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The value of friendship...................... - 5/16/2008 9:25:47 AM   
missturbation


Posts: 8290
Joined: 2/12/2006
From: another planet
Status: offline 		...................is exactly £240.30 over two months. Plus wages, free occasional beer, clothes, a shoulder to cry on etc etc etc.
My friend? / employee it turns out has been stealing from me. Over two months they have given their partner 89 pints, over ten gallon of stella free, gratis! On average 11 pints a week.
Unbe-fuckin-lievable!!!!!!
 
On top of that i now have the thankless long, long task of putting it all together so i can confront and sack her. This will mean hours of pouring over reciepts, till rolls, times etc etc. Not to count the six hours i have already spent doing the stock take from delievery notes and sales sheets.
 
Worst of all though someone i counted as a really good friend is no more. I am absolutely mortified that someone i bent over backwards for and loved to bits would do this to me!! Speechless...
 

 
 
 
 
 
 

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RE: The value of friendship...................... - 5/16/2008 9:29:56 AM   
cjan


Posts: 3513
Joined: 2/21/2008
Status: offline 		Sorry to hear of your disappointing experience, missturbation. Sadly, it seems to happen more than one would think, at least it has in my experience. As the saying goes: "no good deed goes unpunished". Nevertheless, I hope it doesn't permanently sour you on trusting in the future.Then, imo, you would lose, in the long run, more than you already have. Relationship, whether friendship or something more intimate always involves risk, of course, and a willingness to be vulnerable to a certain extent. Ce'st le vie.

< Message edited by cjan -- 5/16/2008 9:33:10 AM >

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RE: The value of friendship...................... - 5/16/2008 9:36:47 AM   
LadyHibiscus


Posts: 27124
Joined: 8/15/2005
From: Island Of Misfit Toys
Status: offline 		EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEh!  What a misery.  Worse that it is a friend doing it to you.....

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RE: The value of friendship...................... - 5/16/2008 9:47:22 AM   
sub4hire


Posts: 6775
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		Employees are not friends.  Its an easy rule to make.  Once an employee thinks they are your friend they take advantage.  Doesn't always have to be stealing.

Peers are friends.  I'm sorry you had to learn the hard way.  Yet when its over, its over.


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RE: The value of friendship...................... - 5/16/2008 10:05:15 AM   
Termyn8or


Posts: 18681
Joined: 11/12/2005
Status: offline 		That really sucks miss. But I think sub4 makes a good point.

The best friends are ones you don't do business with.

I have been considering going into business which would basically cause me to hire some friends, but I told them that if they ever fuck me I will make them miserable. I will do my part, say they'll be there at nine, I'll say ten. All of it. But if they don't give me all of it it is not fair.

And that would lose a friend, so you know what, I'll just go to work now.

T

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RE: The value of friendship...................... - 5/16/2008 10:05:16 AM   
pahunkboy


Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		I had a friend who cost me $20k.  [as in 20 thousand]

We wont talk about him.

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RE: The value of friendship...................... - 5/16/2008 10:23:44 AM   
GreedyTop


Posts: 52100
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Savannah, GA
Status: offline 		*hugs* MissT  sorry, sweetie :(

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RE: The value of friendship...................... - 5/16/2008 11:01:11 AM   
xxblushesxx


Posts: 9318
Joined: 11/3/2005
From: Kentucky
Status: offline 		Many bartenders give a friend free drinks. I'm not sure what you've lost is enough to lose a friendship over. Why don't you just talk to her, and let her know that a particular kind of beer is disappearing, and that there are to be NO free drinks from here on out.
I do take exception to the person who said that 'employees are not friends'. I was very good friends with the people I worked for, (coincidentally in a bar/restaurant btw). I never took advantage of our friendship or stole from them, although there were a few drinks given gratis. Most of the time they knew about it; but they trusted me not to over do it.
A free drink or appetizer every once in a while to a regular, makes them feel good, and lets them know they're appreciated.
I know that's not what was going on here, but, if she is a good employee, and a good friend, why not have a chat with her? I bet it would never happen again.

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RE: The value of friendship...................... - 5/16/2008 11:31:11 AM   
SugarMyChurro


Posts: 1912
Joined: 4/26/2007
Status: offline 		I barely want to comment on this one.

