RE: More of your tax dollars at work

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slvemike4u -> RE: More of your tax dollars at work (3/24/2009 3:17:47 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Kirata quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u Extremely funny...and you managed to avoid the question at the same time... Glad you liked it. And, of course, I don't know the answers either. But that's rather the point. There's nothing here for anybody to be going off the deep end over yet. K. Well in an earlier post you made mention of a lynch party,now it is a case of going off the deep end.Please point out where anyone suggested getting a rope....or sounded like they were "going off the deep end".

Kirata -> RE: More of your tax dollars at work (3/24/2009 3:28:01 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: rulemylife A month or so ago JP Morgan Chase claimed it couldn't determine where the TARP funds went because its assets were co-mingled and the government funds were not separated. Ah, interesting... I missed that. You might haven't mentioned it sooner. quote: ORIGINAL: rulemylife Mike Dolphin, president of fixed-based operator Avitat Westchester, is fighting the bank's grand plans – because he says JPMorgan's proposed expansion would force his company out of the hangar the bank is eyeing. I don't blame him for fighting it, and good luck to him, but what has it to do with anything? Do you think that makes JPMorgan a "bad guy"? The business world is a game of hardball. That's why a lot of people prefer other careers. Mike Dolphin knows the game. He isn't complaining about the rules. He has options, to fight it being one of them, and as things go forward he'll make the calls as he sees them, win or lose. K.

rulemylife -> RE: More of your tax dollars at work (3/24/2009 3:29:38 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Kirata Well first of all, if you want to be competitive on the level at which JPMorgan does business, you need to have things like private corporate jets. It's a cost of doing business. You wanna be a farmer, you buy a tractor. You wanna be an international bank, don't buy a tractor. Oh trust me, I'm a firm believer in the benefits of corporate aviation to companies. They already have a fleet of four. All relatively new. So I have to ask the same question again, slightly modified. If you are going to loan me money to pay my mortgage and I go out and buy a new car when the car I have is only three years-old and in in good shape, wouldn't you be a little pissed off? quote: And the "taxpayers" in this scenario are represented by their government, which provided the money and set the terms. Are you faulting JPMorgan for following those terms? I say that, of course, bearing in mind that there is no evidence at hand to indicate that they haven't. If it turns up, I'll be standing right beside you. K. Did they set the terms? Using the example above would you have thought, before loaning me money, to question every single possibility of how I might misuse that loan?

Kirata -> RE: More of your tax dollars at work (3/24/2009 3:33:14 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u Please point out where anyone suggested getting a rope....or sounded like they were "going off the deep end". Maybe you didn't bother to read the story at the original link, eh? Outraged Critics Decry the Proposal, Call For Bank To Abandon Plans For further reference, see metaphor. K.

slvemike4u -> RE: More of your tax dollars at work (3/24/2009 3:41:03 PM)
Outraged critics= lynch party...aha I see it now. As I recall you got plenty outraged over a recent bill introduced on the floor of the House.When I suggested this was a case of much to do about nothing....you took me to the woodshed,stating (and I paraphrase here) that you weren't about to be found sleeping when your rights were being threatened.This would seem to be a little contradictory.

rulemylife -> RE: More of your tax dollars at work (3/24/2009 3:57:53 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Kirata I don't blame him for fighting it, and good luck to him, but what has it to do with anything? Do you think that makes JPMorgan a "bad guy"? The business world is a game of hardball. That's why a lot of people prefer other careers. Mike Dolphin knows the game. He isn't complaining about the rules. He has options, to fight it being one of them, and as things go forward he'll make the calls as he sees them, win or lose. But again, this is not a case of business-to-business competition on a fair level. This is a company receiving government funds, ostensibly to keep it afloat, while it is trying to acquire an unnecessary luxury that would severely damage another smaller company not receiving the benefit of government funds.

