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marketing genius required; apply within - 10/12/2007 5:03:09 AM

LadyEllen

Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline

Right then - youre each and every one a genius - so I'm looking for advice and opinions on how to best promote my business!

Its full semi-trailer transport service between the UK and Europe. Its extremely competitive, and competition is based on price - since we all have to work with the same vehicles, same roads, same driving regulations etc its not possible to differentiate very well on any basis other than price - and the key is to have a low cost base which of course helps in competing on price.

When it comes to sales activities, we are in much the same position as double glazing - the people who purchase our services (shipping/export departments) are bombarded every day by dozens of calls from the likes of us, and they dont want to deal with that so we often get nowhere with cold calling. The same applies with fax and email marketing - an advert goes out by fax or email - well thousands do, and this worked once but no longer - in fact its seen as a nuisance so we stopped it. Similar with mail outs through the post, even when we verify that we can send the information and have a named person to send to - nothing results but paper recycling.

Now, recent developments in the market have led to a shortage of vehicles - we notice this in that we cant source spare capacity so easily as before, and hauliers with spare capacity are charging a fortune to us, reducing our margins, whilst the customers dont want to pay anything more than they did in 2003. The increased costs are fair enough - diesel has risen markedly, many hauliers have left the market unable to make money in it, and new trucks are on a 12 month waiting list to buy at very much higher prices than previously - presumably the effect of steel prices due to China etc importing so much of it. But, even paying top dollar for haulage service, we are still getting the same shit service from the hauliers - making it impossible to ask customers for any more money in the price!

So, we have to find some way in which we can charge 20% more than at present and have customers lapping it up, and some way to promote our services which will get whatever new idea differentiates us to warrant the increase, in front of customers who want to hear about it.

Over to you!

E

_____________________________

In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

Post #: 1

RE: marketing genius required; apply within - 10/12/2007 5:06:08 AM

pahunkboy

Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline

- no doubt there is work there. maybe you can do a feature story about a shipment that saved a life,,,,

(in reply to LadyEllen)

Post #: 2

RE: marketing genius required; apply within - 10/12/2007 5:13:20 AM

jollyrodger66

Posts: 1
Joined: 10/5/2007
Status: offline

hi maam, well it sounds like its not any different over there as it is in the u.s. the only thing they are doing over here is charging that 20% to the customers as fuel surcharge and rolling it back to them if you ahve a good customer base they should pay it to stick with you, but there is no loyalty in todays maket, if you haul general freight youll never make alot of money youll make ends meet i learned that early so i went to specialized (heavy hauling,and yachts) if you can find your own nichie in the market and get away from general freight you might have a chance talk to you later tommy.

(in reply to LadyEllen)

Post #: 3

RE: marketing genius required; apply within - 10/12/2007 5:16:00 AM

pahunkboy

Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline

-some places here have added a fuel surcharge,

intersting you should post this. I was thinking of doing a post: sorta a riddle me this in a way.

http://www.degensteinlibrary.org/River%20Front%20Site%20Plan/by%20chapter/06_operatingcosts.pdf

So I pose this to pick the brains here. My town is getting an ampitheator. The question is; how does it become good for the residents. I should state that 5 univeristies are at or less then 1 hour drive. While it is a small venue, [once completed] we can throw concerts cheaper then State College PA. [home of Penn State U.]

Any comments welcome.

(in reply to pahunkboy)

Post #: 4

RE: marketing genius required; apply within - 10/12/2007 5:41:51 AM

LadyEllen

Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: jollyrodger66

hi maam, well it sounds like its not any different over there as it is in the u.s. the only thing they are doing over here is charging that 20% to the customers as fuel surcharge and rolling it back to them if you ahve a good customer base they should pay it to stick with you, but there is no loyalty in todays maket, if you haul general freight youll never make alot of money youll make ends meet i learned that early so i went to specialized (heavy hauling,and yachts) if you can find your own nichie in the market and get away from general freight you might have a chance talk to you later tommy.

Hi Tommy

Thanks - nice to see someone else in the same sort of business here! We were talking about fuel surcharges the other day with our sister company who transport in the UK only - apparently they have no problem to levy a fuel surcharge and get it paid these days, though years ago there was resistance to it.