I know of a similar situation where someone is actually in an employee situation and routinely takes advantage in a very particular way. Every time they are confronted, it's done carefully and gingerly so as not to hurt their feelings - as they are a family friend they might act the offended party. The result is that the activity continues and will until that person is fired, as has been my prediction as to what will eventually have to happen.

People are often offensively stupid for I don't know what reason.

When that person is eventually fired, they will doubtless blame me - which in part will be true enough. What they won't do is blame themselves, as they should. If they had simply stopped doing what they had been spoken to about so many times the situation could have been avoided.

FWIW, in every other way this person is actually a really good person - among the best of persons in all reality. But they won't stop the behavior in question. It's really just a matter of me catching them at it yet again. I can tell...



It's unbelievably tedious.

In this situation I am at the mercy of someone far more passive-aggressive than myself. If it were up to me alone I *NEVER* would have allowed it to get this far. Business is business. I am as sweet as kitty kat most of the time, but do not cross me in a work situation. Then I will have your head on a pike. And so I wait. At least they all know I am the hatchet-man...it has it's benefits. Certainly I have had to fire people already. I'd rather rule through love, but if it must be fear that will do also.

Here in the states, part of the game that is played is that the employee wants to be fired in such a way so as to still collect unemployment benefits afterward. Even though they were sacked due to their own inadequacies. Meh. Whatever. I'm not trying to put people onto the streets. I just want them off the job if they refuse to perform as required.

And hey, we aren't talking about picking fruit in the fields, people - it's decent work at a very respectable rate of pay. And still we have these problems.

It takes all kinds...

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RE: The value of friendship...................... - 5/16/2008 12:01:05 PM   
MladyHathor


Posts: 510
Joined: 4/6/2008
Status: offline 		I am so sorry miss---one lesson, two ingredients that don't mix in business is family and friends EXCEPT on the paying side of the bar.

edited for typo, nails too long

< Message edited by MladyHathor -- 5/16/2008 12:52:05 PM >

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RE: The value of friendship...................... - 5/16/2008 12:46:32 PM   
MissMorrigan


Posts: 2309
Joined: 1/15/2005
Status: offline 		Wise words. It's a rule I have followed for the last twenty something years. I am friendly with my work colleagues, but would not socialise with them in my own time and for personal pleasure. While not everyone is opportunistic and out to take advantage, by blurring the professional/personal lines the potential for that is always there.

As for my friends, if I have it and their need is greater than mine, they are welcome to whatever I can provide. Friendship is the only relationship where you can take one another for granted, in my opinion.
quote:

ORIGINAL: sub4hire
Employees are not friends.  Its an easy rule to make.  Once an employee thinks they are your friend they take advantage.  Doesn't always have to be stealing.


< Message edited by MissMorrigan -- 5/16/2008 12:49:27 PM >

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RE: The value of friendship...................... - 5/16/2008 12:48:27 PM   
Justme696


Posts: 3236
Joined: 1/7/2008
From: Royal kingdom of the Netherlands
Status: offline 		I don't mind beeing friends with a collegue....aslong he is not my boss or working for me.
On the same organisation level..I have no problems with them.
IF I like them I like them.

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RE: The value of friendship...................... - 5/16/2008 12:59:47 PM   
Raechard


Posts: 3513
Joined: 3/10/2007
From: S.E. London U.K.
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: missturbation
I am absolutely mortified that someone i bent over backwards for and loved to bits would do this to me!! Speechless...


I'm not really sure how you can love someone to bits unless you are a crazy stalker with an axe.

Maybe you can confront her about it and work out some kind of agreement where she pays you back for your losses? Is she good at the job apart from the stealing? Do the customers like her? Maybe the boyfriend was pressurising her which is no excuse but occasionally people fall into bad habits. They do it once and then something in their mind goes wrong and they see doing these kinds of things as normal.

The way I see it is: you can cut your losses and loose all the money and a friend or you can work out some agreement where she works to pay off the debt. Obviously only you know how much you like her, how much she has messed you around in the past and how realistic giving her a verbal warning and making her pay it back is likely to be.

As others have already said though: don’t mix business and pleasure unless you work in a pub.


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RE: The value of friendship...................... - 5/16/2008 1:03:54 PM   
MusicalBoredom


Posts: 620
Joined: 5/8/2007
From: Louisiana/New York
Status: offline 		As others have said, I don't generally hire friends but I usually do get somewhat close to people that work for me.  I do have a bar (which is more of a hobby than anything else).  Everyone that has ever worked for me there has technically stolen from me even though they almost never see it that way. 

