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RE: Crushing news--- Obama not elected President of the... - 11/11/2008 11:07:22 PM   
Arpig


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quote:

This realization was the genius of our founding fathers.

Actually, the Electoral College was created to prevent a demogogue from being elected. It is there to make sure that the popular vote would in fact NOT be the deciding factor in Presidential elections since the founding fathers did not trust the average Joe to vote sensibly and soberly.

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RE: Crushing news--- Obama not elected President of the... - 11/11/2008 11:35:42 PM   
smilingjaguar


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Crush

Actually, the Electors in the Electoral College have to cast their ballots on December 15....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S._Electoral_College#Election_Day



And you didn't know this before Wikipedia told you this?  This is basic civics...

(in reply to Crush)
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RE: Crushing news--- Obama not elected President of the... - 11/12/2008 1:05:55 AM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline 		Cagey, Calif's not that "blue" anymore.
They just voted down gay marriage.
It appears they're headed in the opposite direction.

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RE: Crushing news--- Obama not elected President of the... - 11/12/2008 4:19:35 AM   
Cagey18


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The
quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

Cagey, Calif's not that "blue" anymore.
They just voted down gay marriage.
It appears they're headed in the opposite direction.

The topic being Presidential elections, Calif. is becoming more blue, not less:
Obama 61% McCain 37%
Kerry 55% Bush 44%
Gore 53% Bush 42%
Clinton 51% Dole 38%
Clinton 46% Bush 33%


(in reply to popeye1250)
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RE: Crushing news--- Obama not elected President of the... - 11/12/2008 4:25:11 AM   
Cagey18


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Arpig

quote:

This realization was the genius of our founding fathers.

Actually, the Electoral College was created to prevent a demogogue from being elected. It is there to make sure that the popular vote would in fact NOT be the deciding factor in Presidential elections since the founding fathers did not trust the average Joe to vote sensibly and soberly.


Thank you.

Ironic isn't it, that in 2000 that same institution allowed a demagogue to become elected over the will of the people.


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RE: Crushing news--- Obama not elected President of the... - 11/12/2008 7:50:26 AM   
subrob1967


Posts: 4591
Joined: 9/13/2004
Status: offline 		The electoral college needs to amend their system to allow split voting based on popular votes cast.

What would of happened if McCain recieved 20 of California's electoral votes? Or 10 of Ny's 31? or 10 of OH's 20?


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RE: Crushing news--- Obama not elected President of the... - 11/12/2008 8:12:49 AM   
Cagey18


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quote:

ORIGINAL: subrob1967

The electoral college needs to amend their system to allow split voting based on popular votes cast.

What would of happened if McCain recieved 20 of California's electoral votes? Or 10 of Ny's 31? or 10 of OH's 20?


Two states (Nebraska and Maine) already have split voting, without changing the electoral college system (which would require an amendment to the Constitution, which is a cumbersome process involving both the House and Senate, and 37 states to vote for the amendment).  Their state legislatures changed their laws to split the electoral votes by district.  No Congressional action required.  Four other states are considering the same change.

This year, Nebraska (for the first time) awarded 3 votes to the Republican candidate and 1 vote to the Democratic candidate.

(in answer to your question...McCain would have still lost by over 150 electoral votes)

< Message edited by Cagey18 -- 11/12/2008 8:18:24 AM >

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RE: Crushing news--- Obama not elected President of the... - 11/12/2008 8:13:56 AM   
slvemike4u


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quote:

ORIGINAL: subrob1967

The electoral college needs to amend their system to allow split voting based on popular votes cast.

What would of happened if McCain recieved 20 of California's electoral votes? Or 10 of Ny's 31? or 10 of OH's 20?


And the motivation for changing the rules as a result of this election cycle would be what?
I haven't bothered,but since you posed the hypothetical,what would this amending of the system done to election results in 2000,2004, ?

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RE: Crushing news--- Obama not elected President of the... - 11/12/2008 8:16:52 AM   
rulemylife


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quote:

ORIGINAL: subrob1967

The electoral college needs to amend their system to allow split voting based on popular votes cast.

What would of happened if McCain recieved 20 of California's electoral votes? Or 10 of Ny's 31? or 10 of OH's 20?




I'm sure you were saying the same thing in 2000 when your plan would have given Al Gore the Presidency.  Right?

< Message edited by rulemylife -- 11/12/2008 8:18:45 AM >

(in reply to subrob1967)
Profile   Post #: 49
RE: Crushing news--- Obama not elected President of the... - 11/12/2008 8:42:22 AM   
subrob1967


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Status: offline 		Absolutely, I personally feel that with the current system, the popular vote doesn't matter, and I'd like my vote to matter.

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RE: Crushing news--- Obama not elected President of the... - 11/19/2008 6:48:19 PM   
Crush


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quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterG2kTR

quote:

ORIGINAL: Crush

Actually, the Electors in the Electoral College have to cast their ballots on December 15....




Do you really think the outcome will be any different than it is today? I think not!



Doesn't mean it isn't true.....


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RE: Crushing news--- Obama not elected President of the... - 12/3/2008 9:37:34 PM   
masterBruce


Posts: 133
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Status: offline 		Associated Press updated 10:05 a.m. ET, Wed., Nov. 26, 2008
The United States Federal Court will have the final say on whether or not President Elect Obama will be allowed to take the Presidential Oath of Office. If the high court rules against the President Elect it will mark the first time in history that a election has been overturned.  If it happens a new election would have to take place and the Speaker of the House would run the Country until then.


