This Meltdown was Planned! (Full Version)

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samboct -> This Meltdown was Planned! (12/24/2008 3:47:17 PM)

OK, I'm not much for conspiracy theories....But try this one on and see if you get a chuckle...

I pay very little attention to Fox news.  But it seems that people that do watch Fox news tend to start political conversations with the mantra - The government is the source of all our problems.  I've gathered that some pundits have been taken with the idea that the beast (government) needs to be strangled- first tried back in Ronnie Raygun's day.  Since chopping off the supply of money was unpalatable to most folks since that paid for things like social security, the next idea was to bankrupt the beast.  Ronnie and GWB 1 did a good job of starting on this process, but then that bastard Clinton got elected and worse was to come- developing the Internet actually created jobs and an industry- not only a bubble for idiotic investors to lose their shirts (not like the smart guys who always watch Fox news and listen to what Rupert Murdoch has to say.) and the damn economy grew- as did tax receipts.  Greenspan, our boy from the get go, was backed into a corner and had to opine that the best thing to do with all the extra money rolling in was....pay down the deficit!  NOOOOO!!!!- it had taken years to get it to grow nice and big!  Drat.....

But then our boy GWB II got elected and he was our wet dreams come true.  First he declares an expensive, unwinnable war which further adds to the deficit (but cunningly doesn't develop new weapons or tactics which would build the economy and might make the war winnable) and then he gives us rich, deeply deserving folks a tax break!!! YAYYYYY!!!

It doesn't matter that our guy McCain didn't get elected- we weren't crazy about him anyhow, he's got too much of a backbone and a brain for our taste- but Obama's screwed from the get go.  The deficit's are so high that nobody will buy US treasuries, and with this financial bailout of the "banks" heh heh heh- our hedge funds and derivatives have swallowed up EVERYBODYS money.  WE WIN!!!!  We've bankrupted the beast, and we've got all the MONEY!!!!

Now, we've got to muddy the trail a little bit....

Basically we want a depression, because we'll be in charge, we've got all the money and everybody will have to do what we say.  But people are too smart- they'll recognize that what we're trying to set up is the same thing that Herbert Hoover did for our granddaddys back in the 1920s.  Wait- I have it- let's fund some "scholars" who will start throwing dirt in what used to be the clear stream of how the Great Depression occurred and we'll muddy the waters. So how do we do that?

Well, people are unhappy with our boy Ronnie Rayguns back in the early 1980s.  Boy, his economic policies threw the country into a recession by 1982.  Let's jigger the unemployment statistics and redefine things so that the employment picture looks better.  Rather than saying that someone who hasn't worked in 6 months is unemployed- we'll say that they're unemployable and don't need to be counted.  So we'll trumpet our new numbers from the rooftops, and since we've got some news media under out control, we'll be able to get our message out.  It doesn't matter if it's right or wrong- it's the same principle as advertising- keep repeating something often enough and people will believe it.  Especially if we start calling all those smart folks "liberals" like its something dirty and claim that they're elitist and aren't looking out for the average joe.  Nobody likes eggheads anyhow and we can use T + A to get people to watch and listen to us instead.

Now we've got to set things up the same way the depression occurred with Herbert Hoover.  Let's see, back in the 1920s, the new exotic financial instruments were margins, so that you could buy lots of stock with little money.  Well, people might catch on if we did the same thing twice, so we need something new- got it- let's start using "derivatives" and rebundling mortgages so that nobody knows what anything is any more.  Better keep muddying the waters though, that damn internet, some folks might figure out that we're trying to set up another depression.  Well, the first time that we jiggerypokered the statistics on unemployment, we got away with it.  Let's try it again.  And our boy George- he's so good to us.  He classifies stuff as "secret" then claims that the classification doesn't exist, just like he locked up them towelheads in Cuba without giving them a trial.  So we've got our boys saying that Herbert Hoover didn't do anything wrong, and if Roosevelt hadn't done anything, the country would have come out of the depression a lot faster.  It's pure BS, but only an egghead would figure this out, and we know how to shut them up.  And those guys writing this fertilizer- heck, they've got everything so twisted around nobody knows what unemployment is any more, and we've got everybody believing that the depression never really ended.  Of course, we know that actually if you add in the number of people that Roosevelt put to work on those WPA projects, unemployment was actually a lot lower and the country was doing just fine with his programs.  Besides, when WWII broke out, we managed to build lots more airplanes, ships, and tanks than everybody else put together, which meant that there couldn't have been much of a depression by 1935 or so because there wouldn't have been the machines, the factories or the workers.  Just look at the number of cars that were being built.  But heck, who's gonna figure that one out?