Its something we could consider - but we also have to consider this; we costed out acquiring our own vehicles in Romania (cheapest in EU) with Romanian drivers who cost around USD 500-00 a week for seven nights out (again, cheapest in EU). The best cost we could get per km travelled was £0-77 (USD 2-45/mile approx). This is 20% higher than the prevalent costing in the market of £0-64/km - on which the hauliers working at that rate are making money.

When we go to the market and ask hauliers for a price, we get told £0-69 per km; again this is 8% over the prevalent market costing, though it leaves us with around 2% margin - but then financing and admin eat that up. And we know from research that some hauliers' costs are as little as £0-55/km - but going off the figures for our own vehicles, this is absolutely impossible.

What this means is that if we ask for 20% fuel surcharge (or increase for other reasons) we are likely to no longer have any customers - because others are not charging like raging bulls for some mysterious reason. None of it makes any sense whatever - and we are in a niche market really, rather than general haulage; we specialise in high volume vehicles - which cost about the same to run but take much more cargo as long as its lightweight stuff - packaging and so on.

Whats also affecting customers' ability to offer the right price in my opinion is the low cost of importing stuff from China etc nowadays. If they paid the right price for transport, the goods they export to Europe would be too dear and the goods they import likewise. Indeed, we have already lost two customers this year, who switched from importing from Italy to importing from China.

E

_____________________________

In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

(in reply to jollyrodger66)

Post #: 5

RE: marketing genius required; apply within - 10/12/2007 5:44:55 AM

pahunkboy

Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline

At 2% margin, might it be better to hire an indapendent, and get a %. 2 % wont even cover insurance here,

(in reply to LadyEllen)

Post #: 6

RE: marketing genius required; apply within - 10/12/2007 7:01:36 AM

petdave

Posts: 2479
Status: offline

So if i understand, you're actually a shipping broker rather than a shipping company, or do you do both?
Maybe some kind of market specialization? Liquid tankers, hazardous materials, high-value, overweight, oversize, or fragile items? Air/rail/sea in addition to over-the-road? Generally speaking, even if 99% of people out there are so overwhelmed by service providers that they're sick of even hearing about it, there's always 1% that are doing something different that makes it a pain in the ass to get things done right, and if you can serve them well (provided it's a big enough niche) you can remove yourself from the melee.
Do you also do customs brokerage, or is that no longer an issue with the E.U.?
It kind of sounds as though you're performining a middleman service in an overcrowded market where the middleman isn't really providing a lot of value to the transaction... But if that impression is incorrect and you are providing value, the back-to-basics approach is to figure out what the key value you're providing is and emphasize that in your marketing AND your operations... Is it convenience? Speed? Professional knowledge? Security? Contacts/know-how in Eastern Europe?
If there's nothing, then you might consider closing up shop and going on the dole. i hear UK benefits are pretty sweet

(in reply to pahunkboy)

Post #: 7

RE: marketing genius required; apply within - 10/12/2007 7:02:24 AM

Termyn8or

Posts: 18681
Joined: 11/12/2005
Status: offline

LE, a thing or two come to mind.

First and foremost is speed. In a business where we have to respond to calls, the fastest is usually the bestest. And when we order materials and parts, we want them yesterday. In today's world that is how it is. And ultimately our customers are what impels us to be that way.

Cost including shipping is a factor, we will have so much into material and man hours and still must make a profit. But there are times when even a small part costs say $20 to ship. Say it is a $300 job and the part costs $100. Well we can get it overnight for $35 more. Do you pay it ? Sometimes we do.

So that, seems to me, to be the key. Trucks can hold packages of any size, and smaller packages should pay better. The trick to being successful in this is the routing and scheduling. Speed pays.

If you are talking a huge firm that only has big trucks, and new trucks are scarce, one way to expand the business if you haven't already done so is to network further. If your primary function is international shipping, and have a limited set of customers, consider setting up depots and getting some smaller trucks so you can take smaller packages to their final destination. To illustrate the point, with smaller items, hundreds of dollars worth of income can sit on the passenger seat in the cab of a big truck.

In other words, small can pay big.

The way you hve described the market, any advancement is impossible without some diversification. And if you find a way to make more money per load and it cuts into the supply of the big load service, rates rise by themselves. (almost)

The only other way to make more is by collusion with your competitors. That is probably illegal there.

