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Calling All Computer Techies - 2/14/2008 6:35:46 PM

subfever

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Joined: 5/22/2004
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I've been getting friendly with a woman who has computer security concerns, and I don't know nearly enough about computers to provide any answers for her.

How easy/difficult would it be for one of her teenaged kids to access her saved Yahoo e-mail on a shared home computer?

Post #: 1

RE: Calling All Computer Techies - 2/14/2008 6:37:30 PM

farglebargle

Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
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You can't out techie the kids.

Well, *I* could. But I'm a professional.

_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to subfever)

Post #: 2

RE: Calling All Computer Techies - 2/14/2008 6:40:31 PM

GreedyTop

Posts: 52100
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Savannah, GA
Status: offline

Have her save it to disc, then keep the discs in a lockbox. Delete it from the computer. Not that deleting is is foolproof, but unless the kids have some driving need to read mom's email they aren't likely to dig that deep into the system.

_____________________________

polysnortatious
Supreme Goddess of Snark
CHARTER MEMBER: Lance's Fag Hags!
Waiting for my madman in a Blue Box.

(in reply to farglebargle)

Post #: 3

RE: Calling All Computer Techies - 2/14/2008 6:42:01 PM

TheGorenSociety

Posts: 116
Joined: 2/13/2005
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Yeah piece of cake for them, if they are remotely pc literate. She can always go in and delete them after each chat session

(in reply to farglebargle)

Post #: 4

RE: Calling All Computer Techies - 2/14/2008 6:44:14 PM

farglebargle

Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
Status: offline

Hell, if you're SERIOUS, you get a gmail account, and leave it all on the server.

***NEVER*** use the raw PC in the house to access it.... Use a ***BOOTABLE LINUX DISTRIBUTION*** like Knoppix, to boot the PC completely independently of the harddrive, and fire up firefox to access The Google.

Then when you shutdown, and remove the DVD/CD/USB drive, the PC boots back into windows, and all the temporary files from browsing and emailing ***DO NOT EXIST*** once you shut down Knoppix.

If you're *serious* that is... Of course, if the kids are serious, they'll put a sniffer on the Internal Lan and grab all the traffic from a to b.

( https://mail.google.com works, though, and keeps the ssh session up throughout the whole session... )

_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to GreedyTop)

Post #: 5

RE: Calling All Computer Techies - 2/14/2008 6:47:37 PM

celticlord2112

Posts: 5732
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quote:

ORIGINAL: subfever

I've been getting friendly with a woman who has computer security concerns, and I don't know nearly enough about computers to provide any answers for her.

How easy/difficult would it be for one of her teenaged kids to access her saved Yahoo e-mail on a shared home computer?

When they get her password, game over.

_____________________________

(in reply to subfever)

Post #: 6

RE: Calling All Computer Techies - 2/14/2008 6:50:28 PM

farglebargle

Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: celticlord2112

quote:

ORIGINAL: subfever

I've been getting friendly with a woman who has computer security concerns, and I don't know nearly enough about computers to provide any answers for her.

How easy/difficult would it be for one of her teenaged kids to access her saved Yahoo e-mail on a shared home computer?

When they get her password, game over.

Boot PC on Knoppix. Mount harddrive. Read every file. Game over, Man -- Game Over.

Windows is a joke. If they were serious, they'd ship with an encrypted filesystem...

_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to celticlord2112)

Post #: 7

RE: Calling All Computer Techies - 2/14/2008 6:56:24 PM

CuriousLord

Posts: 3911
Joined: 4/3/2007
Status: offline

Very easy, if they're into computers. Still, I have access to lots of confidential information I couldn't give one bit in hell at looking at.

If she absolutely has to hide it, she just needs to make sure she deletes the cache. If her kids are great computer experts and have some sick reason to spy on her, there's a series of things they can do to get around this; still, I doubt that'd be the case. Most teens have better things to do than spy on their parents.

Tell her to...
-Not save the password AND username. The username is a really big give away, even when the passwords aren't there. It's inconvinient for her to type it, but not leaving the key in the front door is the price of security.

If she wants to be one step safer, have her..
-Delete her cache files. Browser history, offline pages, profiles, cookies, etc. Everything. This can be done by right-clicking a primary IE icon (if she uses IE) and using the Delete option that I think's on the first tab.

If she wants to make sure that an obsessive, stalkerish computer expert can't find much...
-Have her get a program (like McAfee) which can "shred" files. (The trial version will do this indefinately for free. She can download it off various download sites.) This will shred most anything of value (so that it can't even be searched for without the FAT table, which is admittedly vague).

If she REALLY wants freakishly high security..
-She needs to learn where everything saves, shred all such associated files and those that they affect, and restart the computer or/and use memory cleaners to get stuff out of the RAM, and make sure that no key loggers or other spyware/malware exist on the computer.

If she wants the easy way...
-Just doesn't let her kids use her computer. Keep in in a place where they can't get it or/and have a BIOS password on it, not leaving it on when she can't moniter it.

Honestly, though, I think just clearing IE explorer files is plenty. McAfee shreder or similar service would be a bit much, but still an option.

PS- I'd like to consider myself a rather apt computer user, but even I can't trace deleted files. If I was serious about it, I'm sure I could look it up or ask some of my friends who study computer sciences to show me, but I can't see why anyone would go so far out of their way to spy on their parent.. particularly teenagers who probably couldn't care less what she does.

