Depression and dominance lost ... (Full Version)

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newlytaken07 -> Depression and dominance lost ... (2/14/2008 10:46:23 PM)

I have been living with my D for almost a year after doing the long distance thing for 18 months (2 hour plane flight every 2 weeks.) He moved to me. We had quite a few problems adjusting to living together and while many of those issues were resolved within a few months, some of the big ones remain.

It was a very big move for him: new city, no friends or family here, new job, new relationship status. About six months ago it became clear to both of us he was depressed. We got him to a doctor and he commenced anti depressants and counseling, all of which is continuing. There has been no major improvement as yet.

He doesn’t know whether he is depressed because he is here in this strange city, or here with me, or here in this house, or here in this relationship … or just because. Certainly the move seems to have been the trigger for his depression.

He has admitted that he is feeling less than committed to staying here with me but that he doesn’t want to make any decisions while he is unwell. It’s fairly clear we have significant relationship issues but we have both agreed to concentrate on getting him well before we tackle any relationship stuff. His counselor agrees this is a good idea.

There is currently very little power exchange within our relationship, no play and no sex. I feel I am in the position of waiting for him to get well so he can decide whether to stay or go. I miss his dominance and my submission. I miss sex. I feel very frustrated, on many levels, much of the time. He doesn’t want to talk about anything and I do, which leads to frustration on both sides. Unfortunately my frustration bubbles up into impatience and anger which makes things worse.

He seems determined to travel his path to recovery on his own and wants simply for me to be patient and quiet. He doesn’t seek or want my input and he certainly doesn’t need my anger. I love him, dearly, and want desperately to find a way to be patient with him and his depression.

I wonder sometimes how much of my frustration is because of his current (and understandable) inability to be dominant. I wonder how I can reclaim my submission in being patient and quiet with him. I wonder how I can help him reclaim his dominance. Because I think there’s a chance it might help both of us.

I would be grateful for any suggestions or comments. Thank you for taking the time to read my post.



laurell3 -> RE: Depression and dominance lost ... (2/14/2008 11:46:10 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: newlytaken07

It’s fairly clear we have significant relationship issues but we have both agreed to concentrate on getting him well before we tackle any relationship stuff. His counselor agrees this is a good idea.

He seems determined to travel his path to recovery on his own and wants simply for me to be patient and quiet. He doesn’t seek or want my input and he certainly doesn’t need my anger.


It seems you have your answer, you just don't want to hear what you are saying.  He can't focus on that right now.  Dominance is not a cure for depression and he really needs to figure out HIM right now without you. 

It's unfortunate that you changed your life so dramatically and find yourself in this position, but the lifestyle and relationships must take a backseat to his mental health based on what you, he and his therapist are saying.



MistressOfGa -> RE: Depression and dominance lost ... (2/15/2008 12:05:16 AM)

Depression is situational in my opinion. If I am unhappy where ever I may be, I will fall into a depression. I wouldn't want to hurt anyone's feelings by saying that my decision to be/remain with them has depressed me to the point of counseling. IMO, your Master needs time away from you, to see if the depression lifts. If it does, you have your answer. I don't think he is happy where he is. I know that when I am not happy where I am, I feel trapped and then depression settles in like a London fog. I don't want to be honest with myself and admit that the relationship I am in isn't working.
I moved 200 miles to be near my pup, my depression that I had prior to moving was suddenly gone.
Another thing you may want to watch for, is how he is feeling physically. Depression causes a lot of physical damage. Colds, headaches, flu-like symptoms, body aches and cramping (for women).
I wish you and your Master good luck. I agree with Laurell, dominance is not a cure for depression. In fact, many things that one used to find enjoyable are almost non-existent when they are depressed.
I also don't believe that medication is the be all end all of curing depression. Get out of the environment that is making you depressed and see how fast you start to heal.

Good luck to you.

MoGa



newlytaken07 -> RE: Depression and dominance lost ... (2/15/2008 12:14:53 AM)

I agree dominance is not a cure for depression. I also agree this is very likely a reactionary/situational depression. I have suggested we move, or he does, but he is firm on not making any decisions or changes at the moment.

I guess I am looking for different mental approaches for me to a) cope with this and b) be more supportive of him in the way he needs. Because while I know this isn't about me I need to live with the situation and be as helpful as I can to him.

