RE: Demosclerosis?

RE: Demosclerosis? (Full Version)

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samboct -> RE: Demosclerosis? (8/19/2011 6:46:54 AM)
I dunno Firm- the population has increased, and our economy has gotten more diversified. I'm not sure that religions have really multiplied though, and there aren't that many additional ethnic groups immigrating than there were in the past. There's always been a tension between states rights and federal power- why is now any different than some time in the past? Unless you view the past through some rosy colored lenses, our democracy has always been kind of messy. Sam

FirmhandKY -> RE: Demosclerosis? (8/19/2011 11:25:23 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: samboct I dunno Firm- the population has increased, and our economy has gotten more diversified. I'm not sure that religions have really multiplied though, and there aren't that many additional ethnic groups immigrating than there were in the past. There's always been a tension between states rights and federal power- why is now any different than some time in the past? Unless you view the past through some rosy colored lenses, our democracy has always been kind of messy. Sam, I'm a little confused about your mention of religions and ethnic groups. Lobbying groups, ok, they are a symptom of the issue, but a "constituency" is primarily based on a government program or law which benefits them, and then mobilizes to keep such a program or law. Generally at the expense of the wider nation and health of the economy. Each one, individually, may not be deadly. The cumulative affect of many such programs over time, getting entrenched into the government acts like a slow hardening of the arteries for an individual. This can lead to stroke or heart-attack in such an individual, with analogous social disruption to the nation. Firm

samboct -> RE: Demosclerosis? (8/19/2011 12:06:03 PM)
Hi Firm Jeez- what else would you call the lobbying done by the Christian Right against abortion? Democracies wind up with diverse petitioners, ranging from business interests, ecological interests, religious interests, racial interests- all of these groups have their own separate agenda and effectively lobby. However, I certainly disagree with your assertion that constituencies push for government programs which benefit only them and no one else. While it may be true in a few cases- such as rich folks failing to pay their fair share of taxes, I suspect that the effect of most lobbying groups prevents a tyranny of the majority. I have first hand experience with a lobbying group called GOPIO- global organization for people of indian origin. This group has a US presence and gives money to candidates to help ensure that its viewpoint is heard. Issues that are important to this group involve foreign relations with India, immigration status, visa status etc. There's a certain amount of bellyaching about amnesty for illegal aliens, since most Indians are in this country through legal processes and resent that others did not have to comply with the laws that they did. However, is this inimical to the country as a whole? By and large, this group of immigrants is well educated and has established a wide variety of new businesses. Seems to me that they're helping to grow our economy so for the most part, I think their interests and the interests of the country as a whole line up pretty well. Doesn't stop them from lobbying though.... If all the lobbying groups that ever formed were still in existence, I'd agree that the wheels of the government would inexorably grind to a halt. But lobbying requires money and constituents, and these change over time. Unfortunately, with the reduction in wealth mobility, the lobbying needs of a few are getting extremely well entrenched- and that's certainly been to the detriment of the country. Sam

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