But there are still those pesky regulations that they passed when they caught on to what our grandpappy's did back in the 20s- we have to keep hollerin' that those regulations are preventing us from making more money than everybody else.  Woops, better not say that.  Aw heck, the great unwashed are stupid- why not bellyache that we can't make more money than everybody else without working.  We deserve it.. right?  Now we're rolling... our boy Greenspan is incomprehensible and has got everybody convinced that he's a genius because they're too stupid to admit that they can't figure out what he's saying, and he's gotten rid of the regulations that were holding us back.  Now we're making TONS of MONEY, and everybody is jealous- saying look at how smart those guys are. 

And now- we've WON!!!

Sam




rachel529 -> RE: This Meltdown was Planned! (12/24/2008 3:51:15 PM)

gotta be careful saying shit like that... you might wake up with a horse head on your bed...




TheHeretic -> RE: This Meltdown was Planned! (12/24/2008 3:56:02 PM)

    Well, I'll agree that you pay very little attention...

   




UncleNasty -> RE: This Meltdown was Planned! (12/24/2008 4:16:37 PM)

Just because you're paranoid it doesn't mean that they aren't out to get you.

Uncle Nasty




rachel529 -> RE: This Meltdown was Planned! (12/24/2008 4:41:21 PM)

yay uncle nasty! 




Aszhrae -> RE: This Meltdown was Planned! (12/24/2008 4:57:19 PM)

The last thing they want to provoke is anarchy.
Only have to look to what happened in France when they started killing all the aristocrats.
Politicians and lawyers are the modern equivalent.
First they go and then the intellectuals are next.
Next thing you know. The country fractures.
Then you have an aluminum salesperson in the remains of the white house.
And we have been knocked back into the Middle Ages and a return to the feudal system.




rachel529 -> RE: This Meltdown was Planned! (12/24/2008 4:58:54 PM)

the dark ages were caused by the burning of libraries and a powerful theocracy though...




bluepanda -> RE: This Meltdown was Planned! (12/24/2008 5:15:55 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: rachel529

the dark ages were caused by the burning of libraries and a powerful theocracy though...


And now we have political leaders who believe the universe was created in 6 days and evolution is a fraud, and who believe this should be taught to our children in our schools. How far have we really come?




bluepanda -> RE: This Meltdown was Planned! (12/24/2008 5:26:54 PM)

quote:

But then our boy GWB II got elected and he was our wet dreams come true. First he declares an expensive, unwinnable war which further adds to the deficit (but cunningly doesn't develop new weapons or tactics which would build the economy and might make the war winnable) and then he gives us rich, deeply deserving folks a tax break!!! YAYYYYY!!!


Don't forget that it's only been 3 years or so since this fucking spawn of satan tried to "save" social security by taking the funds and putting it into the stock market - that's right, the same stock market that lost over 40 % of its value over the last year. As bad as things are right now, can you imagine the utter carnage that we'd be dealing with this month if he'd managed to pull that off?






corysub -> RE: This Meltdown was Planned! (12/24/2008 7:12:13 PM)

Take two tylenol..and get some rest.  You will feel better in the morning....




MzMia -> RE: This Meltdown was Planned! (12/24/2008 10:00:01 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: bluepanda

quote:

But then our boy GWB II got elected and he was our wet dreams come true. First he declares an expensive, unwinnable war which further adds to the deficit (but cunningly doesn't develop new weapons or tactics which would build the economy and might make the war winnable) and then he gives us rich, deeply deserving folks a tax break!!! YAYYYYY!!!


