quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

Just lately there have been a lot of Republicans equating freedom with capitalism, since when has freedom been an economic system? It is not as though any American has ever voted on whether they wanted to live in a capitalist system, they have just been told they live in a free society as though that equates with capitalism and no one questions it. (Probably because of the constant capitalist propaganda in the American media) For the record, a free society is entirely different from capitalism, capitalism is just an economic theory that doesn't work in its pure form like socialism doesn't. So why do supposedly intelligent Republicans keep banging in an infantile way on about capitalism being free and socialism not? Neither are free, neither are about freedom, both are, as I have pointed out, economic theories that when they were put into practice in their pure form, didn't work.

So if socialism doesn't work and socialist policies take freedom away, that means all those European countries with mixed economies are less free than America, that includes Germany, France, Spain, Italy, Britain, Holland, Belgium, Sweden, Finland, Norway and quite a few other countries, yet most nationals in those countries if they have been to the US would probably claim their country is more free than the US. They have better health and education on average, they have more access to cheap public transport than Americans which allows them to travel more, many can leave their own country without being controled and enter many other countries in the region without being controled. There are less flags and uniforms on the street reminding you where you are and who is in authority.

The truth is that Republicans use of the term socialism is a typical American rightwing boogeyman argument. They have probably been saying it that long, they have become paranoid and believe in it themselves. I just want to say you are being infantile and need to go back to school, stop believing politicians that want you to support their self interest, want you to help them keep their face in the trough, it isn't in your interest. A modicum of  time spent observing the rich and powerful in America, a little scrutiny, follow the money a little and you would realise, America is a mixed economy, it has capitalism for the poor and socialism for the rich and you are free to believe in anything you want as long as you don't expect to be treated in the same privileged way as the rich and powerful.

quote:

ORIGINAL: TNstepsout

In a sense, capitalism IS freedom. It is the complete freedom to do whatever you want in business without any limitations, with the assumption that the market will eventually, in some manner, create it's own boundaries. To some extent that's true, but as we've recently seen, sometimes the "fix" means a complete collapse. Do we really want to live with a system that might simply collapse every 50 to 100 years or so? Just so we can all have complete capitalistic freedom? If the country is forced to bailout the capitalists in order to avoid this collapse and perhaps even the collapse of it's own finances, then the country has a right (responsibility) to set limits on the capitalists, and that's NOT socialism. THAT's GOOD BUSINESS!  Which is something every good capitalist should understand.

quote:

ORIGINAL: TNstepsout

In a sense, capitalism IS freedom. It is the complete freedom to do whatever you want in business without any limitations, with the assumption that the market will eventually, in some manner, create it's own boundaries. To some extent that's true, but as we've recently seen, sometimes the "fix" means a complete collapse. Do we really want to live with a system that might simply collapse every 50 to 100 years or so? Just so we can all have complete capitalistic freedom? If the country is forced to bailout the capitalists in order to avoid this collapse and perhaps even the collapse of it's own finances, then the country has a right (responsibility) to set limits on the capitalists, and that's NOT socialism. THAT's GOOD BUSINESS!  Which is something every good capitalist should understand.

quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

So if socialism doesn't work and socialist policies take freedom away, that means all those European countries with mixed economies are less free than America, that includes Germany, France, Spain, Italy, Britain, Holland, Belgium, Sweden, Finland, Norway and quite a few other countries, yet most nationals in those countries if they have been to the US would probably claim their country is more free than the US.

Several foreign exchange students at a college I attended talked about the differences between our country and theirs. Not a one of them said their country didn't have enough freedom. In fact, they complained about the lack of freedom here.

America is a mixed economy, it has capitalism for the poor and socialism for the rich and you are free to believe in anything you want as long as you don't expect to be treated in the same privileged way as the rich and powerful.