(in reply to Crush)
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RE: Crushing news--- Obama not elected President of the... - 12/3/2008 11:30:00 PM   
rexrgisformidoni


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quote:

ORIGINAL: masterBruce

Associated Press updated 10:05 a.m. ET, Wed., Nov. 26, 2008
The United States Federal Court will have the final say on whether or not President Elect Obama will be allowed to take the Presidential Oath of Office. If the high court rules against the President Elect it will mark the first time in history that a election has been overturned.  If it happens a new election would have to take place and the Speaker of the House would run the Country until then.





The Onion?


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RE: Crushing news--- Obama not been elected President o... - 12/4/2008 5:13:05 AM   
kittinSol


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quote:

ORIGINAL: JackHammer2000
Evidence can be manufactured and planted, and even if Obama isn't a naturally-born U.S. citizen, he's had more than enough time to take care of the matter. 


I can't believe for the life of me that people are still going on with this shit: Obama was born in Hawaii, a state of the Union, which amply qualifies him as a natural U.S. citizen. Those that went on (and that still go on) about Obama's citizenship are liars and xenophobes that try to confuse the issue because Obama's father was born in Africa.

The irony is that McCain's citizenship was more questionable... because McCain was born in the Panama Canal Zone. http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/28/us/politics/28mccain.html

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RE: Crushing news--- Obama not been elected President o... - 12/4/2008 7:57:35 AM   
servantheart


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quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

quote:

ORIGINAL: JackHammer2000
Evidence can be manufactured and planted, and even if Obama isn't a naturally-born U.S. citizen, he's had more than enough time to take care of the matter. 


I can't believe for the life of me that people are still going on with this shit: Obama was born in Hawaii, a state of the Union, which amply qualifies him as a natural U.S. citizen. Those that went on (and that still go on) about Obama's citizenship are liars and xenophobes that try to confuse the issue because Obama's father was born in Africa.

The irony is that McCain's citizenship was more questionable... because McCain was born in the Panama Canal Zone. http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/28/us/politics/28mccain.html


With Obama having been born in Hawaii, I don't get why anyone would question his citizenship.  Surely it can't be that difficult for them to find out.  Sheesh, talk about laziness .
 
As the NY Times  article points out, there is a lot of debate over whether those born on U.S. military installations in other countries should qualify as natural born citizens.  As it stands now, they are considered as such.  Since the founding fathers couldn't have possibly predicted this specific situation, perhaps a constitutional amendment is in order here to clarify that point as suggested in the article. 
 
~edited for gramatical error~
 


< Message edited by servantheart -- 12/4/2008 8:00:16 AM >

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RE: Crushing news--- Obama not been elected President o... - 12/4/2008 8:01:37 AM   
celticlord2112


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quote:

Since the founding fathers couldn't have possibly predicted this specific situation, perhaps a constitutional amendment is in order here to clarify that point as suggested in the article.

None needed.  Congress is empowered to legislate a definition of "natural born"--for whatever reasons, such legislation has never passed (not sure if any such legislation has ever been presented).


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RE: Crushing news--- Obama not elected President of the... - 12/4/2008 8:07:08 AM   
HunterS


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Joined: 10/21/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: FatDomDaddy.

A simple explination is this...

Without it, only major population centers and the states that contain them would mean anything. With it... every state is important/


Is that why the states with a large populations have more electoral votes than states with small populations?
You might be better served to do a little research on American history before you try to teach it.
 
H.

(in reply to FatDomDaddy)
Profile   Post #: 57
RE: Crushing news--- Obama not been elected President o... - 12/4/2008 8:12:13 AM   
HunterS


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quote:

ORIGINAL: painpup

the media or communist news network elected this guy  Arnold couldn't run so if in fact he's not naturalized then he shouldn't be allowed the position


Perhaps you might enlighten us as to just who these "Communist" are.  Are you saying that Fox news is Communist?  Are you saying that Rupert Murdoch is a Comnmunist?
 
H.

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Profile   Post #: 58
RE: Crushing news--- Obama not elected President of the... - 12/4/2008 8:33:20 AM   
HunterS


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quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

Cagey, Calif's not that "blue" anymore.
They just voted down gay marriage.
It appears they're headed in the opposite direction.


You do not seem to know very much about California politics....Perhaps you might like to enlighten us as to the functional differences between the past two govonors of California.  While one is a steroid pumped muscle-head married to a emaciated speed phreque and the other might charatibly be described as "sominex" in a suit...their policies,both fiscal and social, are almost identical.
 
H.

(in reply to popeye1250)
Profile   Post #: 59
RE: Crushing news--- Obama not elected President of the... - 12/4/2008 3:49:48 PM   
Truthiness


Posts: 251
Joined: 11/27/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Arpig

quote:

This realization was the genius of our founding fathers.

Actually, the Electoral College was created to prevent a demogogue from being elected. It is there to make sure that the popular vote would in fact NOT be the deciding factor in Presidential elections since the founding fathers did not trust the average Joe to vote sensibly and soberly.


Kinda like how 60% of Obama voters polled didn't even know that Democrats had the majority in Congress.  Heh.

(in reply to Arpig)
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