not another conspiracy theory? (Full Version)

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LadyEllen -> not another conspiracy theory? (9/27/2008 7:44:20 AM)

One might wonder how this all occurred; negligence, corruption, greed have been advanced as explanations – but what if these whilst being accurate, were actually secondary causes? What if those seen as culpable here, were mere puppets reacting predictably and as planned to circumstances carefully created by distant agencies for whom the fall of the west were a major aim, long held and cherished and otherwise unattainable?

The crisis would seem to be a US domestic one, translated through global financial markets and craftily constructed instruments to affect its allies by way of the customs and practices shared amongst them. What if the certainty of this viral like infection were known beforehand by our notional distant agencies? And what if those notional distant agencies had the power and means and access to create the circumstances necessary for the infection to take hold?

What has happened to create this mess? The main factor is identified as risky loans, which actually started life as easily provided credit – money in other words. An entire nation (two if the UK, which shared in many of the same circumstances) was granted easy access to money over a long period, and encouraged to purchase homes and goods which consequently escalated in price even though their true values remained more or less as one might expect in a more normal marketplace – and thereby indebted deeply, personally, near universally and perhaps perpetually. Who exactly might be in a position to provide such extensive funding over such an extended period that might also seek the downfall of the west?

But there have been other factors that have undermined the west. Enormous increases in the price of oil and other commodities, put down to the increase in demand as developing countries become competitors to acquire them. Who exactly might be in a position to manipulate oil supply and also be in a position to then also have the funding and position to be able to manipulate through speculation the price for it as well as other commodities needed by western industry over such an extended period that might also seek the downfall of the west?

Whether one is or is not a fan of conspiracy theories, it nevertheless appears to be a neat explanation of how “we” got into this mess; a trap into which we would predictably fall, and inevitably if the trap were laid well.

And at the same time this plan was in effect – if plan it be – we were also encouraged to embark on expensive overseas wars to counteract the terrorism supposedly conjured and spread by radical minorities in a certain country far away which neatly (and quite coincidentally) demonstrates the characteristics of our supposed distant agencies. Wars we couldn’t win, but which would act as effective instruments to drain our resources and sap our morale and whose natures were such that they might provide great propaganda resource to our supposed distant agencies through the evidence thereby provided of our weakness.

Indeed it may be that WW3 was all this time being fought out unbeknownst to us, using our own resources and personnel against us, and that we have already lost and must now agree punitive terms of peace and submission with our concealed supposed enemy who throughout this period has not raised a weapon against us, but has spoken words of encouragement and friendship in our disbelieving ears as his philosophy permits and requires in the fulfilment of his greater aims.

E




meatcleaver -> RE: not another conspiracy theory? (9/27/2008 7:49:25 AM)

Naah, empires bring themselves down through imperial overstretch, bloated militaries and not paying attention to the economy at home. The USA's problems are self inflicted through usual imperial decadence. We've seen it all before with the European Empires. No one ever learns.




slvemike4u -> RE: not another conspiracy theory? (9/27/2008 8:52:17 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

Naah, empires bring themselves down through imperial overstretch, bloated militaries and not paying attention to the economy at home. The USA's problems are self inflicted through usual imperial decadence. We've seen it all before with the European Empires. No one ever learns.
Meat some unsolicited advice,yours for free take it or leave it,don't hold your breath waiting for America to go the way of European Empires.Yes we are going thru a rough patch and yes it would seem we are over extended....but stability on our continent...peace with our nieghbors(helps when your nieghbor realise you own the biggest dog on the block)means America,unlike the European Empires you referrenced have no barbarians at the gate waiting to pounce on an "Empire" distracted and stretched.
America is still and for a good long time to come the last best hope of mankind....now I certainly expect,given your world viewpoint you to attack pretty much everyhing I have said here....that is cool you are entitled to your opinion....




Amaros -> RE: not another conspiracy theory? (9/27/2008 8:59:12 AM)

You are absolutely correct, but the agencies are not distant, they are the neo-cons, the Bush's and the whole Dominionist/reconstructionist crowd that they manipulate.




slvemike4u -> RE: not another conspiracy theory? (9/27/2008 9:07:00 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Amaros

You are absolutely correct, but the agencies are not distant, they are the neo-cons, the Bush's and the whole Dominionist/reconstructionist crowd that they manipulate.

Their time on stage is winding down.Their policy's (thank you Mr.Bush)are discredited and quickly falling out of favor.




Raechard -> RE: not another conspiracy theory? (9/27/2008 9:13:37 AM)

RealOne has already been eaten by Government cannibals for knowing too much, be careful LadyEllen




ScooterTrash -> RE: not another conspiracy theory? (9/27/2008 9:18:10 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

Naah, empires bring themselves down through imperial overstretch, bloated militaries and not paying attention to the economy at home. The USA's problems are self inflicted through usual imperial decadence. We've seen it all before with the European Empires. No one ever learns.
“The only thing we learn from history, I am afraid, is that we do not learn from history”—Ron Paul




pahunkboy -> RE: not another conspiracy theory? (9/27/2008 12:36:06 PM)

Slave Mike, you dont know that.

when the settles traded beeds with indians for land, it was clear what the barter was.

