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Clinton: US shares blame for Mexican drug wars - 3/25/2009 10:20:34 PM   
Nosathro


Posts: 3319
Joined: 9/25/2005
From: Orange County, California
Status: offline 		Hillary now say the US is partly responsible for Mexico Drug War.  Forget the years of Mexico corrupt government and police force that allowed the Drug Gangs to operate at will in Mexico.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090326/ap_on_go_ca_st_pe/clinton_mexico

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RE: Clinton: US shares blame for Mexican drug wars - 3/25/2009 11:17:04 PM   
slaveboyforyou


Posts: 3607
Joined: 1/6/2005
From: Arkansas, U.S.A.
Status: offline 		As much as I dislike Mrs. Clinton, she's right.  We do share part of the blame for Mexican drug cartels.  Americans fund their operations.  The huge amounts of money they have to bribe public officials and fund their private armies don't come from Guatemalan junkies buying their product.  It comes almost exclusively from our people buying it. 

I don't blame the Mexican police; they are payed poverty wages and they are targeted.  The crooked ones get paid more than they make in a year for looking the other way.  The honest ones get murdered brutally along with their family members in many cases. 

For almost a century, we've waged war on domestic drug production.  We have the largest prison population in the world to prove it.  We aren't any closer to eradicating drug use than we ever were. 

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RE: Clinton: US shares blame for Mexican drug wars - 3/26/2009 3:03:04 AM   
VanessaChaland


Posts: 362
Joined: 11/23/2008
Status: offline 		Supply and demand. The free market system. The policies of the USA are very detrimental to many millions (if not billions) of people all over the globe.
Sadly, (and I hate to admit this) this might be the first time Hillary was right about anything. Ever. :)

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RE: Clinton: US shares blame for Mexican drug wars - 3/26/2009 4:05:49 AM   
StrangerThan


Posts: 1515
Joined: 4/25/2008
Status: offline 		I'll echo the sentiment here in that I don't care for Hiliary, but she is right in this instance. The cartels would probably still exist if it weren't for us, but they would not have nearly the capability to essentially wage war. Face it, we're the only nation on this side of the world with the cash to give them that kind of buying power and we have an insatiable appetite for what they produce. That situation translates into a lot of money in an economy where many are destitute. I didn't read the story at the end of the link because I think I read it yesterday. If it's the same one, Mexico is listed as one of the two states most likely to fall in the coming year. Usually, even in a bad situation, you can find a bright spot. The only one I can see in this one is that they're mostly fighting themselves and have not coalesced into a cohesive resistance force.

I also believe in the sentiment you expressed regarding years of corruption and inept government. There is a lot of debate about immigrants jumping the border to work jobs in the US. I don't want to get into the bulk of it, but I've wondered for a long time if we were not essentially bleeding off the people who would and could make a difference in the same way a relief valve lets off steam when the pressures get too high. I think the US has been a relief valve for failed governments and failed policies by giving those who were willing to work for a better way of life an out as much as it gave them an option.

Most immigrants I've dealt with have been honest and hard working people, good people who left families behind and ship money home to support them. It creates a tenable situation rather than one that forces real econmic and social change. It creates a shadow economy and an alternate way of life that doesn't force governments to be accountable - not that the US government is accountable by any stretch of the imagination, but the difference is I think, there is a point here where many would eventually stand up and say enough. We're a spoiled nation in many ways. As long as that spoiled status quo can be somewhat maintained, there will never be enough of a popular uprising to say enough (well, maybe over bonuses - eyeroll.) Mexico needs us to be their relief valve. The government there knows it and I think that knowledge drives their defense of workers crossing the border as much as any humanitarian thought they might have.

Dunno.

What I do know is that the US can't fix its own drug problem. Hell, I'd guess we have more people addicted to prescription drugs than we do illegal drugs.