< Message edited by CuriousLord -- 2/14/2008 6:57:50 PM >

(in reply to subfever)

Post #: 8

RE: Calling All Computer Techies - 2/14/2008 7:18:14 PM

girlygurl

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From: in the palms of His hands
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Items such as pictures from playing are kept on a memory stick that is password protected. I'm sure if someone knew what they were doing they could get into it, but that's not something I have to worry about at home. I do use gmail.

girly

_____________________________

i see You

happily forever one

(in reply to CuriousLord)

Post #: 9

RE: Calling All Computer Techies - 2/14/2008 9:06:22 PM

subfever

Posts: 2895
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Thanks to everyone for their input... :-)

(in reply to subfever)

Post #: 10

RE: Calling All Computer Techies - 2/14/2008 9:51:10 PM

carlie310

Posts: 256
Joined: 9/23/2007
Status: offline

One important thing to know is that passwords on CM are not encrypted.

Ask me how I know.

(in reply to subfever)

Post #: 11

RE: Calling All Computer Techies - 2/14/2008 10:11:36 PM

Termyn8or

Posts: 18681
Joined: 11/12/2005
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OK carlie how do you know ?

CL, there is one thing I know, deleting the cache does not work. Even if you have 200MB and reduce the size so the files do not fit, if you increase the size they all come back. I don't know if Windows even knows how to delete a file anymore.

T

(in reply to carlie310)

Post #: 12

RE: Calling All Computer Techies - 2/14/2008 11:08:46 PM

carlie310

Posts: 256
Joined: 9/23/2007
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FR~sorry, that was a stupid thing to say. . .

Said password was taken from network server. Someone tried to use information in my cmails against me in a (koff) legal proceding. Someone was disappointed that I answered cmails with a standard "not looking because am currently not drama-free". Someone was also told that doing so (hacking password) was not only not admissable in family court, but also in violation of state & federal wiretapping laws. Someone has now backtracked off of stern legal stance and is now working much more collaboratively.

(in reply to Termyn8or)

Post #: 13

RE: Calling All Computer Techies - 2/15/2008 7:53:45 AM

Termyn8or

Posts: 18681
Joined: 11/12/2005
Status: offline

I am so happy to be drama free. But I don't quite understand how this happened. I know CM passwords are stored in a cookie. The cookie directory is not generally shared on the network. I know on my network I must specifically tell it to share folders, the default is to not.

So unless you shared the cookie directory, it shouldn't happen. The only reason I could see to do that would be if you wanted the biggest bounciest computer on your network to scan the others with an antivirus program or something. Even if you can do that you better have a firewall. I couldn't get it to work though.

Only other way is if they monitored your internet traffic, and if they can do that I would get my own ISP and disconnect from the network completely. Naw, I can't say the only other way, I don't know enough to say that. But when people start hacking into your private shit, AFAIAC the drama shall end. I will not have people around me I can't trust, but I guess not everrybody has that luxury.

I guess the very existence of this thread is evidence of that.

T

(in reply to carlie310)

Post #: 14

RE: Calling All Computer Techies - 2/15/2008 10:56:02 AM

carlie310

Posts: 256
Joined: 9/23/2007
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I didn't store my password on a cookie. There was a program set up on the network server or hub (am not network savvy, so don't really know exact term that should be use) to capture information as it passed through.

The gmail password, the yahoo password and other passwords were encrypted, although they could have been deciphered. (Everything can be hacked, but the question is how much time & energy it takes.) The CM password was NOT encrypted, and so was available on the screen as text.

Does that make sense? That's how the person who did the hacking explained it to me, in a rather snotty superior sort of way, so you are getting this second hand.

Drama ending soon, thank god. Prefer my drama on screen or stage, not personal life. That way it's entertaining.

(in reply to Termyn8or)

Post #: 15

RE: Calling All Computer Techies - 2/15/2008 11:06:24 AM

mhawk

Posts: 509
Joined: 11/5/2007
From: Washington
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how about getting one of those pcs that comes with the little thing where you encode the pc with your own fingerprint

(in reply to carlie310)

Post #: 16

RE: Calling All Computer Techies - 2/15/2008 11:10:14 AM

carlie310

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Joined: 9/23/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: mhawk

how about getting one of those pcs that comes with the little thing where you encode the pc with your own fingerprint

I don't know if that was directed at me, but my laptop was never touched. All of the sniffing was done from the network hub or server.

(in reply to mhawk)

Post #: 17

RE: Calling All Computer Techies - 2/15/2008 11:28:51 AM

mhawk

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Joined: 11/5/2007
From: Washington
Status: offline

sorry about that was just a general thought :)

(in reply to carlie310)

Post #: 18

RE: Calling All Computer Techies - 2/15/2008 1:05:16 PM

pahunkboy

Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline

a sledgehammer works best for the hard drive

(in reply to mhawk)

Post #: 19

RE: Calling All Computer Techies - 2/15/2008 1:27:47 PM

Aswad

Posts: 9374
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: subfever

How easy/difficult would it be for one of her teenaged kids to access her saved Yahoo e-mail on a shared home computer?

Trivial.

I've done security work, and have used computers since I was 4 years old, so feel free to PM me a question.
That said, the sad fact of security is that it comes down to people and tradeoffs.
Her kids knnow more than her, so she's at a disadvantage.

Tell her to get an Asus Eee... it's the size of a decent book, costs a mint, and will give her a bit more privacy, at least.
Then tell her to create a Google Mail account, and to use it only on the Asus.
That's about as good as it's likely to get for her.

Health,
al-Aswad.

_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.

(in reply to subfever)

Post #: 20

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