Ill tell  you what, I have my eye on a  bloom property.  It isnt clear who owns it, or even how I get a showing or who is the broker.

people!!!

I could trade my house for beads.   then trade the beads for another house.




pahunkboy -> RE: not another conspiracy theory? (9/27/2008 12:39:44 PM)

http://thebeadsite.com/CHI-HIS.html             <---  there goods were traded for Manhattan!

http://thebeadsite.com/AB-HUB.htm   <-- we missed the big beads expo in 2003




slvemike4u -> RE: not another conspiracy theory? (9/27/2008 1:10:08 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

Slave Mike, you dont know that.

when the settles traded beeds with indians for land, it was clear what the barter was.

Ill tell  you what, I have my eye on a  bloom property.  It isnt clear who owns it, or even how I get a showing or who is the broker.

people!!!

I could trade my house for beads.   then trade the beads for another house.

I try pahunkboy Lord knows I try,but understanding your post's is getting harder and harder to do.Speaking in riddlese might tickle your fancy....but speaking for myself here...is there any chance you could simply say what you mean ,upfront wise and relieve the rest of us of the duty to decipher...




pahunkboy -> RE: not another conspiracy theory? (9/27/2008 2:01:45 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

Slave Mike, you dont know that.

when the settles traded beeds with indians for land, it was clear what the barter was.

Ill tell  you what, I have my eye on a  bloom property.  It isnt clear who owns it, or even how I get a showing or who is the broker.

people!!!

I could trade my house for beads.   then trade the beads for another house.

I try pahunkboy Lord knows I try,but understanding your post's is getting harder and harder to do.Speaking in riddlese might tickle your fancy....but speaking for myself here...is there any chance you could simply say what you mean ,upfront wise and relieve the rest of us of the duty to decipher...



I believe commerce and trade can occur between humans in the form of barter. Say I give you my  blue couch and in return you give me a dining room table.  

barter happened thru out history.

5 tillion $ is a more accurate number on what is needed to rescue the banks.

The USA is not so special that we are immune to basic laws of the universe.  We started off attempting to build a free society.... and here we are.

Mike- we are being scammed.  The banks are STILL going to fail!!

We are putting good money after bad.  I believe we chose bombs over basic goods....  you cant just "loose" 2.3 trillion$ in Iraq and not have a tax/budget/monetary problem.

This move will WEAKEN the dollar into less and less until it is ZERO.

BTW- I am even more hard to follow in person.  My facial expressions are often not with the pace of the conversation.

We are being ROBBED!





MrRodgers -> RE: not another conspiracy theory? (9/27/2008 4:42:07 PM)

Yes LadyEllen much of what we see going on the world today could be a conspiracy less technical just broader than the typical conspiracy. This could be a re-enactment of the 1907 Bank Panic created by a deliberately false rumor by J. P. Morgan in the NY Times. The resulting run but many private banks and businesses into bankcruptcy. Morgan graciously offered to be the lender of last resort.

History repeats itself with Morgan's bargain basement acquisition of Bear Stearns and now WaMu the latter at about .08 (cents) on the dollar. Now if this is the Illuminati such as the Bilderberg Group (see, hear "The speech that killed Kennedy") or not, it doesn't matter because as long as the powers that be and they hold huge power of economy...keep the poltical influence to charge the US treasury....we are in trouble.

Oh BTW, this casino of financial hedonism makes us and most of western civilization...Rome and we will not burn...just be slave to the speculators and debt.





bestbabync -> RE: not another conspiracy theory? (9/27/2008 6:33:26 PM)

i was speaking with a friend i respect.  he believes Greenspan's keeping the interest rates low all these years has created this problem.  low interest rates caused investors, such as AIG etc, to invest in Real Estate, instead of stocks & bonds.
[image]http://www.collarchat.com/micons/m28.gif[/image]  from there we know what happened!

shit!




cpK69 -> RE: not another conspiracy theory? (9/27/2008 6:43:03 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen

Whether one is or is not a fan of conspiracy theories, it nevertheless appears to be a neat explanation of how “we” got into this mess; a trap into which we would predictably fall, and inevitably if the trap were laid well.



Eaaaasey now, lets not be jumpin’ to any conclusions. This could simply be a case of family tradition.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EpfzE3eMkJw

Kim




Termyn8or -> RE: not another conspiracy theory? (9/28/2008 7:59:43 AM)

The trap has always been there. Up until about 1800 we had people who knew how to avoid falling into it.

Then it was downhill from there.

T




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