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SELF INDUCED SUBSPACE - 12/16/2007 3:24:11 AM   
scarletback


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Does anyone have any advice or experience of self induced subspace?  I am trying to find out if subspace could be used by a sub to get thro a terrifying and painful hospital procedure which lasts an hour.   Anyone???
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RE: SELF INDUCED SUBSPACE - 12/16/2007 4:13:50 AM   
SubmissiveAK


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I've done self-induced trance states before, with varying sucess. I dont think it would be enough for a hospital proceedure though.

Umm... tell him to think subby thoughts?

(in reply to scarletback)
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RE: SELF INDUCED SUBSPACE - 12/16/2007 4:38:31 AM   
juliaoceania


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I maybe wrong, but unless the person felt they were bottoming, I doubt it, it just does not sound likely

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RE: SELF INDUCED SUBSPACE - 12/16/2007 4:51:56 AM   
laurell3


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I guess it all depends on what you define subspace as.  Could you get to that feeling of wellbeing?  Sure, you can do that with relaxation techniques, meditation and other types of strategies.  Could you solo get yourself to the point where you are dispondent and feel no pain?  I doubt it and I really really doubt the medical staff would continue any procedure with you if you did.

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RE: SELF INDUCED SUBSPACE - 12/16/2007 5:33:04 AM   
Rover


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I'm sorry, but isn't this why medical science has developed anesthesia, sedatives and tranquilizers?
 
If your doctor has an actual medical degree, isn't it likely that he/she may prescribe some of these newfangled medicines for a "terrifying and painful hospital procedure that lasts an hour"? 
 
John

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RE: SELF INDUCED SUBSPACE - 12/16/2007 5:36:45 AM   
camille65


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It sounds like you need to explore self-hypnosis or get outside help for it if you haven't the time before the hospital stay.Good luck, some people (gee like me hehehe) have a pretty nasty phobia about doctors not to mention the hospital part. I'm okay if it is an emergency but if it is something scheduled ohjeez, my brain goes nuts. Like some dread the dentist, I absolutely bar none fear the doctor. Which is why I stupidly let my gallbladder burst inside me before seeking medical help. It can be a serious phobia and I hope your sub gets some help.Try a hypnotist, that is my advice.

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RE: SELF INDUCED SUBSPACE - 12/16/2007 5:38:23 AM   
Maya2001


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Maybe talk to the staff/doctor  about pain management during the procedure, plenty of stuff they can use these days that is short acting and allow them to go home "with someone is normally preferred" shortly after the procedure, i have had tubligation done undergeneral and went home just a couple hours after, I have had opiates and morphine added to driplines and drove myself home a couple hours later(but hospital staff not too happy about  but agreed only because the drive was less than 10 minutes) most recent surgery was hysterectomy  under general and I was up and walking around and used washroom unaided within  6 hours of surgery, 24 hrs later was already fit to go home,.   40  years ago some procedures where done without pain management  example reseting of broken bones inorder to realign which could be very lengthy depending on the severity of the break, today they would never dream of doing in the same manner especially without something for pain.

Our imaginations tend to get away from us leading us to think it will be far worse than what the actual will be like, I know I have been guilty of letting my imagination run away for me several times only to find I  got myself all worked up for nothing even close to what I imagined

< Message edited by Maya2001 -- 12/16/2007 5:39:40 AM >


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RE: SELF INDUCED SUBSPACE - 12/16/2007 8:43:46 AM   
chellekitty


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i'm with John on that crazy pain med thing...as for calming yourself, look into self hypnosis....you wouldn't actually be in subspace, but you could introduce thoughts of calmness for before and after the procedure so you don't panic...but the doctors and anesthesiologists will take care of the pain....

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RE: SELF INDUCED SUBSPACE - 12/16/2007 9:25:21 AM   
DesFIP


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Hypnosis, acupuncture, tranquilizers, pain meds taken an hour ahead of time, somebody loving to drive them there and home again, maybe even a teddy bear in the car there and back.