Think big. Think small things. There are more of them.

You may be doing this already, but if not it should be a good path.

Best I can do this early in the morning.

T

(in reply to pahunkboy)

Post #: 8

RE: marketing genius required; apply within - 10/12/2007 7:48:37 AM

LadyEllen

Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: petdave

So if i understand, you're actually a shipping broker rather than a shipping company, or do you do both?
Maybe some kind of market specialization? Liquid tankers, hazardous materials, high-value, overweight, oversize, or fragile items? Air/rail/sea in addition to over-the-road? Generally speaking, even if 99% of people out there are so overwhelmed by service providers that they're sick of even hearing about it, there's always 1% that are doing something different that makes it a pain in the ass to get things done right, and if you can serve them well (provided it's a big enough niche) you can remove yourself from the melee.
Do you also do customs brokerage, or is that no longer an issue with the E.U.?
It kind of sounds as though you're performining a middleman service in an overcrowded market where the middleman isn't really providing a lot of value to the transaction... But if that impression is incorrect and you are providing value, the back-to-basics approach is to figure out what the key value you're providing is and emphasize that in your marketing AND your operations... Is it convenience? Speed? Professional knowledge? Security? Contacts/know-how in Eastern Europe?
If there's nothing, then you might consider closing up shop and going on the dole. i hear UK benefits are pretty sweet

Hiya

Yes - you got it exactly right I think.

We are really just middle men, relying on whom we know rather than what we know, relying on the ignorance of our hauliers and customers in not knowing one another, bringing the two together (at arms' length so they cant cut us out in the future) and making a margin between what we can charge and what we can pay. We would have our own equipment, but that would be way more expensive to run even than the higher prices we're now paying for supply - and thats if we could get the drivers.

The only thing we add to the transaction, is the ability to source low cost haulage and pass some of this saving on to the customer. But, the haulage is no longer low cost and the customers wont pay any more than before - which indicates to me that 3 years on from the Poles, Czechs et al entering the market, theyre now contacting and working directly for our target customers. The customer is happy - it costs him no more, the haulier is happy - he has our 10% to cover his increased costs. The main value of what we formerly brought to the transaction (whom we know) has evaporated overnight.

In the meantime, the only requirement for customs clearance nowadays is for duty goods (a nightmare for insurance on that one) and if the goods are entering/leaving the EU - and that too is a crowded market where agents are doing it and it requires specialist IT links, guarantees and all sorts. We could diversify, but it seems the same things are happening in all sectors - and there is the issue too of getting into those sectors which are also overcrowded.

The other advantages of dealing with us I guess for UK customers is that we're also in the UK and speak English - but thats less and less of a benefit now, when the same customers are employing overseas people in the UK who speak English and the language of the hauliers. Everything else - with regard to performance quality and so on, is taken as a granted nowadays, and in any case, regardless of what anyone says, they can only be as quick and reliable as driving hours allow, traffic jams permit, and the unloading of the vehicle prior to the next loading is carried out.

The only ways forward I can see, is to either provide some added value to the customers for which they will pay and we can provide without added investment, which will lock them in to us - this has been tried by others in the last round of rationalisations in the industry; but what we could provide that they need and would pay for I dont know.

Or to provide some added value to the hauliers which would yield us an extra percentage and lock them in to us. I'm thinking here of moving from being a middle man to being something akin to a UK representative for them - making sales and marketing, chasing up their debtors, resolving local issues etc -the question then is, is this something they might benefit from (I think so, but it needs testing)? And what would they be willing to pay for it?

E

_____________________________

In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

(in reply to petdave)

Post #: 9

RE: marketing genius required; apply within - 10/12/2007 7:48:54 AM

joanus

Posts: 527
Joined: 2/28/2007
Status: offline

Any half retarded monkey can do Marketing, its investing part you need a genius for.

(in reply to Termyn8or)

Post #: 10

RE: marketing genius required; apply within - 10/12/2007 7:56:15 AM

subtee

Posts: 5133
Joined: 7/26/2007
Status: offline

I would humbly suggest public relations as an addition to your marketing mix. You clearly have a story--probably many of them--to tell. And you tell it well. It seems to me what might be helpful would be to make some endeavors toward positioning yourself (your company, its principals), as "experts" in your field. Media releases explaining um...all that stuff that you explained (sorry, pretty dim about it all), would not only help to educate the public as to the changes that are occuring and how it affects them, but would also serve to bring your company to "top of mind" in choice as to whom to hire.

