Is truth dead?

Is truth dead? (Full Version)

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MstrPBK -> Is truth dead? (10/8/2010 1:47:14 PM)
Small rant/larger subject. I expect this topic to die fast, but I need to clear my head. It has been a bad day here for me. I try to work with a group of persons to set a meeting up. It was my impression that I told them directly what hours I was available and I thought I had told ALL the participants the same information from the same e-mail. The last comment from one of the individuals essentially stated that If I wanted to be on this meeting why can't I clear time that the meeting was set (which is outside my available schedule). I repeated as politely as I could that could not make the meeting because of the other thing on my schedule and they turn it around and call my defense of my schedule 'drama'. I replied with saying that my truth is NOT DRAMA; and that here are 'x' persons who can confirm the event on my schedule. Person B in the group has called my public remarks back to Person A unnecessary and trying to infer that open discussion of truth is out of line to prevent accusations in later comments. If I can not defend what I know is the truth - then what is the use of having truth and sticking to it? Personally I don't get it.

pahunkboy -> RE: Is truth dead? (10/8/2010 2:40:45 PM)
It is hard to arrange things.

DesFIP -> RE: Is truth dead? (10/8/2010 7:28:05 PM)
Your mistake was in telling them why you weren't available. In effect you allowed them to judge whether or not that was important enough for you to go to. Next time you're trying to arrange a meeting just give them a choice of two times. Or announce in the future all meetings will be at Monday at 8 AM.

purepleasure -> RE: Is truth dead? (10/8/2010 7:49:36 PM)
and if you really want to piss them off, announce all future meetings will be Saturday mornings at 6 am, and attendance is mandatory

kdsub -> RE: Is truth dead? (10/8/2010 7:52:39 PM)
I would say your availability for this meeting and their protests have nothing to do with the meeting itself... There are other reasons for their actions... I would take some time to figure out what these reasons are before they affect you personally. Butch

TheHeretic -> RE: Is truth dead? (10/8/2010 9:26:44 PM)
Never get pissy in that kind of reply e-mail, especially if he 'replied all' with it. Get the motherfucker on the phone, deal with his shit, then follow up with a 'reply all' on the original, confirming what you said in the first place. When I need to get a diverse group of "important" people in a room, I start with the two most critical participants, and let everybody else pick, from two or three dates, what works for them. The last asshole who wants to be stumbling block will almost always find a way to make it happen, when you tell him/her to just send a delegate, instead.

NorthernGent -> RE: Is truth dead? (10/9/2010 2:29:35 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MstrPBK Small rant/larger subject. I expect this topic to die fast, but I need to clear my head. It has been a bad day here for me. I try to work with a group of persons to set a meeting up. It was my impression that I told them directly what hours I was available and I thought I had told ALL the participants the same information from the same e-mail. The last comment from one of the individuals essentially stated that If I wanted to be on this meeting why can't I clear time that the meeting was set (which is outside my available schedule). I repeated as politely as I could that could not make the meeting because of the other thing on my schedule and they turn it around and call my defense of my schedule 'drama'. I replied with saying that my truth is NOT DRAMA; and that here are 'x' persons who can confirm the event on my schedule. Person B in the group has called my public remarks back to Person A unnecessary and trying to infer that open discussion of truth is out of line to prevent accusations in later comments. If I can not defend what I know is the truth - then what is the use of having truth and sticking to it? Personally I don't get it. It is worthwhile to have commitment to a principle....in other words stand your ground on something in which you believe.....but...where you do take such a stance then accept that you're not in control of other people's actions and the resulting consequences....so things aren't always going to go your way....no matter how right you think you are..... Seems to me that really 'the truth' (or what I would call commitment to a principle)....isn't important to you.....what you're really concerned about is 'winning'....and I'm afraid that there will definitely be times when you stand by your principle and you certainly don't win....suppose you have to decide which is more important to you.... And....rise above it....as long as you know what's what....then that's what matters...assuming 'the truth' really is important to you.....

NorthernGent -> RE: Is truth dead? (10/9/2010 2:37:44 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DesFIP Your mistake was in telling them why you weren't available. In effect you allowed them to judge whether or not that was important enough for you to go to. Next time you're trying to arrange a meeting just give them a choice of two times. Or announce in the future all meetings will be at Monday at 8 AM. When you're dealing with difficult people.....the best bet is to be as a flexible as possible and actually go round and get times/a few options from them all.....and arrange a meeting when they're all available.... What's important is not that you're bending over backwards to arrange a meeting.....the important thing is that you get them all there so that a decision can be made...... Being flexible around arranging meetings...bending over backwards for people to get them there.....and allowing them their moans about this that and the other....is a small price to pay for your boss recognising that you have what it takes to keep your cool and do what it takes to get a decision through consultation and move forward..... Any boss worth his/her salt will give you short shrift if you can't get a meeting arranged and a decision made.....irrespective of who did what when.... Remember what you're there for....and it ain't to argue about nothing....and yes...you'll need to bite your tongue from time to time....