Thank you both for your responses.



MistressOfGa -> RE: Depression and dominance lost ... (2/15/2008 12:20:23 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: newlytaken07

I agree dominance is not a cure for depression. I also agree this is very likely a reactionary/situational depression. I have suggested we move, or he does, but he is firm on not making any decisions or changes at the moment.

I guess I am looking for different mental approaches for me to a) cope with this and b) be more supportive of him in the way he needs. Because while I know this isn't about me I need to live with the situation and be as helpful as I can to him.

Thank you both for your responses.


NT07,
I agree that moving or making any major decision would be unwise until he is feeling better. Maybe just a bit of space is all he needs to get to feeling better. I have a rule for myself about depression and such. I give myself 3 days to cry and sit on my pity pot, then after the three days is up, I force myself to get up and get busy living my life. Sometimes it doesn't work, especially with major depression, but it does work for me.
Try not to coddle him for too many days. There is empathy and then there is enabling. I wish you the best. I know it is hard living with someone who is depressed and you must feel really helpless right now, as to what to do.

MoGa



HeidiAnn -> RE: Depression and dominance lost ... (2/15/2008 3:37:08 AM)

First thing that came to my mind is - how are you holding up? Would you benefit from counseling? In my last relationship we started going to a couples-counseling, my ex didn't want to come after a while and I ended up going there alone, lol. But it did wonders. To have a paid outsider (who has some education too) to speak about the hard times and what ever was on my mind at the time.

heidi



Reflectivesoul -> RE: Depression and dominance lost ... (2/15/2008 3:55:07 AM)

newly,
 
I've been thinking about this since I read your original post but something else stuck out to me and I wanted to ask about it.
 
In your other post you said you "need" to live with it and help him as much as you could.
 
Maybe this is also a problem. Sometimes someone just has to figure things out for themselves. I got the impression in your first post that you need to feel like useful in this situation, need some kind of reassurance, need to be doing something to help. Sometimes that need becomes smothering and that could be part of his depression.
 
I agree with heidi that you should find a possitive redirect or help for how you are feeling emotionally, an outlet if you will, that doesnt necessarily have to involve him. A hard thing about moving into a new situation, new home, new life with someone else thats semi new to you is that sometimes its very overwhelming and he may just need time to get himself back on track, the same counts for you. This is a newer relationship and its very possible that you both need a bit of distance to find "yourselves". That doesnt have to mean moving away or even moving out, it can be as small as having your privacy, having " me time".
 
I hope that helps and I wish you two the best of luck. Just keep in mind its not always the what you do, sometimes its the what you dont...
 
I completely admit that *I* may have misunderstood but I wanted to throw this out there in case I hadn't.
 
*edited cause the typo deamons were playing again*



LadyJeelys -> RE: Depression and dominance lost ... (2/15/2008 4:09:56 AM)

Clinical depression can't be fixed by a supportive partner, or by just getting over one's own pity party.....any more than diabetes can be fixed by a supportive partner or just getting over a pity party.

My suggestion would be to get informed about depression, and seek out support in your community. Also, I guess it ultimately comes down to what love means to you. If loving someone is about having their needs and your needs met, then you may have to think of those relationship decisions. If loving soemone is about you meeting their needs just because of who they are to you, then you may have to decide on how to go about living without those things you want.

But either way, learn about the illness that is depression.



Lashra -> RE: Depression and dominance lost ... (2/15/2008 4:33:50 AM)

I suffer from depression and yes sometimes I don't feel dominant or have the desire to play.  If you care about him respect the limits he has set up for himself. Let him go to therapy, takes his meds and try to get himself through this. You can be supportive, help him as best you can without getting angry. Instead focus that energy on yourself, because living with a person who suffers from depression is not an easy thing.

Also be prepared that he may decide that this move and this relationship was a mistake and that he may end up going back home. Then again his mind may clear and everything will work out alright. Only time will tell.

Good luck,
~Lashra



MistressVnus -> RE: Depression and dominance lost ... (2/15/2008 4:36:02 AM)

Only he, and he alone, can work through his depression.

