Is there a connection? (Full Version)

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KnightofMists -> Is there a connection? (8/19/2008 8:06:29 AM)

Some Dominant individuals establish alot of rules, duties and protocals in their relationships.  We often see this type of Dominant as leaning towards a Micro Manager.  Others have a much more less structured relationship base and is more free flowly but no less authority rests or is excercised with the Dominant and they are more akin to the Macro Mangers.

As a Dominant... do you see yourself more as a Macro Manger style or a Micro Manger Style.

Secondly... do you keep a rule book, guide, journal etc in writing that you maintain for you and your submissive partner(s)

It is my hypothesis that Micro Managers (to be effective) are more likely to have more written structure than Macro Manger styled Dominants.


What are your thoughts?  Do you think there are other factors that tend to cause some to put alot into writing etc than those that don't?



AdamTaylor -> RE: Is there a connection? (8/19/2008 8:13:16 AM)

I didn't really find a need to micro manage my slave that much.

I mean, sure, when she was being trained, I had to be thorough, and go over everything. And make sure she fully understood every nuance of the relationship.

But, after a time... when the training was truly showing... it became a lot more "free flowing". She knew what was expected. She wanted nothing more than to serve. I could let her be, and know that she would do as I expected, because I took the care to train her well.

I know a couple of Masters who are constantly ordering their slave to do every little thing. Practically looking over their shoulders the whole time. I find that to be too much.

If they're trained well, then they should be able to perform more on their own. It's... second nature to them. My slave learned my routine, knew what I wanted and when I would want it.

Sure, there was always things I would have to tell her. And always little things for her to learn.
But I didn't find that I needed to oversee every little thing she did. She did quite well on her own initiative.

Of course, that's why I like a slave with a good head on her shoulders, who has that drive. So that they will take that intiative to learn how best to please you, and try to always improve.



RavenMuse -> RE: Is there a connection? (8/19/2008 8:17:39 AM)

The baseline is very much macro style with elements of micromanagement where a particular issue needs it or for a time as an excersise or ammusement.

Whilst I have in the past written out rules concerning one element or other where I found it warranted. It isn't a something I find needed often within a live-in situation.

Where I did use it has tended to be with playpartners or girls working toward the live-in situation. It gave them something tangable, something to lean on when I wasn't directly available. Not needed live-in where the standing rule is "If in doubt.... ask"



sweetnurseBBW -> RE: Is there a connection? (8/19/2008 8:18:34 AM)

I think it might be better to determine the style that the submissive needs. Not all submissives need micromanaging and not all thrive in it. I think it would need to be individualized for the differences in each submissive. Each person is unique and different and thrives and grows in a different environment.



Lockit -> RE: Is there a connection? (8/19/2008 8:30:40 AM)

I have never micro managed a submissive, but in the beginning I have required writting assignments and sometimes journals and have once had written rules covering certain issues.  I found them useful in being able to review it all so that they could see patterns of thought or in being able to understand certain things about themselves.  The rules came about when they were close to crossing a line or felt lost in area's or simply needed the structure to feel balanced.  These tools as I viewed them were not for long term use.

I am a dominant, not a mama and I don't want the role of micro manager.

Edited to add something addressing your last question.  I feel that when I have asked this of someone who wasn't overwhelmed by a writing assignment to start with, my submissive's knew they needed to focus on the topic/situation and give a lot of detail when they might not have otherwise.  They knew it was important and wasn't something I was going to pass over, as I was trying to take them some place most likely vital to 'us' if not just for them.



Mercnbeth -> RE: Is there a connection? (8/19/2008 8:35:59 AM)

 
quote:

...Do you think there are other factors that tend to cause some to put alot into writing etc than those that don't?


we have had the pleasure to meet someone from this site who has a self described "fetish" for paperwork, contracts, that sort of thing.  He described it as one of the reasons He enjoys putting time into writing, reading and collecting contracts, etc.

quote:

It is my hypothesis that Micro Managers (to be effective) are more likely to have more written structure than Macro Manger styled Dominants.

I'd say that there is a third option. A Macro Manager can utilize the specificities of a Micro Managed 'contract' to set Macro parameters of expectations. The 'micro' being a tool or reference/training guide to achieve a Macro state of existence.

A journal can be a benchmark of the micro used to determine if the relationship is still on the Macro path.



suhlut -> RE: Is there a connection? (8/19/2008 8:50:21 AM)

Once for a very brief point in my life, i spent time getting to know a Dom that nearly got me to hate reading. Believe me, since i LOVE reading and always have, since the moment i learned how to, he sure got close.

He would give me a list, that got increasingly longer, of stories he wanted me to read, and then write summaries on., that included my thoughts and feelings on what i had read. The faster i read and then wrote, the longer my assignment list became.

