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Germany to ban Scientology? - 12/3/2007 4:16:25 PM   
Level


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Status: offline 		BERLIN - Germany could be asked to ban the U.S.-based Church of Scientology under a Hamburg security official's proposal that contends the group violates human rights.

Hamburg's secretary of the interior, Udo Nagel, plans to seek a nationwide ban of Scientology at this week's meeting of top German security officials, spokeswoman Ulrike Sweden said Monday.

The German government considers Scientology a commercial enterprise that takes advantage of vulnerable people. During the summer, it initially refused to allow the producers of a movie starring Scientology member Tom Cruise as Germany's most famous anti-Hitler plotter to film at the site where the hero was executed, although it did not expressly state Scientology as its reason.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22083928

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RE: Germany to ban Scientology? - 12/3/2007 4:19:53 PM   
bipolarber


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Status: offline 		Good for Germany! Glad to see someone in the world has sense enough to see this "religion" as something to be discouraged.

I wonder if Hubbard ever collected from Heinlien on the bet? 

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RE: Germany to ban Scientology? - 12/3/2007 4:23:56 PM   
SeeksOnlyOne


Posts: 2012
Joined: 5/14/2007
Status: offline 		someone gave them my exes name a couple years after he left.....for almost 4 years, i have been gettin stacks of junk mail from them....i have called them.....written them....mailed it all back in their own pre paid envelopes......i have cursed them, told them i disagree with every fucking thing they stand for and i find them to be morons.....i have been nice......

can someone just ban them from my mailbox?

< Message edited by SeeksOnlyOne -- 12/3/2007 4:26:22 PM >

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RE: Germany to ban Scientology? - 12/3/2007 4:36:25 PM   
Sinergy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: SeeksOnlyOne

someone gave them my exes name a couple years after he left.....for almost 4 years, i have been gettin stacks of junk mail from them....i have called them.....written them....mailed it all back in their own pre paid envelopes......i have cursed them, told them i disagree with every fucking thing they stand for and i find them to be morons.....i have been nice......

can someone just ban them from my mailbox?


I got rid of them by finding one of their local offices and submitting a politely worded change of address card showing me at the new address.

I think I messed up and put their office's address as my new address.

Just me, could be wrong, etc.

Sinergy




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RE: Germany to ban Scientology? - 12/3/2007 4:37:53 PM   
CuriousLord


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Status: offline 		Hah, screw Scientology!  It's merely an organization that tells lies to vulnerable and emotionally insecure people to gain control over them, their lives, and their wallets in exchange for a feeling of belonging and security.  It's a wretched enterprise, preying on children at every chance to force them into a mindset of unquestioning acceptance of whatever lie that they happen to be told.  They're shameless, using times of distress in peoples' lives, such as the death of loved ones, to take advantage of the oppurtunity to enforce their system of lies on the grieving.


However, I am slightly confused, though.. how is this different from any other religion?

< Message edited by CuriousLord -- 12/3/2007 4:38:38 PM >

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RE: Germany to ban Scientology? - 12/3/2007 4:41:58 PM   
Zensee


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Status: offline 		Great for Germany! Let's hope they ban all those other mind control cults next; Roman Catholicism, Protestantism, Judaism, Islam...


Z.

Curses CL! You beat me to it.


< Message edited by Zensee -- 12/3/2007 4:43:21 PM >

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RE: Germany to ban Scientology? - 12/3/2007 5:01:14 PM   
LivingInSin


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quote:

ORIGINAL: bipolarber

Good for Germany! Glad to see someone in the world has sense enough to see this "religion" as something to be discouraged.


Speaking as an individual who belongs to a religion that isn't "mainstream" I find this type of decesion making by governments appalling. I understand that not every nation has freedom of religion, and can only hope that our Constitution isnt revized in someway to ban that freedom.

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RE: Germany to ban Scientology? - 12/3/2007 5:25:03 PM   
CuriousLord


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Status: offline 		Ultimately, religion will die off.  It will be interesting, though, to see if it's moreso due to education or illegalization.

