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at the risk of Lindsey boiling over...... - 5/28/2009 11:57:09 AM   
LadyEllen


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TransLondon announces boycott of Pride London, 2009

In a busy meeting on May 19th, members of TransLondon, London's largest support group for all trans-identified and genderqueer people, voted overwhelmingly for a boycott of the Pride London 2009 march and rally. As a result, for the first time since the group was formed, TransLondon will have no presence in the parade, nor at the rally.

This is part of an ongoing estrangement from Pride. Last year, a successful Pride march was marred at the rally in Trafalgar Square when a number of trans women were denied access to the women's toilets by Pride security stewards. One woman was subsequently sexually assaulted after being told to use the male toilets. Roz Kaveney, one of the women targeted in the 2008 "ToiletGate" incident, explained how she felt Pride London had only ever provided a grudging apology under threat of legal action, and that she felt they had never taken the discrimination against trans women in the 2008 rally seriously.

During the meeting on May 19th 2009, members heard how the democratic and transparent structure used in 2008 to co-ordinate participation of trans groups and the funds made available for transgender attendees, through the elected Trans@Pride committee, has been abolished by Pride London for 2009. Instead, Pride London have imposed their own unelected "representative" for the trans strand. Furthermore, requests for information about funding, how decisions were made and who participated in the decision-making process, have been rebuffed.

Last year, the elected Trans@Pride Committee consulted repeatedly with over a dozen groups and hundreds of individuals over before arranging travel bursaries for trans people to attend from around the country, hosting a breakfast for marchers on the day, commissioning artwork from a local queer artist as a rallying point for trans marchers, producing banners and bunting, arranging trans performers for all of the Pride stages including the main stage in Trafalgar Square and publicising the arrangements widely. In stark contrast, the meeting heard of how Pride London's appointed trans "representative" for 2009 has simply imposed Pride's vision for trans participation in the march and rally.

The 2009 pride participation is, so we are told, to consist of a float at the very back of the parade which would pander to the most tired and inaccurate media stereotypes of trans people. Trans women would, in Pride's vision, be dressed in sequins, high heels and fairy wings and, apparently as an afterthought, a few trans men would be invited to pose in football strips. The Pride representative explained that the trans float would complement a float at the front of the march with members of the cast of the West End musical, "Priscilla, Queen of the Desert". In her vision, onlookers would be delighted to see "Priscilla at the front and Priscilla at the back". As a coup de grace, a visible cordon of security stewards would surround the trans float, ostensibly "for our own protection".

Rather than address the true diversity of the trans community, members of TransLondon felt that participating in such an event would serve only to bolster the kind of negative media stereotypes which portray trans people as "the cast of Grease", and that these undemocratic plans constitute an insult to London's diverse trans community. Sarah Brown, a member of TransLondon, an elected member of Trans@Pride 2008 and co-founder of the London Transfeminist Group said, "If I am to march at Pride, it would be as the lesbian woman I am, not dressed up as a corporate parody".

To determine TransLondon's official position on participation in Pride London 2009, three options were put to the vote:

Option one, to participate in the march under the terms we felt were being dictated by the Pride London board, received no votes.

Option two, to participate in the march independently of the "official" trans strand, as a form of direct action to show our dissatisfaction, received 31% of the votes cast.

Option three, to boycott the parade and rally received 65% of the votes cast.

There were some abstentions from members who wanted to see what their friends in other groups were doing before making a decision.

The democratic decision of the membership of TransLondon is therefore that the organisation will have no official presence or banner at Pride London, 2009.

Christina Alley, co-organiser of TransLondon and elected member of Trans@Pride 2008 said, "Volunteers from a dozen trans groups worked incredibly hard for Pride last year. Members of TransLondon are extremely disappointed at being betrayed, marginalised and stereotyped in this way by Pride. Members have made their disappointment clear in a democratic vote to boycott this year's march and rally."

TransLondon is keen to hear from other trans groups, allies and any groups from other parts of the LGBTQ community who also feel disenfranchised by Pride London this year. We would like to discuss alternative arrangements for a celebration of the diversity of the LGBTQ community, free from cynical corporate politics, where we can enjoy the true spirit of Pride.