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RE: SELF INDUCED SUBSPACE - 12/16/2007 10:01:18 AM   
Noah


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quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

I maybe wrong, but unless the person felt they were bottoming, I doubt it, it just does not sound likely


One of my partners has effectively used such a procedure in enduring dozens (yes, dozens) of spinal taps over a period of months when doctors (those people with all the degrees) were unable to succesfully diagnose her problem.

I can refer as well to a large number of less dramatic instances involving a several different individuals.

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RE: SELF INDUCED SUBSPACE - 12/16/2007 10:20:35 AM   
Noah


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Rover

I'm sorry, but isn't this why medical science has developed anesthesia, sedatives and tranquilizers?
 
If your doctor has an actual medical degree, isn't it likely that he/she may prescribe some of these newfangled medicines for a "terrifying and painful hospital procedure that lasts an hour"? 
 
John


Many doctors will be well pleased to prescribe dangerous anaesthetics with well-known and perhaps unknown side and negative synergetic effects. Is that a good reason to favor surrendering control of your body and fate to others when techniques exist which may allow one to remain present,aware and un-drugged as an active agent in his or her own treatment?

You can't be unaware, Rover, of the grave, sometimes debilitating and even fatal side effects of anesthezia, sedatives and tranquilizers. I've never heard of any negative effects of learning to be calm in the face of trauma, nor of mentally re-contextualizing pain so that it can be bourn with a degree of equanimity.

Can you explain why you'd rather see someone drugged up?



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RE: SELF INDUCED SUBSPACE - 12/16/2007 10:30:24 AM   
Rover


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Noah

Many doctors will be well pleased to prescribe dangerous anaesthetics with well-known and perhaps unknown side and negative synergetic effects. Is that a good reason to favor surrendering control of your body and fate to others when techniques exist which may allow one to remain present,aware and un-drugged as an active agent in his or her own treatment?

You can't be unaware, Rover, of the grave, sometimes debilitating and even fatal side effects of anesthezia, sedatives and tranquilizers. I've never heard of any negative effects of learning to be calm in the face of trauma, nor of mentally re-contextualizing pain so that it can be bourn with a degree of equanimity.

Can you explain why you'd rather see someone drugged up?


You are welcome to make decisions for yourself, of course.  But most folks (including myself) consider "pain management" to be a legitimate medical profession.  Not the witch doctors and street corner pushers you wish to portray them as.
 
John

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RE: SELF INDUCED SUBSPACE - 12/16/2007 11:07:14 AM   
fusion


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Yes a long session of yoga where you really press into the strech (like Paschima pose) were you can  feel as they can it energy release, I call it pain!   Will produce the exact brain chemicals as a session of bondage and punishment.   A good instructor  at the end during  Savasana can send you completely under.    Namaste

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RE: SELF INDUCED SUBSPACE - 12/16/2007 11:42:19 AM   
LuckyAlbatross


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What they said- anti anxiety meds and self hypnosis will be good help.

Subspace is just one type of altered state of consciousness, there are many others which can give the same results you desire here.

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RE: SELF INDUCED SUBSPACE - 12/16/2007 12:20:15 PM   
scarletback


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Thanks for your reply.  Unfortunately i dont have enuf time to take a course of instruction otherwise i would try it.  Hospital looms tomorrow! But thanks anyway x

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RE: SELF INDUCED SUBSPACE - 12/16/2007 12:26:45 PM   
scarletback


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Thanks so much for your comments camille, you really heard me.  i am the sub who needs the help but unfortunately my hosp procedure is tomorrow. Doc gave me zanax and said it would get me thro and i have been taking them for 2 weeks and was as happy as larry, but as of today the pills have practically no effect on me and i am well capable of refusing to go into the hosp or running for my life.  So i dont have time to organise a hypnotist.  but thanks so much anyway x

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RE: SELF INDUCED SUBSPACE - 12/16/2007 12:35:57 PM   
scarletback


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Thanks for all your comments - if i had known that the tranxs would have no effect on me once i become terrified as the procedure looms i think i would have  booked a hypnotist but tis way too late for that now.  Once again many thanks to you all

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RE: SELF INDUCED SUBSPACE - 12/16/2007 12:38:40 PM   
littlebitxxx


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OP, you have CMail...well, you will shortly.