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RE: Germany to ban Scientology? - 12/3/2007 5:56:44 PM   
MasterDragas


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However, I am slightly confused, though.. how is this different from any other religion?
[/quote]


The only difference really is the founder has been quoted as saying "The fastest way to earn money is to start a fake religion." 

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RE: Germany to ban Scientology? - 12/3/2007 6:17:44 PM   
CuriousLord


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Status: offline 		Ah, the first mistake any religious leader can make: honesty.

I mean, seriously, can you imagine if Joseph, father of Jesus, got drunk and told his friends, "Okayshh... guuyyss.. I'm a gonna tell youuuu'll somethin' funneh, but yous gots to promise to keepish a secet!  I got drunk and nailed Mary like a year o' soo ago.. 'n we made up dis God-did-it excuse cause, you know, that whole we'd-be-stoned-for-pre-martial-sex-if-we-didn't-lie-about-it thing."

Or.. Moses comes from from the mountian, "You know, guys.. I'm not really sure if God spoke to me, but I've been suffering pretty heavily from dehydration and probably some various drugs I'm doing while suffering from exposure to heat all alone, so I just wrote down some of the things I believe in on these tablets.  They're not really what God, persay, handed down, but I think they sound sorta good."

Or, Mohammed.. "You know, God didn't actually command me to kill these innocent people for their gold.. I sorta just wanted to be rich 'n shit."

Or that king dude from England.. "Bah, the fuckin' Pope didn't give me my divorce, and I'm really into the whole kill-your-wife thing, so I just decided to start a new religion."

Or Martin Luther.. "Well, you know what?  This religion's full of shit, and I've finally been a monk long enough to realize it.  But, I'm too far invested into it to speak out against it directly, so, instead, I'm going to try to sanitize it to suit my idealoogy better."

Or that Hindu guy or whatever.. "Man, I'm depressed.  To live is to suffer!  Now give me back those razor blades so I can cut myself and hide it in my long sleeve jacket."

Or whoever the hell started that Japanese our-ruler-is-divine one... "Yeah.  He said I'd better get people to like them or he'd cut me up into little bits, starting with my penis and testicles.. so, um, yeah.. praise the ruler guy now, bitches, or I'll tell him that he needs to chop up your genitals!"

Or the people who do witch craft.. "Well, there's oblviously no God, but why can't there be supernatural shit?  I feel like I'm a naturally powerful and special person, so I must actually be a witch and able to cast spells!  Hah!  No, I'm not following a passive aggressive cult started by repressed women long ago!"

Or the people who did the Zues thing.. "Well, that lighting bolt there hit this tree that I was too lazy to chop down, so I'm just going to say I caused it indirectly by getting Zues to do it for me."

(Actually, some of my poking-fun-at-ancient-religions is probably not entirely fair.  Honestly, they were probably more uneducated, malnurished, and drunk to think straight, instead of deliberately deceitful as some others are.)

Bah.  I wanna do a Mad TV sketch, damn it!

< Message edited by CuriousLord -- 12/3/2007 6:21:02 PM >

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RE: Germany to ban Scientology? - 12/3/2007 7:43:29 PM   
DomKen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LivingInSin

quote:

ORIGINAL: bipolarber

Good for Germany! Glad to see someone in the world has sense enough to see this "religion" as something to be discouraged.


Speaking as an individual who belongs to a religion that isn't "mainstream" I find this type of decesion making by governments appalling. I understand that not every nation has freedom of religion, and can only hope that our Constitution isnt revized in someway to ban that freedom.

Is your religion a tax dodge that developed a life of its own? Anyone who looks into the actual history of scientology as documented by those who knew Hubbard at the time including those who helped him dream up the basics of the chuirch over cocktails so as to avoid paying so much in taxes on his self admitted BS self help book will come away certain that thetans and Xenu and the rest of his space opera "religion" is made up from whole cloth.

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RE: Germany to ban Scientology? - 12/3/2007 8:00:44 PM   
Lumus


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Status: offline 		mMmMm...