Reactions to TransLondon's announcement:

We were extremely proud to march with TransLondon in the parade last year along with dozens of other groups and individuals of all ages and backgrounds. As a result of this announcement we are devastated this display of unity won't be repeated this year. The only official offer of "support" from Pride this year has an offer to send a selection of our own members to be part of their separate and official "Trans Float" which we have already objected to on the same grounds as TransLondon. So we've had to seek funding for banner-making and costumes elsewhere as Pride London seem unwilling to hand any over.
We are currently reviewing our involvement in the parade pending the outcome of further consultation with our membership. Regardless of the outcome we remain committed to supporting safe, inclusive spaces for ALL trans young people even if many of our individual members decide to support a boycott.
Statement from Trans Youth Network http://www.transyouth.org
Queer Youth Network members are still committed to participating in the parade because pride is often the first time they have had the chance to actually be out in public as a group so we will support anyone who wishes to do that. Some of our volunteers who have previously taken a break from their duties in order to assist Pride have decided not to offer their services as stewards this year. We appreciate the level of hard work that has gone in to organising the youth at pride activities and events, however we also accept they won't appeal to everyone so our main focus will be supporting inclusive, grass roots events that bring all of our community together regardless of their identity. We have decided not to take part in the rally in Trafalgar Square and we will not be having a stall as we can't afford the fees and most of us will be heading to Hyde Park instead.

Statement from Queer Youth Network http://www.queeryouth.org.uk
I fully support this boycott. I am sad to announce that Trans Ebony will not take part in Pride London this year. This would have been my first very pride in England having visited events all over the world. I was intending to enter a float for our group and was even told we could get some funding.

Pride London has the potential to offer a unique platform to showcase those normally ignored by the mainstream. As a struggling black transgendered artist I'm actually feeling incredibly angry towards those in charge of the festival. I was equally distressed to hear black and asian people have now been removed from the decision making process last week according to UNISON and LGBT Muslim group IMAAN.

Deliberately closing so many doors on so many people does nothing but add to the multitude of prejudices trans ebony members live with every day of their lives. I accept we are a normally silent minority but that doesn't change the fact London's pride management have betrayed the very history it owes its existence to.



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RE: at the risk of Lindsey boiling over...... - 5/28/2009 1:15:01 PM   
popeye1250


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LE, not surprising, there seems to be a lot of animus between the two groups.

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RE: at the risk of Lindsey boiling over...... - 5/28/2009 1:26:46 PM   
LadyEllen


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I find it rather encouraging in some ways - ie, these particular LGB people seem to see Trans as stereotypes. Given I dont conform to those stereotypes, ergo they must hold me to be a genuine female rather than a trans female!

Interesting thought; if I dispense of my habitual jeans and T-shirt and instead wear pink frilly lacy stuff with fetish heels, I too could become a trannie!

E

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RE: at the risk of Lindsey boiling over...... - 5/28/2009 1:58:28 PM   
Rule


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I support the boycott.

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RE: at the risk of Lindsey boiling over...... - 5/28/2009 2:30:35 PM   
DreamGoddess666


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Good people will never be the majority in this world. I've lost all hope for humanity.

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RE: at the risk of Lindsey boiling over...... - 5/28/2009 6:01:35 PM   
TheHeretic


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        I don't know what it is, LadyE, but there is some kind of weird vibe between the gay/lesbian and transvestite/transwhichever community, whenever it makes it onto my radar.  Quite the opposite here, from what you describe in London.  I'm going from hearsay and scuttlebutt, but it seems the local 'center' has become dominated by a trans clique, and much of the rest of the GLB community wants nothing to do with them, and Pride is going to be a colossal flop this year.  Not an organized boycott, just a general lack of interest.

     

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RE: at the risk of Lindsey boiling over...... - 5/28/2009 6:11:13 PM   
marie2


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DreamGoddess666

Good people will never be the majority in this world. I've lost all hope for humanity.


Good people are the majority.  You're just not looking for them. 

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RE: at the risk of Lindsey boiling over...... - 5/28/2009 7:50:03 PM   
DomImus


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Option four: unisex potties.