Kirata -> RE: More of your tax dollars at work (3/24/2009 4:02:08 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: rulemylife If you are going to loan me money to pay my mortgage and I go out and buy a new car when the car I have is only three years-old and in in good shape, wouldn't you be a little pissed off? No! Why should I be? If I agree to loan you money, I just want you to pay me back. If I am satisfied that you are creditworthy, I don't care whether you want take a cruise to the Caribbean or buy a swamp. That's your business. More to the point, though, if you are a business, strapped because you're carrying a lot of debt on your books, and the government says hey, we need you funtioning normally through this situation, we'll provide you with enough liquidity to continue to function, then it seem to me reasonable to think that that's what they expect you to do. K.

Kirata -> RE: More of your tax dollars at work (3/24/2009 4:08:06 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: rulemylife But again, this is not a case of business-to-business competition on a fair level. Oh, you want life to be fair. I see now. Don't we all. Maybe we need somebody powerful in charge to make sure everything is fair. Wait, that's a parent. How old are we? quote: ORIGINAL: rulemylife This is a company receiving government funds, ostensibly to keep it afloat, while it is trying to acquire an unnecessary luxury You keep harping on extravagance and "unnecessary luxury". But I haven't seen you present any cogent basis for that judgment besides your personal opinion in the matter. Which, by the way, I'm willing to respect. Just not as a "fact". K.

Kirata -> RE: More of your tax dollars at work (3/24/2009 4:16:24 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u you took me to the woodshed Keep your pants up, I will never take you to a woodshed or anyplace else. Or wait, did you just use metaphor!!? Damn, I bet you knew those were metaphors in my posts all along didn't you. Edited to add: Joking aside, maybe you have a point. And I need to get some dinner anyway. Carry on. K.

rulemylife -> RE: More of your tax dollars at work (3/24/2009 4:20:16 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Kirata No! Why should I be? If I agree to loan you money, I just want you to pay me back. If I am satisfied that you are creditworthy, I don't care whether you want take a cruise to the Caribbean or buy a swamp. That's your business. More to the point, though, if you are a business, strapped because you're carrying a lot of debt on your books, and the government says hey, we need you funtioning normally through this situation, we'll provide you with enough liquidity to continue to function, then it seem to me reasonable to think that that's what they expect you to do. K. So, you would loan me money, on my creditworthy basis? That's great! How about if the company I owned was teetering on the verge of bankruptcy? Would I still be as creditworthy? And If I used the money you loaned me, because I was unable to make my mortgage payment, to take a Caribbean cruise would that raise any red flags for you?

slvemike4u -> RE: More of your tax dollars at work (3/24/2009 4:20:21 PM)
Okay Kirata,that was funny...enjoy your dinner.....lol

rulemylife -> RE: More of your tax dollars at work (3/24/2009 4:26:05 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Kirata You keep harping on extravagance and "unnecessary luxury". But I haven't seen you present any cogent basis for that judgment besides your personal opinion in the matter. Which, by the way, I'm willing to respect. Just not as a "fact". K. A cogent basis huh. A rooftop garden on an airplane hangar? Quarry tile floors in said hangar? Come on now!

slvemike4u -> RE: More of your tax dollars at work (3/24/2009 5:40:26 PM)
ROFLMAO!!!!!!!

LookieNoNookie -> RE: More of your tax dollars at work (3/24/2009 5:49:37 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Kirata Obama has said that spending is what "stimulating the economy" means, the government shovels out cash exhorting, "Go forth and stimulate!" and then every time somebody actually spends a dime of it y'all scream bloody fucking murder. When did the aircraft and construction industries stop being part of the economy? K. :)

Kirata -> RE: More of your tax dollars at work (3/24/2009 6:01:49 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: rulemylife A cogent basis huh. A rooftop garden on an airplane hangar? Quarry tile floors in said hangar? Come on now! With respect to the quarry tile, the environmentally significant and cost-relevant word you omitted is "reclaimed". As for the rooftop garden, you make a point of the building's function in ridiculing the idea. But the function of the building is irrelevant. The "green roof" is an environmentally beneficial feature. Green Roofs (general) Research (1) Research (2) K.

