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RE: Neediness - 3/20/2009 10:02:14 AM   
paddlebottom


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RE: Neediness - 3/20/2009 10:22:34 AM   
Prinsexx


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Cyntilating

and I owe it to myself to know that I can have those needs without being seen as needy......  right??
 

That's an interesting distinction. And yes neediness is something totally subjective and probably something that none of us could ever get into agreement about over above the survival needs.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Cyntilating

 but ...saying that I need certain things from the person I am in a relationship with,in order tofeel secure and quenched, and suddenly THAT makes me needy.
 
I don't get it.   


Neediness in relationship is more often than not picked up on and defined by the other person maybe?


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RE: Neediness - 3/20/2009 10:28:06 AM   
Prinsexx


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Focus50

quote:

ORIGINAL: FelineFae

 
 
Indeed, even being co-dependent has its advantages within an authority based dynamic.
 
Focus.

I agree. I read an old test book the other day about aspects of co-dependence and thought hell yeah that's me as a submissive. Someone's gotta re-write the literature and state the benefits of co-dependency. In collectivist societies and more so-called primitive societies co-dependency would have been viewed differently.
After all the whole world can't live in detached splendor up on a hill behind a picket fence of individuality.
Being accepted as property and independence don't sit so well together fo they?


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RE: Neediness - 3/20/2009 10:31:14 AM   
Prinsexx


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quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

I agree for the most part. The exception being that the controling person in the relationship will determine how much neediness is too much.

.

Ok great point of view.
Accept being told all the time: you don't have to worry about that anymore kind of not yo be a bit of an excuse for not dealing with my stuff...I seem to remember.


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RE: Neediness - 3/20/2009 11:45:03 AM   
Focus50


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Prinsexx

quote:

ORIGINAL: Focus50

quote:

ORIGINAL: FelineFae

 
 
Indeed, even being co-dependent has its advantages within an authority based dynamic.
 
Focus.

I agree. I read an old test book the other day about aspects of co-dependence and thought hell yeah that's me as a submissive. Someone's gotta re-write the literature and state the benefits of co-dependency. In collectivist societies and more so-called primitive societies co-dependency would have been viewed differently.
After all the whole world can't live in detached splendor up on a hill behind a picket fence of individuality.
Being accepted as property and independence don't sit so well together fo they?

In this age of perceived equality between the sexes, co-dependency tends to carry an unhealthy stigma within the greater society.  Doubtless that same society would also frown upon an unequal, control based relationship in much the same way; ie, that it's abusive etc....
 
But I tend to think a level of co-dependence is inevitable when one partner defers to the will of the other.  As with all things, it's the degree that tends to define what is or isn't an unhealthy situation.  Yes, I want her obedience and following my rules and guidelines etc but no, I don't want her ringing me at work to decide what dress she should wear or what order she should run errands etc.  When I'm not available, I'd like to think she can function almost as if I didn't even exist - not to put too fine a point on it....  lol
 
Focus.

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RE: Neediness - 3/20/2009 1:16:23 PM   
LuckyAlbatross


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Prinsexx
As an s-type are you:
Aware of the difference between your needs and wants?

Needs are just wants with boundaries.
quote:


Do you guard against neediness?

Too much.
quote:


Or do you just let your D know?

Not often/easily enough
quote:


If you are a D type:
How do you define a submissives neediness?

A craving for something inside that they can't immediately or directly meet for and in themselves.
quote:


Are you signed up for it?

Some of it.
quote:


Are you prepared to fulfil those needs?

Such that I know exist previous to making a commitment, yes.
quote:


Do you see neediness as weakness or strength?

I tend to perceive it as a weakness, but that's my own issue and not Literal Truth

Neediness is more a problem when we try to ignore it, act like it's not there or allow it to lead us to making bad choices in judgement.

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RE: Neediness - 3/20/2009 2:05:28 PM   
Prinsexx


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross


Neediness is more a problem when we try to ignore it, act like it's not there or allow it to lead us to making bad choices in judgement.