...vulnerable people...

*drools*



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RE: Germany to ban Scientology? - 12/3/2007 8:13:24 PM   
CuriousLord


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

Is your religion a tax dodge that developed a life of its own? Anyone who looks into the actual history of scientology as documented by those who knew Hubbard at the time including those who helped him dream up the basics of the chuirch over cocktails so as to avoid paying so much in taxes on his self admitted BS self help book will come away certain that thetans and Xenu and the rest of his space opera "religion" is made up from whole cloth.


In a way, "Scientology" lives up to its name.  I mean, think about it.. scientifically, we put out the theory that religion just stupid things made up that people follow for various reasons, even when it's obviously both stupid and bad for the followers.  Scientology, in a way, could even be called a scientific experiment to see if it's true.  And, you know what?  It even got started off in this day and age when we like to think that education is more prevalent.

Honestly, how hard would it have been for religions to take off when people honestly didn't know how the world worked, when the idea that lighting was supernatural was actually a fairly decent hypothesis?  When we didn't understand the most basic workings of the human body, when magic seemed a bit more plausible?

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RE: Germany to ban Scientology? - 12/3/2007 10:53:49 PM   
HaveRopeWillBind


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quote:

ORIGINAL: SeeksOnlyOne
can someone just ban them from my mailbox?


Seeks,
Tell them you really want to join... just as soon as you finish filing for Chapter 7.

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RE: Germany to ban Scientology? - 12/4/2007 12:31:47 AM   
Real0ne


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Zensee

Great for Germany! Let's hope they ban all those other mind control cults next; Roman Catholicism, Protestantism, Judaism, Islam...


Z.

Curses CL! You beat me to it.




the media!


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RE: Germany to ban Scientology? - 12/4/2007 5:11:34 AM   
joanus


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Status: offline 		Finally nice to see someone showing them who is boss. I always knew being an idiot would get Tom Cruise in trouble some day.

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RE: Germany to ban Scientology? - 12/4/2007 5:51:57 PM   
FangsNfeet


Posts: 3758
Joined: 12/3/2004
Status: offline 		Could this ban be a sign for WWIII? After all, last time Germany put a ban on a certain culture, we ended up with WWII. It looks like Germany is about to repeat history. Only this time, the German government is going after a different group. I can't wait to see how this turns out.

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RE: Germany to ban Scientology? - 12/4/2007 6:59:00 PM   
OrionTheWolf


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Status: offline 		Fast reply:

The way some people act about politics, it could be considered a religion.

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RE: Germany to ban Scientology? - 12/4/2007 9:02:32 PM   
bipolarber


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Status: offline 		I suppose you would have to go after all religions, on the basis that they are irrational, and can all be proven false. Like John Lennon once sang: "Imagine there's no countries, and no religion too..."

That still leaves the concept of God.

And I'm sorry. But the whole idea that a bunch of people should waste their lives following the writings of some pulp hack just seems cruel, ultimately. It wastes their time when they could be working on much more worthwhile pusuits. This goes for any of that junk: scientology, Trek, or those sad nutjobs on another part of this site.

As much as I love Trek (I grew up on the stuff!) It is just a TV show. Xenu the alien was an invention of one man's overactive imagination, and was turned into a money machine by his followers. And you can look up my posts on the nutjobs elsewhere on CM. I make my opinion known.

So, I stand behind my first post on this thread: Go Germany! It's about damn time that someone stood up against the insanity. "Religions" that were created out of whole cloth... on a bar room bet no less... need not apply.

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RE: Germany to ban Scientology? - 12/4/2007 9:20:29 PM   
CuriousLord


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Status: offline 		I know this likely sounds crazy.. but when religion's gone.. I wonder what the world might be like.. if people might start realizing that they really are ultimately responsible for their own destinies..

And, hey.  If it goes bad, we can always create new religions.  Perferably ones that don't cause severe physchosis in their followers.  (It's really creepy when people say "God talks to me",, not that "I talk to God" is that much better.)

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