DesFIP -> RE: More of your tax dollars at work (3/24/2009 6:16:34 PM)
They're talking about replacing the jets by 2013, four years down the road. Although if they sold some of their art collection, which is spectacular, they could do all this out of pocket change.

rulemylife -> RE: More of your tax dollars at work (3/24/2009 6:38:15 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Kirata quote: ORIGINAL: rulemylife A cogent basis huh. A rooftop garden on an airplane hangar? Quarry tile floors in said hangar? Come on now! With respect to the quarry tile, the environmentally significant and cost-relevant word you omitted is "reclaimed". As for the rooftop garden, you make a point of the building's function in ridiculing the idea. But the function of the building is irrelevant. The "green roof" is an environmentally beneficial feature. Green Roofs (general) Research (1) Research (2) K. Well I have to say it again. Come on now. You're really stretching to try and justify this.

LookieNoNookie -> RE: More of your tax dollars at work (3/24/2009 7:12:16 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: rulemylife quote: ORIGINAL: Kirata quote: ORIGINAL: rulemylife A cogent basis huh. A rooftop garden on an airplane hangar? Quarry tile floors in said hangar? Come on now! With respect to the quarry tile, the environmentally significant and cost-relevant word you omitted is "reclaimed". As for the rooftop garden, you make a point of the building's function in ridiculing the idea. But the function of the building is irrelevant. The "green roof" is an environmentally beneficial feature. Green Roofs (general) Research (1) Research (2) K. Well I have to say it again. Come on now. You're really stretching to try and justify this. Actually, his (Kirata's) argument is flawless. You don't have to agree with the argument...but 168 million spent in any number of ways is going to create a shitload of jobs regardless of opinion. When you consider all the technology involved (software, hardware, GPS, vector controls, composites)...it's more than a bunch (of jobs). Simply because the average person can't afford...or will never ride in...a C5....is no reason to disallow the argument.

rulemylife -> RE: More of your tax dollars at work (3/24/2009 7:39:20 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LookieNoNookie Actually, his (Kirata's) argument is flawless. Well thanks, I was pretty confused, but you've set me straight now. quote: You don't have to agree with the argument...but 168 million spent in any number of ways is going to create a shitload of jobs regardless of opinion. No kidding? How is it going to create jobs when 70 people received $1 million each and I believe it was six that received in excess of $4 million. Who are they going to employ? Oh, wait, I get it. Their money will "trickle down" to everyone else. Sorry, been there, done that, didn't work. quote: When you consider all the technology involved (software, hardware, GPS, vector controls, composites)...it's more than a bunch (of jobs). Simply because the average person can't afford...or will never ride in...a C5....is no reason to disallow the argument. No reason at all, because I have no idea what the hell you just said. (BTW, the AIG argument was a different thread, this was about JPMorgan, which you seem not to have bothered to read)

LookieNoNookie -> RE: More of your tax dollars at work (3/25/2009 5:29:26 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: rulemylife quote: ORIGINAL: LookieNoNookie Actually, his (Kirata's) argument is flawless. Well thanks, I was pretty confused, but you've set me straight now. quote: You don't have to agree with the argument...but 168 million spent in any number of ways is going to create a shitload of jobs regardless of opinion. No kidding? (No...really!) How is it going to create jobs when 70 people received $1 million each and I believe it was six that received in excess of $4 million. Who are they going to employ? (Others). Oh, wait, I get it. (Do you?) Their money will "trickle down" to everyone else. (Indeed...it would appear that we agree). Sorry, been there, done that, didn't work. (And you own what business...sorry...I may have misplaced your position in life...my error). quote: When you consider all the technology involved (software, hardware, GPS, vector controls, composites)...it's more than a bunch (of jobs). Simply because the average person can't afford...or will never ride in...a C5....is no reason to disallow the argument. No reason at all, because I have no idea what the hell you just said. Perfectly understandable....it happens...it's okay...I forgive you for your lack. (BTW, the AIG argument was a different thread, this was about JPMorgan, which you seem not to have bothered to read) Again my error....I'm sure I missed the main point of your argument...I apologize...it doesn't change mine.

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