Don't forget that it's only been 3 years or so since this fucking spawn of satan tried to "save" social security by taking the funds and putting it into the stock market - that's right, the same stock market that lost over 40 % of its value over the last year. As bad as things are right now, can you imagine the utter carnage that we'd be dealing with this month if he'd managed to pull that off?






Not that I am sure where social security is going or if I will
ever be able to collect it.........
Thank GOD, we did not put it in the stock market!!!
For many people, that is ALL the heck they have!




variation30 -> RE: This Meltdown was Planned! (12/24/2008 10:04:39 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: bluepanda

And now we have political leaders who believe the universe was created in 6 days and evolution is a fraud, and who believe this should be taught to our children in our schools. How far have we really come?



and we even have some politicians who believe in sillier things, like the broken window fallacy.

I would think the government was behind the recent condition...but they work for the government, they simply are not intelligent enough to pull something like this off.




corysub -> RE: This Meltdown was Planned! (12/25/2008 6:09:15 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MzMia

quote:

ORIGINAL: bluepanda

quote:

But then our boy GWB II got elected and he was our wet dreams come true. First he declares an expensive, unwinnable war which further adds to the deficit (but cunningly doesn't develop new weapons or tactics which would build the economy and might make the war winnable) and then he gives us rich, deeply deserving folks a tax break!!! YAYYYYY!!!


Don't forget that it's only been 3 years or so since this fucking spawn of satan tried to "save" social security by taking the funds and putting it into the stock market - that's right, the same stock market that lost over 40 % of its value over the last year. As bad as things are right now, can you imagine the utter carnage that we'd be dealing with this month if he'd managed to pull that off?






Not that I am sure where social security is going or if I will
ever be able to collect it.........
Thank GOD, we did not put it in the stock market!!!
For many people, that is ALL the heck they have!



The thing about "investment planning" is that it's not a one or two year program.  If you are in your 20's or 30's now and don't start to learn about real estate or the stock market for planning for your retirement you are no doing yourself any good.  Sure things are tough now...but suppose you were 20 or 30 years old 20 or 30 years ago and was able to put half your and your employers contribution to social security money in the stock market.  You would have a heck of a lot more "value" even after this years slump than the $1,000 or $1,500 a month you would be getting today from social security.  Only the politicians who derive power by controlling the purse strings of americans voiced negative opinions about allowing some investment in the stock market, and they sold their minions a bill of goods.   I guess they felt "change" was not good....for them!




thishereboi -> RE: This Meltdown was Planned! (12/25/2008 6:33:45 AM)

Maybe I am just in one of those moods, but I am having trouble getting into the conspiracy theories. Oh and for the record, it is Reagan, not Raygun.




Aszhrae -> RE: This Meltdown was Planned! (12/25/2008 12:22:33 PM)

As for Reagan, I personally seen nothing wrong with a laser defense system of satellites for the purpose of shooting down enemy missiles. Then again the movie: Real Genius, concerning the use of a laser for purpose of assassination, was done in humor but it was a scary concept.

Since most of the currency of the world is based upon the value of the US greenback, to have a global recession in economy, only opens the door to the WTO organization with of course the US being the bully-on-the-block instrumental in seeing it happen. This is just speculative, but can certainly see it happening if the puppet masters have their way.

Looking back in history, I personally believe that when they built the UN building in the US, they should have perhaps built somewhere else. Some place unaligned with any country, creed or culture. Neutral in all regards. It is where it is and the manipulation of other nations and their economies will continue and there is nothing we can do about.

Take the canadian banks, when they lost money due to their own US investments. The canadian dollar was high and the banks did manage to regain the money they lost back by having BoC artificially reduce the dollar and then buy back into the US economy and help to stimulate it.

Really not sure where we will go from here, but one thing is for sure. There is little we can do change anything. Since the bigwigs all seem to be working for the common goal no matter who is elected.