And so i decided that since i'd finished highschool years earlier, i just wasn't willing to feel like i was back in school. And since i was no longer reading for my own pleasure like i always have, and was instead beginning to hate the whole process, i decided that my own love of reading was in grave danger, and not willing to let that part of myself ~go~ i got rid of him instead.



NuevaVida -> RE: Is there a connection? (8/19/2008 9:03:35 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: RavenMuse

The baseline is very much macro style with elements of micromanagement where a particular issue needs it or for a time as an excersise or ammusement.


Oh I love the way you put that.  Can I use it in the future??  :)

A lot of people see micromanagement as a bad thing, and are quite vocal about it, but in some cases it is very useful.  What you described, RavenMuse, is much like what I experienced with my former Master.

I never had written rules, but there were times (especially in the beginning) I would write out what he said so that I didn't forget.



sambamanslilgirl -> RE: Is there a connection? (8/19/2008 9:46:04 AM)

in Daddy's case, He's neither Micro nor Macro - He's simply a DaddyDominant who doesn't follow the norm.



MasterFireMaam -> RE: Is there a connection? (8/19/2008 12:41:05 PM)

I'm much more outcome driven. I can give detailed instructions about how to do something if the person has no clue about how to do it and I do. However, I'm not going to stand over them with a crop and watch their every move. I have other things to do.

There are a few things that challenge this, such as is my t-shirts. I have a unique way of folding t-shirts so they don't wrinkle, if you do it right. In reality, if someone came along and could do a different fold, I'd be happy 'cause the goal is "no wrinkled t-shirts, without hanging them up". But, I have, as of yet, to meet someone who can do this and so I teach my unique way. It seems to take about three laundry cycles to get it down pretty decent.

Where things go and how they are placed is also a challenge. I drove my second husband crazy with this...I had post its on the inside of kitchen cabinet doors for years listing what stuff goes in a particular cabinet.

But how you mow the grass or change the oil or cook dinner isn't important to me...as long as I like the end result and you clean up after.

Master Fire



LuckyAlbatross -> RE: Is there a connection? (8/19/2008 5:36:34 PM)

I think I'm about as "go with the flow/pragmatic" as you tend to get.

Now, as to the connection between written rules and micromanager, it's almost redundant really. 



DesFIP -> RE: Is there a connection? (8/19/2008 5:56:42 PM)

The major difference I find between those who micro manage and those who don't are whether or not they have families. Rules like dinner must be on the table every evening at 6:30 don't work when a soccer game kicks off at 6:00 PM.



masterofdrkness2 -> RE: Is there a connection? (8/19/2008 6:05:29 PM)

I have base rules so to speak  things that have to be done daily but as far as micro management, I just cant see me having to do this . I will go any length to explain how I want things done , I will not stand over your should , but I may come back later and see how the task was done.if I can not depend on my girl to do what is expected of her , well there is other ways of making sure she does it right next time .
I do not keep a written record of anything , I do keep a mental record.



CallaFirestormBW -> RE: Is there a connection? (8/19/2008 6:30:11 PM)

We have had a broad range of practices -- We have had servants who are mostly 'bottoms', who come to scene, mostly with me. We have had house-servants - individuals who have not yielded up everything to us, but who joyfully serve in a variety of areas, with a moderate level of 'control' over their behavior outside of our presence, and with a few protocols, some of which are only instituted on occasion. Then we have had our bond-servants... whether they are physically with us or not, there are a larger pool of protocols and structures that control their behavior. We have requested journals and diaries, and have had written rules in place, especially for our trainees and our bond-servants, but we are flexible -- My Darling provides the structure and solidity to our foundation -- and I provide a measure of Chaos, resiliency, and excitement/unpredictability. With this being said, even our practices are not truly "micro-managing", in the way that I understand the term.

The more servants we are dealing with at any given time, the more important structures become -- especially structures that make it possible to assure that everyone gets the information and guidance that will make their experience with us valuable and enjoyable... and will keep my Darling and I from going insane trying to keep up with everything. *chuckles*

Calla Firestorm



DomDolf -> RE: Is there a connection? (8/19/2008 7:19:47 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

I'd say that there is a third option. A Macro Manager can utilize the specificities of a Micro Managed 'contract' to set Macro parameters of expectations. The 'micro' being a tool or reference/training guide to achieve a Macro state of existence.

A journal can be a benchmark of the micro used to determine if the relationship is still on the Macro path.


You saved me some writing... This is exactly how I do things. Not such a big surprise, when I think about it, this is how I run my business too. I prefer Macro and will Micro Manage certain "pet projects" or troublesome areas.

The journal is used for both of us. There should be growth in the relationship, some of it will be obvious and some will not be. I get great joy in reading a journal and seeing the development of the relationship over time. I want to document and be able to talk about her joy, sadness, fear, curiosity, questions, etc.