That said, anyone in the same household with another who is dealing with a mental health issue is also affected by the issue.  His depression, as you have already noted, is affecting you even though you're not the one with the depression.
I strongly suggest you find a support group of some sort or have his counselor recommend a group for those who have loved ones dealing with mental health issues.  You may even want to consider some counseling yourself. While he is taking care of himself, you must also take care of yourself.

I wish you the best.



newlytaken07 -> RE: Depression and dominance lost ... (2/15/2008 4:44:13 AM)

I guess I am not holding up all that well, at times. I can be a fairly "feisty" person anyway, but this situation seems, at times, to bring out the very worst in me ... an anger ... and I haven't quite worked out why.

And yes I am considering counselling for myself. Reading that back, it's probably a good idea :)



LadyHathor -> RE: Depression and dominance lost ... (2/15/2008 4:54:00 AM)

I really wrestled with My response to this one as a few thoughts raced around in the hamster cage:
 
" He moved here, new job, no family, no friends.."
 
and something a dear friend commented on " as long as we saw each other on the weekends, I could hide aspects of myself..."
 
Please understand, I am not making light of depression, I have had many family members diagnosed with clinical depression, so I am sympathetic--however,
 
He knew he would be leaving things behind, one would have hoped that thought ( as Merc would say) would have caused him to 'project out" and deal with some what ifs--so the fact that all these things are new doesn't wash quite with Me--He knew, it wasn't a mystery.
 
This could have been there and untreated or undiagnosed before you got together--you never would have known as for short periods of time, we can hide almost anything from someone else.  Were there things that if you look back on now, may have indicated this was brewing?
 
Don't feel guilty, first and foremost--that is the most dangerous thing at the moment, that you will become racked with guilt because he moved to YOU---it is hard indeed when a submissive has no guidance from their Dominant---as they don't know which direction to go---there is no framework to work within--however for the moment, you are two room mates, he has developed a problem and your normal tendency is to care--I applaud you for that.
 
Yet, keep your eyes open, before you know it, months and years can pass by and you are still waiting for change--I say--watch, wait and see for a time that is reasonable, after that, you have a life to get on with--and some hard decisions may need to be made for your sake.
 
I do hope that is works out.
 
 



newlytaken07 -> RE: Depression and dominance lost ... (2/15/2008 4:54:18 AM)

Reflective,

Thankyou. I *do* have this need to feel useful and be helpful. It is something I am usually quite good at ... I probably need to make an effort to let that go ... The "sometimes it's the what you don't do" really resonates with me and he *has* been saying words to that effect all along ... I think you hit the nail on the head.

Some distance would be healthy too I think ... we do spend a lot of time together ... mainly because I feel guilty he has no social network to speak of here so I spend most if my spare time with him. Guess that could be on the smothering side lol.



newlytaken07 -> RE: Depression and dominance lost ... (2/15/2008 5:04:56 AM)

LadyJeelys - Completely agree, though I do need to remember that I can't "fix" this. I am quite educated about depression as an illness but it is easy to forget all the clinical stuff when you are living with someone who is ill.

Lashra - Thank you. While not exactly prepared for it, I do recognise this all might end because he decides it was a big mistake to move here. It's part of the problem in a way, as it is very hard to be supportive knowing he might up and leave when he's feeling better. I will try and think of ways to redirect my energy when I am feeling frustrated and cross with him.



newlytaken07 -> RE: Depression and dominance lost ... (2/15/2008 5:22:26 AM)

MistressVnus, thank you for your understanding and kind wishes.

LadyHathor - He has a past history of depression and I knew this well before he moved here. It was years ago, after a relationship break up and subsequently moving cities and jobs. I do find it frustrating that it doesn't seem to me as if he thought all of this through quite as well as he might have. But then it didn't occur to me to talk about it either, at the time.

The guilt? Too late, I do feel very guilty already for precisely the reason you mention .. that he moved to me.

I am finding it extremely difficult receiving very little guidance from him. This is my first D/s relationship of any significance and I feel quite lost at times. And then resentful, as this is not what I thought I was signing up for. And then guilty again .. and on it goes.

I am aware I cannot wait forever and said as much this afternoon.

Thank you for your insight.