For once I have to agree with you entirely here.
The division between needs and wants fluctuates for me at times: but one thing is for sure. Neediness is more of a function of communication, or rather a lack of it.
Once communicated in the form: I need to say...... or I want to say I need (?).....or if I am feeling particularly assertive simply I need..... then the actual intensity and/or form of the need seems to dissipate.
ed. to add: Is there more of a reticence or withold in my dynamic relation than in my everyday work life? Rhetorical question: it's something I'm working on to figure where the difference lays.


< Message edited by Prinsexx -- 3/20/2009 2:08:04 PM >

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RE: Neediness - 3/20/2009 2:43:00 PM   
DesFIP


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Status: offline 		About reticence. If you don't tell him, then you are making the decision for him of whether or not he chooses to do this. You are deciding you shouldn't have this, you are deciding to withhold essential infomation about your emotions and drives. By not telling him, and by removing the chance of him saying no, you are retaining control.

True vulnerability means you have to give it all over, including the stuff that previous partners characterized as unattractive neediness. So who is in control? A previous partner or the new one? Myself, I object to having a ghost in bed.

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RE: Neediness - 3/20/2009 3:29:56 PM   
Prinsexx


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP

About reticence. If you don't tell him, then you are making the decision for him of whether or not he chooses to do this. You are deciding you shouldn't have this, you are deciding to withhold essential infomation about your emotions and drives. By not telling him, and by removing the chance of him saying no, you are retaining control.

True vulnerability means you have to give it all over, including the stuff that previous partners characterized as unattractive neediness. So who is in control? A previous partner or the new one? Myself, I object to having a ghost in bed.

In defense I do not carry reticence of one form from one relationship to another. I get and completely understand where you are coming from and what you are saying. Indeed I believe I am very good at moving on. One of the things that 'pushes' me to move on is I think my age... life is hoing very quickly, days speed by, months and the years.. not solely because of the ageing process itself, but because I am SO fulfilled and happy in my work and relationship and familt right now that there's just a feeling of being as the man said 'in the flow'.
I relate fully to each person I am front of, well as fully as I know how.
Sometimes holding back is just erotic and it's an erotic game I know we are noth playing. But having let it slip out, a litt;e retivence is there because of being wary of being in need. I will honestly look deeper to see if it a need to retain control.
I suppose a general questin is then: how doon is it best, or indeed possible to let go completely of control and therefore completely submit?
Oh just meandering now.....



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RE: Neediness - 3/20/2009 8:50:35 PM   
LadySunn


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

quote:

If you are a D type:
How do you define a submissives neediness?
Are you signed up for it?
Are you prepared to fulfil those needs?
Do you see neediness as weakness or strength?


How I answer is going to depend entirely on the context of needy.

If you are going to infer the more negative meaning others have suggested, that insecure clinging whining........that will cause me to toss you out of my life quickly. Especially if it begins before we even have established any sort of commited relationship.

If it is legitimate needs...first, I expect her to communicate them. I am not, nor will I ever be a mind reader. If I tried, I would probably get it wrong. If you expect me to "just know" ..........good bye. I am not into that sort of emotional high maintainance shit. And yes, I see that type of neediness as a huge weakness and one I will not sign up for.

If she is normally a very self sufficient and together type woman that is going through a rough patch, I fully expect that I will be doing more giving than taking.

To me, this is not M/s or D/s stuff at all. This is human relationship stuff I see every day, here in the work place, in all sorts of relationships all around me. As far as I am concerned it is a two fold issue, insecurity and communication.



I do agree with this point!!! let me repeat it.

....If you are going to infer the more negative meaning others have suggested, that insecure clinging whining........that will cause me to toss you out of my life quickly.  Especially if it begins before we even have established any sort of committed relationship.




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RE: Neediness - 3/21/2009 8:05:53 AM   
LeatherBentOne


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

quote:

If you are a D type:
How do you define a submissives neediness?
Are you signed up for it?
Are you prepared to fulfil those needs?
Do you see neediness as weakness or strength?


How I answer is going to depend entirely on the context of needy.

If you are going to infer the more negative meaning others have suggested, that insecure clinging whining........that will cause me to toss you out of my life quickly. Especially if it begins before we even have established any sort of commited relationship.