Some methods by which to effectively reach your customers and potential customers is to blog, podcast and send email blasts that are informative in nature. Again, you position yourself as experts--posting or blogging pertinent information that customers can understand and use. Also, these types of correspondances are not viewed, nor therefore, rejected as "marketing."

(in reply to Termyn8or)

Post #: 11

RE: marketing genius required; apply within - 10/12/2007 7:58:16 AM

LadyEllen

Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline

Hi T

You make some good points; what really stuffs the market every which way with big trucks is the driving hours and speed limits - required for safety certainly, but they determine what a vehicle can do in a week, which feeds back into cost per km and so on. We have been doing some smaller vehicles work (express courier) - no driving hours laws, London to Milano in 16 hours and all that, and making good margins on it - but again, its an overcrowded market where one can get high income and margins only if one is in the right place at the right time.

In the end, it is networking and knowing who rather than knowing what, which supports our business - and over the last few months I must have contacted thousands of new hauliers in the quest to get what we need. The problem is, the same response comes back every time when we want prices - and no response comes back at all when we offer what we would like to pay.

And yes, collusion is illegal - but also impossible; there are far too many competitors to ever hope that everyone would stand firm - there is always some bright spark who decides to undercut and take the business, even at a loss - because everything is worked out on roundtrip basis, so for instance one can quote at a loss in one direction as long as one makes it up on the return load.

E

_____________________________

In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

(in reply to Termyn8or)

Post #: 12

RE: marketing genius required; apply within - 10/12/2007 8:09:36 AM

LadyEllen

Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: subtee

I would humbly suggest public relations as an addition to your marketing mix. You clearly have a story--probably many of them--to tell. And you tell it well. It seems to me what might be helpful would be to make some endeavors toward positioning yourself (your company, its principals), as "experts" in your field. Media releases explaining um...all that stuff that you explained (sorry, pretty dim about it all), would not only help to educate the public as to the changes that are occuring and how it affects them, but would also serve to bring your company to "top of mind" in choice as to whom to hire.

Some methods by which to effectively reach your customers and potential customers is to blog, podcast and send email blasts that are informative in nature. Again, you position yourself as experts--posting or blogging pertinent information that customers can understand and use. Also, these types of correspondances are not viewed, nor therefore, rejected as "marketing."

Hi Subtee

Thanks - what you say is interesting; I like the idea of positioning ourselves as experts (and we are, despite our current activity - we're all qualified and experienced in international transport at the dirty end!) - I think this fits in well with the notion of a representative agency for hauliers, but it also works well in its own right - for example as purchasing agents for customers.

So, we'd move to being neutral agents - still middle men, but not involved directly in transactions.

E

_____________________________

In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

(in reply to subtee)

Post #: 13

RE: marketing genius required; apply within - 10/12/2007 8:49:55 AM

SilverWulf

Posts: 196
Joined: 4/7/2005
Status: offline

I don't fully understand how the trucking industry works across the pond, but I'm very familiar with it here in the States.

It sounds to me like you are a freight broker who wants to add on and become a carrier also?

That the market is over saturated with carriers, and brokers, driving the prices down to a level that isn't profitible.

So you are looking for a way to differentiate yourself, so you can justify the prices needed to make some money in the deal.

To put it bluntly, not gonna happen.

If two trucks (or companies) can haul freight from point A to point B and both get it there on time safely with the freight intact, the customer is always going to pay the lowest cost between the two.

Over here it costs a truck right around 80 cents per mile just to roll down the road. There are a lot of companies that are hauling freight that pays 85 cents a mile or less. Due to poor business practices they think they are making money when in fact they are just slowly going broke. Some areas of the country have even worse freight rates than that, others are much better. The more specialized the freight, such as flatbed, heavy haul, or oversize, the higher the rates go. There are many carriers who won't move a truck for under 1.50 a mile, some more than that. Now we have the trucks from Mexico on the roads of the US... any impact on freight rates hasn't been seen yet but will be soon, and it will result in lower rates.