Dolf



MercTech -> RE: Is there a connection? (8/19/2008 7:26:23 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: KnightofMists

As a Dominant... do you see yourself more as a Macro Manger style or a Micro Manger Style.



Gad, I hate playing drill sergeant but I know how.. that is how I perceive micro-managing.  If I go into drill sergeant mode, something is wrong.. crisis, fuckup, or blatant disregarding house rules and standards.  The first two just happen from time to time... que sera.  The last one is a serious problem.  I can micro-manage but I detest having to do so.

Rules, expectations, standards, chores....

Rules ... may be subject to change but not without warning.

Expectations... When laundry is done it is folded, hung, put away.. not left in a basket on the couch.  When the pitcher is empty, more is made.

Standards... Grooming and cleanliness of person and cleanliness of household.. A bit of how I expect the end product to be.  Who cares how the standard is met as long as it is.

Chores: The mechanics of life.  Dishes washed, meals cooked, laundry done, maintenance done in a timely manner.  The things that need to be done in a household no matter who is in it.  It gets done by whomever does it best or gets to it first.

I have a roomie at the moment that requested a list of what I thought needed to be done on a daily and weekly basis.  She added a couple of things, questioned on some others, then made her own schedule.  And, asked me to make sure she holds to the schedule.  I can live with that.  And, I have a list that is my own responsibility just to make things clear.  She gets nervous if I do something on HER list like washing the dishes.

I guess I macro manage except for a few things that I am particular enough about to micro-manage.  i.e. I still want my pants folded to military specs before being put in the closet.  I want coffee of a certain type fixed a certain way.  And mis-matching my socks is a peeve.

Stefan




thetammyjo -> RE: Is there a connection? (8/19/2008 7:28:11 PM)

In the beginning of any training or ownership period I have a huge contract and lots of documents not to micro-manage but to help us both have a reference for what we are doing, what limits and interests are and how that changes over time. I find this especially useful because I'm poly.

Over the years though Fox and I have worked down to a two sentence contract with no end date.. the point by then is that we knew our rules, protocols and rituals and he trusted me to not abuse my authority while I trusted him to obey.

I'm a busy, busy, busy, did I mention busy, woman. I have not time or desire to micro-manage someone. I spent over 6 months training Fox so he damned well should know what to do as we approach our 9th year together.

There are things I exercise more authority over and times I exercise more authority. For example, we'll be at GLLA this coming weekend and I told him yesterday that I will pick out his clothes he will take with us. I may pick out his clothing a handful of times a year because mostly it is either not really important or he's a smart enough boy to know what to wear when.

Then there are big things that I exercise authority over since as his taking any job that might be out of town. He clears going out with friends with me before he tells them "yes" or "no" and he even requests time to visit his family. That's us; it might not work that way with another person even with me but after so long together he recognizes my wisdom and trusts my authority on such matters.




yourMissTress -> RE: Is there a connection? (8/19/2008 10:38:53 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: KnightofMists

Some Dominant individuals establish alot of rules, duties and protocals in their relationships.  We often see this type of Dominant as leaning towards a Micro Manager.  Others have a much more less structured relationship base and is more free flowly but no less authority rests or is excercised with the Dominant and they are more akin to the Macro Mangers.

As a Dominant... do you see yourself more as a Macro Manger style or a Micro Manger Style.

Secondly... do you keep a rule book, guide, journal etc in writing that you maintain for you and your submissive partner(s)

It is my hypothesis that Micro Managers (to be effective) are more likely to have more written structure than Macro Manger styled Dominants.


What are your thoughts?  Do you think there are other factors that tend to cause some to put alot into writing etc than those that don't?


I am most definitely a Macro Manager.  There are few things (like my coffee) that I have specific enough parameters for that might require anything to be written down or directly supervised.    I don't want to grant permission to use the bathroom, have a conversation, leave the room, etc...  I want my subs to think for themselves, act on those thoughts, and if I find them to be doing things that I don't care for I will tell them so, but until I do, they should assume that they are doing everything correctly.  That is not to say I don't think that the subs who are being micro managed are not capable of thinking for themselves, but they are not acting on those thoughts independent of their D/M. 
 



leadership527 -> RE: Is there a connection? (8/19/2008 10:45:26 PM)

Well, the first question I'd want to ask is "Why the micro-management?"  After that I should think would be the to start generalizing.



SailingBum -> RE: Is there a connection? (8/20/2008 3:10:49 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP

The major difference I find between those who micro manage and those who don't are whether or not they have families. Rules like dinner must be on the table every evening at 6:30 don't work when a soccer game kicks off at 6:00 PM.


Sure it does.  It is the kids duty to get their ass to the game NOT the parents.  When you have more than a couple kids it would be impossiable to schedule dinner around their events.  So dinner is when the breadwinners get home from work.  Mindsets that it's all about the kids never made any sense to me.  somehow I managed to send to kids to collage with my way of thinking.

BadOne



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