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RE: at the risk of Lindsey boiling over...... - 5/28/2009 9:48:02 PM   
popeye1250


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DreamGoddess666

Good people will never be the majority in this world. I've lost all hope for humanity.


Oh Boo Hoo Hoo, get out there and crack some skulls!

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RE: at the risk of Lindsey boiling over...... - 5/28/2009 10:13:40 PM   
VioletGray


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I wish I were in England, just so I could NOT go to this event!

But as it stands, I'll just have to not go to it from here!

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RE: at the risk of Lindsey boiling over...... - 5/28/2009 10:18:00 PM   
ThatDamnedPanda


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quote:

ORIGINAL: VioletGray

I wish I were in England, just so I could NOT go to this event!

But as it stands, I'll just have to not go to it from here!



Just think of the money you'll save by not going to it from here. If you flew all the way to England to not go to it, it'd cost a fortune.


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RE: at the risk of Lindsey boiling over...... - 5/29/2009 12:51:30 AM   
ShellyD


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I have to admit that I am surprised that there is such a divide between the gay and lesbian and the trans communities and I do not understand why. Alternative sexuality/gender people used to be untited and support each other, at least in my close outsider perspective, I have both 2 family members and many friends who are gay/lesbian and although I know personally only one transgender person I cannot see why there is such a divide in unity, could someone please explain why, or is it pretty obvious and I have just missed it?

All that the previous thread on this issue did was to show me there is a problem, not what is at the core of the issue.

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RE: at the risk of Lindsey boiling over...... - 5/29/2009 3:14:47 AM   
DreamGoddess666


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I wish I knew why. I don't understand it myself, I truly don't.

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RE: at the risk of Lindsey boiling over...... - 5/29/2009 4:11:00 AM   
sirsholly


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DreamGoddess666

Good people will never be the majority in this world. I've lost all hope for humanity.
How sad this is. How much you have to learn.

Good people are the majority.

I cannot help but feel your bitch is there will never be a majority in this world that agree with you.


< Message edited by sirsholly -- 5/29/2009 4:13:17 AM >


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RE: at the risk of Lindsey boiling over...... - 5/29/2009 4:34:05 AM   
sirsholly


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quote:

ORIGINAL: VioletGray

I wish I were in England, just so I could NOT go to this event!

But as it stands, I'll just have to not go to it from here!

i am not going either, so we can not go together.

What won't we wear?


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RE: at the risk of Lindsey boiling over...... - 5/29/2009 5:42:25 AM   
NorthernGent


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quote:

ORIGINAL: marie2

quote:

ORIGINAL: DreamGoddess666

Good people will never be the majority in this world. I've lost all hope for humanity.


Good people are the majority.  You're just not looking for them. 



It's interesting how people think - I would say that there's no such thing as a good or bad person.

3 different approaches - none are necessarily more representative of the world.

It would be interesting to hear how people have arrived at their conclusions.

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RE: at the risk of Lindsey boiling over...... - 5/29/2009 6:08:32 AM   
MissDominae


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This decision by London Pride is so very sad and so totally unwarranted.   If something of the same sort was tried here in Melbourne, Australia there would be a HUGE uproar .... and it wouldn't be trans folk leading it~!   The entire LBGTIQ alphabet soup - with the exception, as always, of the lunatic fringe -  would see this an awful thing to do.

In October 2000, a committee of which I was part (the AGMAC, or Attorney General's Ministerial Advisory Committee) managed to have the Gender Recognition Act promulgated by the State Government.   Amongst its many anti-discrimination laws and regulations is one which specifically gives the legislated right for any trans person who lives full time in their affirmed sex to use the public amenities of the sex they affirm and makes it an offence to refuse that right or make the person exercising that right in any way uncomfortable.

Had this situation arisen in Australia, (and forgetting for a moment that for it to have done so would be a breach of law) I would also have refused to participate in any way.   People like myself and Lady Ellen have the distinct advantage that no one would ever query our right to be in female toilets, changerooms and the like but that right should not be conferred purely based on looks or passability or it is meaningless.