I generally give bartenders discretion in over pours and freebies as it's part of their job.  They know best when giving one round of shots to a table will result in the table staying longer and each in turn buying a round of shots but I have a "bar charge" set up for that.  I have had bartenders charge a patron full price and not ring it up and stick the entire bill in the tip jar.  I have fired for that.  I have had them treat the boyfriend to all they could drink but I just tell them to pay for the drinks.  Inventory theft as is in bottles of liquor or cases of beer I also fire for.  The solution that works best for me is I have employee tabs where they can put whatever they want on it but it comes out of their check.  I have a sign that says if it's not charged to the bar, paid for or put on your tab then it's stealing.

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RE: The value of friendship...................... - 5/16/2008 1:08:49 PM   
MissMorrigan


Posts: 2309
Joined: 1/15/2005
Status: offline 		Justme, that's interesting that you would befriend someone who worked alongside you, but not for you, although I do understand why. I have a minor problem where I work, they're a great team and are all firm friends. They socialise together and as yet, I've turned down two invitations to 'lunch' and an occasion to visit the pub after work. I do this for a number of reasons, not simply to stick to principle, but in the future I will likely be the person my colleagues are answerable to. I have a specific way of doing things, my previous employment saw the manager matey with her colleagues and as a result, had little to no respect.

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A free society is a society where it is safe to find one's self unpopular and where history has shown that exceptions are not that exceptional.

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RE: The value of friendship...................... - 5/16/2008 1:16:43 PM   
stella41b


Posts: 4258
Joined: 10/16/2007
From: SW London (UK)
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: missturbation
Over two months they have given their partner 89 pints, over ten gallon of stella free, gratis! On average 11 pints a week.



First I'd like to point out I had nothing to do with this (bad CM joke, stella, stella, geddit?)

Sorry missT, trying to make you laugh (or groan, or both) but here's a hug too. Gratis.

If that so-called friend thinks she can take others for a ride, maybe she should become a cab driver. (Okay, okay, I'll stop with the comedy).

Only this sort of thing isn't a joke.

In the OP's situation I wouldn't sack her, as that would only teach her to be more careful the next time round. I'd keep the person on but either deduct the amount from her wages or require additional unpaid work - either way it gets paid back. If this person doesn't like it, they can lump it. Let them walk, there and then. Either way she learns.

I believe in personal responsibility and also holding people responsible for their actions. Sacking her here is too easy. If she already hasn't got a job to go to it's easy to get benefits and if she has it doesn't really make a difference.

Making her walk makes it much difficult - she has to explain that, and it keeps the responsibility exactly where it lies, with her.

I run a theatre and charity, the people I work with I'm friends with, there's a family atmosphere. But it's very clear who makes the final decision and has the final say. There's usually a door available for anyone who doesn't agree with this.

We perform in pubs and we are based in a pub with whom we also have a friendly relaxed relationship. But we also differentiate between friendship and business.

Business is business, friendship is friendship. As long as the boundaries are made clear and kept, the two can mix.

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RE: The value of friendship...................... - 5/16/2008 2:04:06 PM   
pahunkboy


Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		It sounds like it is beyond repair.

Why pour over it all?  It isnt like she will repay it.

Cut your losses.         as to getting rid of her- easy;       transfer her to 3rd  staff.   which isnt  scheduled since it isnt funded.   mainly due to shortages....

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RE: The value of friendship...................... - 5/16/2008 3:32:22 PM   
cjan


Posts: 3513
Joined: 2/21/2008
Status: offline 		In my opinion, once someone steals from you, in any situation, trust is gone forever. It's non-negotiable .




_____________________________

"I never saw a wild thing sorry for itself. A bird will fall ,frozen , dead, from a bough without ever having felt sorry for itself."- D.H. L

" When you look into the abyss, the abyss also looks in to you"- Frank Nitti



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RE: The value of friendship...................... - 5/16/2008 3:37:42 PM   
stella41b


Posts: 4258
Joined: 10/16/2007
From: SW London (UK)
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: cjan

In my opinion, once someone steals from you, in any situation, trust is gone forever. It's non-negotiable .





Yes, but there's an aspect of holding someone accountable. Unless of course it's the Government.

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