If it is legitimate needs...first, I expect her to communicate them. I am not, nor will I ever be a mind reader. If I tried, I would probably get it wrong. If you expect me to "just know" ..........good bye. I am not into that sort of emotional high maintainance shit. And yes, I see that type of neediness as a huge weakness and one I will not sign up for.

If she is normally a very self sufficient and together type woman that is going through a rough patch, I fully expect that I will be doing more giving than taking.

To me, this is not M/s or D/s stuff at all. This is human relationship stuff I see every day, here in the work place, in all sorts of relationships all around me. As far as I am concerned it is a two fold issue, insecurity and communication.

.

I tend to be as you stated, and I always let a sub know that what they request will not always be granted because in my mind, Im able to distinguish between needs and wants even if they are unable to.  I refuse to be manipulated

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RE: Neediness - 3/21/2009 1:31:37 PM   
StormsSlave


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Status: offline 		To answer the questions:
Aware of the difference between your needs and wants?
Of course.  If he were to die tomorrow, I would still need to be a mother to my children, a daughter to my parents, a sibling to my siblings.  Those things will not change.  My world will feel like a echoing cavernous cave of emptiness.  That is what I mean as need.  I could have my right arm cut off and survive the experience, but the need for it will never go away.  That is how I need My Lord.
Do you guard against neediness?
Only when My Lord asks why it has increased/decreased.  Otherwise, we are very open and vulnerable with one another, not hesitating to admit our mutal need.
Or do you just let your D know?
I just come right out and tell him.  It is expected of me, in fact.   In my case neediness is generally an outward indication of some internal struggle, and observing the behavior will usually bring My Lord to questioning the root of the matter.  He's not really a touchy feely sort of person, but he always has the patience to get me through it.

Edited to add:
On the subject of neediness: The term needy is so subjective.  What seems needy in this relationship is far beyond the boundaries of what has been called needy in the past.  We agree that we need one another.  Every day we place one another above all else.  We focus on each other, and what we can do to make the other's life better, more bearable, less painful, more pleasurable.  If he shows neediness toward me (I'm not sure exactly what d/s has to do with it either way) I don't think less of him for extracting comfort, strength, or affection from me.  If I display a need, it's  never turned away as frivolous or too much to ask.  That is why we are with one another, to give and to receive, and if that equates to neediness, than I suppose I'm just glad that he seems to need me as much as I need him.

< Message edited by StormsSlave -- 3/21/2009 1:38:18 PM >

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RE: Neediness - 3/21/2009 6:14:30 PM   
Prinsexx


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Status: offline 		This question of neediness still going through my mind.
I've begun to think I have an inherent neediness. This is based on being a twin. It's just so inexplicable this being born on of a multiple. I remember my first day at school (in the days when play groups were unheard of). I remember thinking oh my god why is there only one of everyone else? We were sat together, dressed the same and rarely spoken to ny our own first names sis and I. Even when we were called by our names it was usually by the wrong name.
So I grew up feeling that I was at one only when I was with her (later in life at one only when I was with someone else). I grew up feeling there was something terribly missing were she not there. This feeling of being abandoned has taken years to work through.
Yes we were absolutely co-dependent. I was the social extrovert: getting things done for her, speaking up for her. She was the quiet dominant one.
It's a kind of entwinement, a kind of moving around together, not physically but in every other way conjoined. Half an ego with its other halt inside someone else s' body.
I have always needed this in a partner but never found the same degree of empathy in any vanilla relationship.

Until bdsm.

Or rather that the kind of activities that included edge play (knives, needles, medical play), any intimacy that involved pain or indeed activities that involved carefully monitored attention... the list could go on but might ne beyond the TOS....rather it was bdsm intimacy and sex that recreated for me the dulfilment of need itself. I need to be needed is the legacy of my childhood.

I don't know if there are other multiples on collarme who will read this and say: that's it! in a moment of recognition.

I don't know if others who have had close sibling communication have experienced this co-dependency in childhood. I actually don't be;lieve it happens in close siblings but that being of the exact same age and state of development creates a special environment and innate capacity for co-dependency being the norm.

But just saying I do understand my neediness and yes it's like a light gets turned on when being with someone who I feel know how I feel.



< Message edited by Prinsexx -- 3/21/2009 6:16:44 PM >

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