NorthernGent -> RE: Is truth dead? (10/9/2010 2:53:50 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: TheHeretic Never get pissy in that kind of reply e-mail, especially if he 'replied all' with it. Get the motherfucker on the phone, deal with his shit, then follow up with a 'reply all' on the original, confirming what you said in the first place. When I need to get a diverse group of "important" people in a room, I start with the two most critical participants, and let everybody else pick, from two or three dates, what works for them. The last asshole who wants to be stumbling block will almost always find a way to make it happen, when you tell him/her to just send a delegate, instead. That's a strange one Rich...anyone not important to the meeting shouldn't be there....plain and simple... And never...ever....pull rank with people who you have no authority over....it will piss them off no end...and do that enough times to enough people...and you'll soon find a hostile environment.... Always...be calm....courteous...positive....someone's being difficult....then make sure people see that you're bending over backwards for them.....i.e. give yourself a chance with good PR....because you can guarantee that some difficult people...the game players......are just waiting for you to do something stupid such as pulling rank where you have no rank...so that they can start oiling the wheels with a few like minded conspirators... My advice....is treat everyone the same...no matter how difficult someone is being...don't give 'em a reason to cause you problems....and they may be lower down the food chain.....but it doesn't mean they don't have friends and like minded individuals who can cause you problems.... Oh and OP....if I was your boss then you can guarantee that I'd be dealing with difficult people too....do I really need more problems from someone working for me who can't even arrange a meeting without it descending into sniping and schoolyard fall outs? Remember you're there to make your boss's life as easy as possible....

pahunkboy -> RE: Is truth dead? (10/9/2010 7:28:13 AM)
I organize a group, that we share a paid subscription. I run into guys who say they want in- but then never pay. Anyhow- I chose my words carefully- and among them- I mentioned that if there was not enough interest, and someone else wanted to facilitate- that such would be an option. Once that was know- everyone paid. (because no one wanted to facilitate it)

NuevaVida -> RE: Is truth dead? (10/10/2010 8:01:44 AM)
Gotta agree with NorthernGent here. In coordinating meetings, workgroups, etc., be flexible, don't argue, and work as best as you can with the other team members. Often I need to schedule meetings with large groups of people whose calendars never match up. Using MS Outlook I can see who is available when. If I have to change one of my current meetings to accommodate the other schedules, then I do (if I can). Otherwise I choose a meeting time when the majority of players are available, and tell them something to the effect of, "Due to the size of the group and scheduling conflicts involved, this meeting time was chosen as it had the least number of scheduling conflicts. If you are unable to attend, please forward this meeting request to a representative from your group who can. Meeting notes will be made available to everyone." Or if it's a smaller group, I let them know when the best meeting time is, followed with, "If you have a conflict at this time, please me know what other times might work best for you." Most people realize that meetings are a pain to schedule and there will be times people might have to miss one, due to a conflict. No need for "drama." No need to even respond to accusations of drama. Simply, "Unfortunately I am unable to clear my schedule at that time." Replying to bullshit gets you bullshit.

Musicmystery -> RE: Is truth dead? (10/10/2010 8:24:03 AM)
Never worry about or get involved in "behind the eye balls" stuff. First, you'll drive yourself nuts. Second, you'll accomplish nothing beyond creating a mess. You can't know what other people are thinking or why. In a group business setting, stick to the observable objective facts and goals. And keep your personal stuff personal. More than they need to know. As for where things are now--let it go. Next. Incidentally--your thread title indicates you do in fact have a flair for the dramatic and over-reaction. Reign that back in public. Your "rant" suggests a tendency to hang on to these things. Don't argue with people who aren't there, or rent them space in your head. Life is too short, and other things are far more important and worthy of your mental energy. Hope that helps.

littlewonder -> RE: Is truth dead? (10/10/2010 9:16:56 AM)
regarding past posts of yours you seem to have a thing for drama. Maybe take a look at your life and ask yourself why that is and try to work on cutting that out. You'll find your life will run a lot more smoother. In the future for setting up meetings, tell them this is the time when it will. If they have conflicts then to let you know and you can try to work out a better time. If a better time cannot be worked out then so be it. Make the schedule and stick to it and if someone can't make it then they can find out what is going on from the minutes that are kept.

agirl -> RE: Is truth dead? (10/10/2010 9:27:51 AM)
Am I missing something?..You clearly specified the times you'd be available and wouldn't be outside of that. What is there to discuss? Either you can make the meeting or you can't. agirl

pahunkboy -> RE: Is truth dead? (10/10/2010 10:00:28 AM)
Gosh- I dont recall OP posting about drama. Maybe I missed it.

CalifChick -> RE: Is truth dead? (10/10/2010 10:18:28 AM)
Well it's a catchy title for a thread, but I'm missing the correlation between their perception and opinion of your commitments and "is truth dead". Cali

pahunkboy -> RE: Is truth dead? (10/10/2010 10:42:00 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: CalifChick Well it's a catchy title for a thread, but I'm missing the correlation between their perception and opinion of your commitments and "is truth dead". Cali Good to see you! I missed you.

LaTigresse -> RE: Is truth dead? (10/10/2010 11:25:24 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery Never worry about or get involved in "behind the eye balls" stuff. First, you'll drive yourself nuts. Second, you'll accomplish nothing beyond creating a mess. You can't know what other people are thinking or why. In a group business setting, stick to the observable objective facts and goals. And keep your personal stuff personal. More than they need to know. As for where things are now--let it go. Next. Incidentally--your thread title indicates you do in fact have a flair for the dramatic and over-reaction. Reign that back in public. Your "rant" suggests a tendency to hang on to these things. Don't argue with people who aren't there, or rent them space in your head. Life is too short, and other things are far more important and worthy of your mental energy. Hope that helps. This, and what Northern Gent said. And PA, the entire topic/premise of the thread is drama.

Musicmystery -> RE: Is truth dead? (10/10/2010 6:43:58 PM)
pahb, from the OP... quote: they turn it around and call my defense of my schedule 'drama'. I replied with saying that my truth is NOT DRAMA

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