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RE: SELF INDUCED SUBSPACE - 12/16/2007 12:51:04 PM   
BondageSlaveMN


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There are two camps reagarding this line of thought. There are those that believe the mind can be trained to tolerate and negate pain. Take, for example, monks who set fire to themselves in demonstration. Many folks believe the "screaming" sound they are hearing is the monk screaming when in fact it is water and other liquids rapidly escaping the body much like the screaming a lobster makes when cooked. Also consider the fire walkers of India. They burn mounds of wood and bushes for days prior and then the participants walk an eighth of a mile on the hot coals without so much as a grimace.

In each of these cases, one might argue that the willing participants are feeling pain but simple are able to tolerate it without any outwardly demonstration. One might argue, as in the case of the fire walker, that the feet have been so thoroughly calloused that no pain is felt at all. And lastly, one might argue that the mind itself has been trained to not feel pain at all.

Then there is the camp that believes no such mental training to be possible. Science will show that pain receptors still send impulses to the brain and that they are likely still processed in these cases of severe pain.

Having studied quite a bit of neuroscience myself, I will give the following assessment. The brain is capable of "filtering" out stimuli. Take, for instance, your clothes. Once you have donned them, do you even notice that you are wearing them unless you consciously think about it? No, you do not (unless you have some variety of neuropathy). This is because the brain is "used" to these stimuli and "filter" them out as they are of no concern to the organism. Additionally, receptors have a point of threshold. This is the point at which a stimulus becomes powerful enough to trigger an action potential (in other words send information to the brain). Some receptors are capable of adaption. In other words, if these receptors are stimulated intensely enough for a long enough period of time, they adapt to the new condition and stop responding as intensely.

As far as pain is concerned, it is, obviously, possible to build a tolerance to it. This points to the idea that the brain and nervous system as a whole are capable of adapting to pain and probably to intense and extreme pain.

Now, as far as medical procedures are concerned, no respectable doctor will perform a procedure on a patient who is not receiving some sort of anesthesia. This may be general anesthesia (putting you out cold), sedation (you may or may not lose consciousness, but you don't require intubation) or local anesthesia (as in the case of most brain surgeries, birthes, etc.). The reason for this is two fold. Firstly, it would be severely traumatizing to the average patient to experience such pain without anesthesia. Secondly, imagine a knee replacement. Imagine the doctor making an incision on an unanethsatised patient and the patient jerking relexively. "Well, sorry but I just cut all the ligaments and tendons in your knee, you'll never walk on that leg again." A doctor offering such a procedure without anesthesia is a quack and/or does not actually have a license to practice medicine.

As for the comment likening doctors to drug pushers, this is an utterly ridiculous comment. Are you also of the opinion that vaccines and antibiotics shouldn't be administered? Of course there is a risk associated with anesthesia and medicines of all sorts. Any injection made to the body has a chance of becoming infected (although this chance is very minimal when correct sterile procedure is employed). Even conscious sedation (meds like propathol, midazolam and fentanyl) has the associated risk of causing respiratory distress, but this doesn't mean it's safer or better not to use them. And sure, people have died from vaccines and antibiotics, but statistically speaking, these medications saved many times over more lives than they have taken.

(in reply to scarletback)
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RE: SELF INDUCED SUBSPACE - 12/16/2007 12:52:42 PM   
BondageSlaveMN


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quote:

ORIGINAL: scarletback

Thanks for your reply.  Unfortunately i dont have enuf time to take a course of instruction otherwise i would try it.  Hospital looms tomorrow! But thanks anyway x


Scarletback,

What is your adversion to having anesthetics administered?

(in reply to scarletback)
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