there is a risk of bone loss.

Zeph

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RE: Anyone here tried the paleolithic diet? - 10/1/2011 7:54:35 AM

ghita

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One cup of milk has 296 mg of calcium.

A cup of collard greens has 357 mg. 2 cups of broccoli has 124mg, Almonds, spinach, sesame seeds, oranges...all have calcium. The almond milk my kids drink has 300mg in a cup. I also occasionally give into things like greek yogurt, which has calcium.

Cutting out cows milk really doesnt mean eliminating a mineral. It just means I need to pay attention to making sure I balance my diet with other sources. Very rarely is there only ONE source for anything the body needs.

~edited cause I called calcium a vitamin...I meant mineral....sigh..its been a long week.

< Message edited by ghita -- 10/1/2011 7:56:26 AM >

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RE: Anyone here tried the paleolithic diet? - 10/1/2011 9:48:09 AM

barelynangel

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I agree ghita,

Most people really don't look into eating plans and just chalk them up as fads or whatnot because they have a "name" instead of just "healthy eating." Which most people have no clue what that is anymore and the idea of what that is varies based on the people you talk to.

I am always amused when people start sputtering how Atkins cuts out all carbs and you need carbs etc etc etc. It elimates certain foods, yes -- it shows you what your body reacts to and how, but in the end.... But even from the beginning it doesn't cut out all carbs. I always challenge people to look at a typical menu from induction and tell me what exactly is unhealthy about it.

MOST people gain weight back or don't do as well as they should on a plan because they don't FOLLOW the plan from start to finish -- sorta like how a lot of people take antibiotics.

Even if a person "starts to eat healthy" or calories in and calories out -- they make changes to what they eat, eliminating certain foods unless its a rare occassion, and attempts to eat a certain type of foods to stay within what they deem eating healthy or cals in and cals out. The thing is a lot of losing weight is mental -- different plans or fads

It's all based on what works for people. I know a couple people who thrive on the paleolithic plan. I thrive on Atkins. Some people thrive on calorie in and calorie out, some people thrive on weighing or "serving size" their foods, some people thrive on low to no fats, some people thrive on what they believe is eating healthy.

The successful people tend to be those that follow the plan as a whole lifechanging eating changing concept. No matter which way they choose to lose weight, or eat well.

A lot of plans help people because the changes are appealing to the person choosing that plan. For some its a fad, for others its not. In the end, you choose what works for you, you choose something that gives you results you want, and you stay on the plan because you decide to make the changes as a whole life concept.

Fad is a fad only if it doesn't work for you. If it works, then just because its not what everyone does or likes etc, doesn't mean its bad or someone shouldn't try it -- it simply means you find what you like and what works for you.

People all over the world eat differently, there is no one "overall" healthy concept.

angel

< Message edited by barelynangel -- 10/1/2011 9:49:02 AM >

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