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RE: Clinton: US shares blame for Mexican drug wars - 3/26/2009 4:16:40 AM   
rulemylife


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quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveboyforyou

For almost a century, we've waged war on domestic drug production.  We have the largest prison population in the world to prove it.  We aren't any closer to eradicating drug use than we ever were. 


Maybe it's time to legalize it and put those drug profits back into our own economy.

At least for marijuana.

Not to mention the tax savings from not imprisoning non-violent drug offenders.

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RE: Clinton: US shares blame for Mexican drug wars - 3/26/2009 10:51:44 AM   
Vendaval


Posts: 10297
Joined: 1/15/2005
Status: offline 		Fast Reply -
 
Basic economic principles of supply and demand apply here, without a demand there would be no need for suppliers.  And if this was not an illegal trade then we would not have an abundance of  kidnappings, beheadings, gun running, gangstas, over flowing prisons and jails, clogged court systems, etc.

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RE: Clinton: US shares blame for Mexican drug wars - 3/26/2009 3:16:13 PM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline 		Another reason to shut that Mexican border down tighter than Hillary's asshole.

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RE: Clinton: US shares blame for Mexican drug wars - 3/26/2009 3:23:49 PM   
domiguy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

Another reason to shut that Mexican border down tighter than Hillary's asshole.


Aren't you supposed to be on a date?

They would get through.  You can hear the Americans chanting from the other side of the wall, "Gimme drugs! Gimme drugs! Gimme drugs! Gimme drugs! Gimme drugs! Gimme drugs! Gimme drugs!Gimme drugs! Gimme drugs!

Just legalize the shit.

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RE: Clinton: US shares blame for Mexican drug wars - 3/26/2009 3:54:16 PM   
Crush


Posts: 1031
Status: offline 		Legalize it.  Let it join alcohol and tobacco on the shelves. 

Let's face it; it will be easier to implement the 'new society' with a bunch of stoners.

AND tighten up the borders in BOTH directions.

Our problem has been the ineffective and overdone enforcement on a relatively harmless weed.




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RE: Clinton: US shares blame for Mexican drug wars - 3/26/2009 4:37:27 PM   
philosophy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Crush

it will be easier to implement the 'new society' with a bunch of stoners.



....yup, after all, those stoners back in the 60's barely even noticed Vietnam.......good job none of them got organised or protested anything.......

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RE: Clinton: US shares blame for Mexican drug wars - 3/26/2009 5:56:37 PM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline 		So then, all of us people that have *never* done drugs are somehow "responsable" for this?
She's a fuckin idiot!
What would she do, more money to Mexico? Try to "understand" them more?
We haven't had a war on drugs yet!
In wars a lot of people get killed.
If we had total control of that border and had it shut down like N. Korea's border we wouldn't be having this problem would we?
You do things her way and in 50 years the problem will still be there only worse!

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RE: Clinton: US shares blame for Mexican drug wars - 3/26/2009 8:00:52 PM   
Vendaval


Posts: 10297
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Status: offline 		Even with the land border shut down there would be planes and boats moving product.

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RE: Clinton: US shares blame for Mexican drug wars - 3/26/2009 8:50:59 PM   
Honsoku


Posts: 422
Joined: 6/26/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveboyforyou

As much as I dislike Mrs. Clinton, she's right. We do share part of the blame for Mexican drug cartels. Americans fund their operations. The huge amounts of money they have to bribe public officials and fund their private armies don't come from Guatemalan junkies buying their product. It comes almost exclusively from our people buying it.

I don't blame the Mexican police; they are payed poverty wages and they are targeted. The crooked ones get paid more than they make in a year for looking the other way. The honest ones get murdered brutally along with their family members in many cases.

For almost a century, we've waged war on domestic drug production. We have the largest prison population in the world to prove it. We aren't any closer to eradicating drug use than we ever were.


Seconded.

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RE: Clinton: US shares blame for Mexican drug wars - 3/27/2009 3:13:28 AM   
blacksword404


Posts: 2068
Joined: 1/4/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Vendaval

Even with the land border shut down there would be planes and boats moving product.