Lorr47 -> RE: This Meltdown was Planned! (12/25/2008 4:44:55 PM)

You are  basically right about everything except Greenspan.  Greenspan's basic mistake was that he was naive as to how utterly dishonest and criminally  minded Wall Street  had become and how dishonest and criminally minded their toadies in the White House and in the republican party had become.  Remember George Bush was Greenspan's boss.  Can you imagine Greenspan going into the oval office and telling Cheney/Bush that massive increases in regulation were needed?  (As he exists scene laughing uproariously.)




bluepanda -> RE: This Meltdown was Planned! (12/25/2008 5:10:24 PM)

quote:

The thing about "investment planning" is that it's not a one or two year program. If you are in your 20's or 30's now and don't start to learn about real estate or the stock market for planning for your retirement you are no doing yourself any good. Sure things are tough now...but suppose you were 20 or 30 years old 20 or 30 years ago and was able to put half your and your employers contribution to social security money in the stock market. You would have a heck of a lot more "value" even after this years slump than the $1,000 or $1,500 a month you would be getting today from social security. Only the politicians who derive power by controlling the purse strings of americans voiced negative opinions about allowing some investment in the stock market, and they sold their minions a bill of goods. I guess they felt "change" was not good....for them!


Oh, bullshit, Cory. Come on. The point is, if Bush had managed to transfer the bulk of the social security funds into the stock market 3 years ago, the value of those funds would have been cut almost in half over the last few months. Of the money that was there when he started this crazy crusade - money that is needed to cut checks for retired people right now, this next week - there would only be a little more than half as much now as there was a few months ago. What possible relevance does your bromide about longterm investment strategy for people in their 20s have in this argument? Sounds to me as though the political leaders who refused to let him get away with this fraud were doing a pretty goddamned good job of looking after the best interests of the taxpayers.




Lorr47 -> RE: This Meltdown was Planned! (12/25/2008 5:25:13 PM)

quote:

Sounds to me as though the political leaders who refused to let him get away with this fraud were doing a pretty goddamned good job of looking after the best interests of the taxpayers.


Yes!




awmslave -> RE: This Meltdown was Planned! (12/25/2008 9:15:28 PM)

quote:

Now we're making TONS of MONEY, and everybody is jealous- saying look at how smart those guys are.


Look anywhere and it becomes clear: WE are not making money, THEY are. US government teamed up with corporate and financial elite is very smart but short-sighted. There is a limit how much their countrymen can be robbed.




Hippiekinkster -> RE: This Meltdown was Planned! (12/25/2008 10:00:50 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: bluepanda

quote:

The thing about "investment planning" is that it's not a one or two year program. If you are in your 20's or 30's now and don't start to learn about real estate or the stock market for planning for your retirement you are no doing yourself any good. Sure things are tough now...but suppose you were 20 or 30 years old 20 or 30 years ago and was able to put half your and your employers contribution to social security money in the stock market. You would have a heck of a lot more "value" even after this years slump than the $1,000 or $1,500 a month you would be getting today from social security. Only the politicians who derive power by controlling the purse strings of americans voiced negative opinions about allowing some investment in the stock market, and they sold their minions a bill of goods. I guess they felt "change" was not good....for them!


Oh, bullshit, Cory. Come on. The point is, if Bush had managed to transfer the bulk of the social security funds into the stock market 3 years ago, the value of those funds would have been cut almost in half over the last few months. Of the money that was there when he started this crazy crusade - money that is needed to cut checks for retired people right now, this next week - there would only be a little more than half as much now as there was a few months ago. What possible relevance does your bromide about longterm investment strategy for people in their 20s have in this argument? Sounds to me as though the political leaders who refused to let him get away with this fraud were doing a pretty goddamned good job of looking after the best interests of the taxpayers.

I think he was referring to young white college-educated people who could plan for long-term gains. You know, people who could actually afford to put a thousand bucks every couple months into the Wall Street casinos. Average people who are one paycheck away from crashing are invisible to righties except when they want their vote or their money.




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