Skully7000 -> RE: Depression and dominance lost ... (2/15/2008 6:36:39 AM)

I am also a big fan of "Fake it till you Make it" go out meet people life your life like you are the happiest guy in the world and pretty soon you surround yourself with people who truly make you happy.
****************************************************************
a slightly related reposting of something i wrote a few years ago that have been useful to others:

"How do you deal with it? Someone out there must be better at this than me."

unfortunately i doubt this would actually help you but you asked what works for me.
(in order of severity)

1)remind myself that i DO have the ability to let that which does not matter slide...

2)remind myself that if this is how they treat me then they no longer deserve all that i can offer them as friends...and i start to restrict my trust and emotions etc so that they are not able to do it again

3)i do something to get my mind off of it (music usually works best TV works really well,while its on, but sometimes after i turn the tv off it comes right back)

4)i get it off my chest by telling a close friend

*****usually all of these tricks help get rid of the intial emotions that are bothering and once that happens i am usually all good again, but if they do it again or do something similar that i am just starting to get upset with a person then i resort to the following:

5) i confront the person (it usually makes things a little worse intially but then i can resort to 1-4 to calm down and get it out of my system)

6) i excercise (either running/gym/stuff in my room/etc etc) and physically and emotionally get everything out of my system...especially since i listen to music and my workouts always start and end with a almost meditative stretching i always feel good after a workout.

************for absolute dier emergencies in pain sorrow anger and/or misery*********************

7) one 16oz container of fresh sour cream and one packet of hidden valley Ranch dressing/dip mix. stir and eat with pretzels

if its early enough in the day this is a one day supply if its later in the day then half first and the other half the next day...
preferably for dinner..(remember this is for when you are TO messed up for working out...so after this special extreme treatment 1-2 treatments of number 6 is required to return emotion levels *and fat levels* back to normal;)



Driver1961 -> RE: Depression and dominance lost ... (2/15/2008 7:10:30 AM)

He dips His lid to all:

Excellent advice here (would only be repeating to a large degree).   The O/P could have written about this in either Dominence or submission.   The effects upon a relationship are bascally the same when depression is involved. 

It is very relevant that you obtain counselling yourself.



BlackPhx -> RE: Depression and dominance lost ... (2/15/2008 10:12:24 AM)

May I proffer the following advice.

Support him in his efforts to deal with the depression and get some support yourself in dealing with how it affects you. 

Go back to doing some of the things you did when he was not with you. You developed coping skills then for dealing with the LDR and taking care of your needs. They still work. Use them. No you don't have the 2 hour plane trip and long phone calls but that was not all that you did. You worked, you went out, you were active. There is no reason for you to sit and be frustrated.

Try journaling and learning. Research things that interest you, take a class, attend demos. Do the things that you know are part of your submission to him, you had/have rules, hold fast to them, follow them, you will feel your submission even when he cannot dominate currently.

Get involved with volunteering to feed the need to submit. Working at a hospital or shelter can really help you satisfy that need to serve others.

Take out some of the frustrations in an online game like WoW, Guildwars, City of Heros or DDO. You would be surprised at how satisfying it can be to hack and slash even online and to have connection/conversations with people that has absolutely nothing to do with BDSM. (sometimes when I am feeling down, lonely because Master is out of town these games keep me up. There is nothing like seeing a critter fall apart after you have thrown everything you have at it along with 6 or more other people)

poenkitten (wishing you luck)



xxblushesxx -> RE: Depression and dominance lost ... (2/15/2008 10:24:03 AM)

Lots of good advice here.
I think when he is in the midst of depression, you have to focus on him, and not on the relationship.
Encourage him to get lots of exercise, eat healthy, and do lots of 'vanilla' projects with him.
Sometimes depression just happens. Exercise, healthy living, and things that keep you interested can help to abate those feelings.
So can counseling.
Another thing just occured to me; where did he live before? Was it usually sunny and warm? Do you live in a place that is dark, damp and cold? That could trigger depression for me.
I also understand your anger.
When someone is depressed, it's all about them. And you have to be all about them. And you can't understand why they don't just get up off their butt and do something; anything!
I also understand the other side of it. It can be very difficult to find your way out.
Continue seeking help for both of you.
You owe it to your relationship to try.

~Christina



newlytaken07 -> RE: Depression and dominance lost ... (2/15/2008 11:52:39 AM)

Thank you all for taking the time to respond, I really appreciate it.




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