Oh we could shoot those planes down, blow those drug boats up.

I don't like Hilaries logic. America demands drugs and the drug problem is our fault, mexico demands guns from us and it's our fault? You can't have it both ways.

Rilassarsi

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RE: Clinton: US shares blame for Mexican drug wars - 3/27/2009 10:14:04 AM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: blacksword404

quote:

ORIGINAL: Vendaval

Even with the land border shut down there would be planes and boats moving product.


Oh we could shoot those planes down, blow those drug boats up.

I don't like Hilaries logic. America demands drugs and the drug problem is our fault, mexico demands guns from us and it's our fault? You can't have it both ways.

Rilassarsi


Blacksword, correct. What's that saying about trying to please everyone?
We need to get over that type of Hillary stinking thinking that Mexico or Colombia are our "friends", they're not!

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RE: Clinton: US shares blame for Mexican drug wars - 3/27/2009 10:25:35 AM   
kdsub


Posts: 12180
Joined: 8/16/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveboyforyou

For almost a century, we've waged war on domestic drug production.  We have the largest prison population in the world to prove it.  We aren't any closer to eradicating drug use than we ever were. 


Maybe it's time to legalize it and put those drug profits back into our own economy.

At least for marijuana.

Not to mention the tax savings from not imprisoning non-violent drug offenders.



Maybe it's time for weak people to get a backbone...if you can't live without an altered reality then stick your head in a bucket of water and save your family some grief.

Butch

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RE: Clinton: US shares blame for Mexican drug wars - 3/27/2009 10:28:32 AM   
philosophy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

Maybe it's time for weak people to get a backbone...if you can't live without an altered reality then stick your head in a bucket of water and save your family some grief.



...so i assume you don't take alcohol, drink coffee or tea?


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RE: Clinton: US shares blame for Mexican drug wars - 3/27/2009 10:51:46 AM   
kdsub


Posts: 12180
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quote:

ORIGINAL: philosophy

quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

Maybe it's time for weak people to get a backbone...if you can't live without an altered reality then stick your head in a bucket of water and save your family some grief.



...so i assume you don't take alcohol, drink coffee or tea?



I knew someone would bring that up...just surprised you would...you forgot cigarettes.

Too late to make tea…coffee…alcohol illegal… I hope they do make cigarettes illegal and I think they will.

How many ways do we need to kill ourselves.. I know lets make all drugs legal…shoot throw in machineguns too while we’re at it…hey why stop there lets let Gerber start putting cocaine in baby food. Coke would be worth a shit again.

Just think of all the new business at hospitals…blown brains and hearts…head bashing is always fun to watch after angel dust… I’m sure you will not mind the increase in your healthcare.. oh I forgot you don’t care with your healthcare system.

But hey just think of all the grandparents that will get to raise their grandkids because their kids are strung out of free drugs… Hey I think stoned kids cry less… but darn they do kill more when they grow up.

Just think our daughters will be easy now…just drop a few drops of drugs in her drink and take her home for a good time.

I could go on…but you get the idea.. I HOPE.

Butch

< Message edited by kdsub -- 3/27/2009 11:00:27 AM >

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RE: Clinton: US shares blame for Mexican drug wars - 3/27/2009 10:54:45 AM   
philosophy


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Joined: 2/15/2004
Status: offline 		...so, in other words you're perfectly fine with those who use a legal substance to enjoy an altered reality...but if it's an illegal one you want them to drown themselves.

...nice.

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RE: Clinton: US shares blame for Mexican drug wars - 3/27/2009 10:58:54 AM   
kdsub


Posts: 12180
Joined: 8/16/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: philosophy

...so, in other words you're perfectly fine with those who use a legal substance to enjoy an altered reality...but if it's an illegal one you want them to drown themselves.

...nice.


Did you read my response... the answer was there... Legalizing drugs is not practical or ethical… it’s not going to happen so quit wasting time and lives and come up with better answers that have a chance of helping.

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