Lindsey - and others - the vast majority of any community are good and fair minded people.   If for no other reason than that they are far more interested in their own issues than they will ever be in ours, they give us a fair go.   If that were not the case then none of us could ever leave our homes without being at substantial risk and, frankly, I don't feel any risk when I go out over and above the risk which any female faces.  Neither do my close intersexed and transsexed friends  What was done to the trans folk in London was horrible but let's not write off the great bulk of humanity based on that incident or even a series of incidents.  

We are a part of our communities - we can't just "lose hope for humanity" - we ARE humanity; every bit as much as gay people, straight people, black people and so on are part of humanity.   It isn't perfect, I'm not perfect and none of us are perfect, but dismissing the community we live in as a lost cause will never help us edge that little bit closer to perfection.



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RE: at the risk of Lindsey boiling over...... - 5/29/2009 8:45:08 AM   
RedMagic1


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quote:

ORIGINAL: marie2

quote:

ORIGINAL: DreamGoddess666

Good people will never be the majority in this world. I've lost all hope for humanity.


Good people are the majority.  You're just not looking for them. 

Or they're staying away from you in droves because of the energy you put out.


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RE: at the risk of Lindsey boiling over...... - 5/30/2009 7:17:48 AM   
LadyEllen


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why this division and apparent animosity?

I would venture it comes out of a few strands;
1) ultra feminist lesbians (the bane not only of trans women but of just about everyone they come into contact with!) having undue influence over proceedings
2) general confusion even within the comparatively small universe of LGBT as to what the differences are between recreational crossdressers and people who have taken action to resolve definite gender identity issues
3) the fact that trans women like me wouldnt be seen dead anywhere near all this activist stuff - after all my ability to lead a normal life relies on being and appearing normal - leading to an imbalanced approach overall. aside from that selfishness, I wonder what role I'd have?
4) the fact that trans women who do struggle in life are likely to be more involved and a lot louder and more angry - turning others off and leading others to believe that trans = stereotype and by association, crossdresser, therefore male

From those strands, the LGBT "community" at large is only ever going to think one thing of the T, and act accordingly in its decision making.

Ultimately I believe, the problem is that the T is not one single identity but a whole range of identities - and whilst the LGB is all about sexuality, only a small proportion of the T is about sexuality. My own opinion is, that for those with gender identity issues the LGBT "community" is just about the worst place to try to find a home with, since it will naturally be dominated by those interested in sexuality and perceiving the world through that view. Add to that that most of the T the LGB come into contact with they meet for reasons of sexuality and that will determine the majority view - that we are all drag queens and the like and should be quite happy to be treated as such.

E


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RE: at the risk of Lindsey boiling over...... - 5/30/2009 11:00:59 PM   
BrokenSaint


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DreamGoddess666

Good people will never be the majority in this world. I've lost all hope for humanity.


Therein lies the rub. People are people. Not saints, not sinners. They will be what they will be. They will have what opinions they will. Sometimes they will change, more often than not, people don't. Methinx once you stop seeing people in terms of absolutes (which no offense it seems like you do), you'll find things aren't so simple.

Besides, are people who can't handle the fact you used to be a dude when you do actually mention it (which really is something you generally I'd assume you don't bust out when you first meet them, as I would not be like Hi, I like to tie people up without knowing people for a bit, but who knows), then are they really worthwhile hanging around? You're you. They either like you for you, or they don't. Circumstances, past events, really shouldn't have entirely much bearing on liking someone's personality. That you've ran into a bunch certainly doesn't mean everyone is an asshole. Reality does tend to follow a bell curve.

Also, animosity between the two groups seems more a matter of politics really. The bathroom thing someone should have really thought about. I mean, that's one of the first things that should have popped into the organizers minds. Because you're probably going to have people there that are pre-op, and people that are post-op, etc. Now granted if they're porta-potties....then the whole shebang doesn't make entirely too much sense. Those are like....private....soooo...yeah. But it would have been understandable to discuss beforehand to avoid a major gaffe in relations.

So the question is....why not just ask for a different float? Still in the parade? What better way to showcase diversity in the community, by showing it, rather than doing nothing? I may be missing something there though.


< Message edited by BrokenSaint -- 5/30/2009 11:12:52 PM >


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