Marketing and PR have very little impact. A truck is a truck. All trucks have to follow the same rules and can all get a load to the destination in the same amount of time. Putting fingernail polish on the pig won't do a bit of good.

(in reply to LadyEllen)

Post #: 14

RE: marketing genius required; apply within - 10/12/2007 9:13:26 AM

LadyEllen

Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline

Hi SWulf - yes, youre right; thats exactly the situation we have here too. The question is, what colour nail polish do we need?

As for the Mexicans entering your market - look forward to any freight moving back south to be going for nothing. There will be a limit to their range for this sort of thing - the northern states will likely escape the influence, but anywhere south of the midline across the states and west of Louisiana will be a no go area for loads back towards Texas/Arizona etc for anyone wanting to make money.

The free market people will say this is a good thing and tough luck to US hauliers for not being efficient - when in fact its because the competition are up to all sorts to get their costs to half the cost if the job were done properly. Hey, I can make money if the truck runs 24 hours on bald tyres at 100mph, you know?

E

_____________________________

In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

(in reply to SilverWulf)

Post #: 15

RE: marketing genius required; apply within - 10/12/2007 9:19:11 AM

pahunkboy

Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline

you hit a nerve. Mexican truckers. arghhh!

our roads are so clogged NOW_ to throw this into the mix.

say hello to $5 an hour pay!!

(in reply to LadyEllen)

Post #: 16

RE: marketing genius required; apply within - 10/12/2007 9:19:42 AM

kdsub

Posts: 12180
Joined: 8/16/2007
Status: offline

Hi there

If you are running an efficient operation then your competitors have the same problems as you. So it may not take a whole lot to stand out. Maybe just one service provided better may do the trick…or

Perhaps think about merging with a large competitor.

Rather than advertise only to customers try advertising to the general public thru TV or newspapers. This will get you name recognition for new business in the future. The more I hear a name of a business the more likely I am to use them if I have a future need. Your name will also become associated with professionalism.

Speaking of professionalism...clean vehicles with fresh paint…uniformed professional operators don’t cost a whole lot but looks do count.

This really works…turn to your employees for suggestions… set up a rewards program that they can profit from the suggestions that save you money. Promote pride in their jobs and a “we are working together for the future” atmosphere. Try giving them good competitive benefits then demanding results. The best edge you can get in business are GOOD HAPPY employees.
Butch

< Message edited by kdsub -- 10/12/2007 9:21:24 AM >

(in reply to SilverWulf)

Post #: 17

RE: marketing genius required; apply within - 10/12/2007 9:28:25 AM

pahunkboy

Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline

ild have to agree with the poster that said cheap - is what sells.

it sounds like the field is saturated- and a new direction would be best.

especially with a slim 2%.

(in reply to kdsub)

Post #: 18

RE: marketing genius required; apply within - 10/12/2007 9:30:40 AM

subtee

Posts: 5133
Joined: 7/26/2007
Status: offline

quote:

Marketing and PR have very little impact. A truck is a truck. All trucks have to follow the same rules and can all get a load to the destination in the same amount of time. Putting fingernail polish on the pig won't do a bit of good.

I disagree. For example, we all use tissues, but we call them "kleenex." There are hundreds of mp3 players, but the iPod is the standard by which others are compared--and not because iPods are the best mp3 players that exist. We now "google" when we use a search engine, this having come about when Google does not even advertise.

Public perception is a make-or-break facet of every business. It most certainly can be influenced in myriads of ways. A successful company must be adept at telling their own story, telling it often and in many venues.

I'm not sure if pigs generally pay attention to public perception.

(in reply to SilverWulf)

Post #: 19

RE: marketing genius required; apply within - 10/12/2007 10:10:56 AM

SilverWulf

Posts: 196
Joined: 4/7/2005
Status: offline

Marketing a product, such as kleenex or an ipod to gain market share, is a different animal than marketing a service such as trucking.

I do agree that a good marketing program can result in higher public awareness of a particular company, be it a service or a product.

The problem lies in the fact that any company that needs their product moved by truck will do it for the cheapest price possible. Let's say I have 1000 widgets to move. Company A markets agressively and is well known. Company B just started up or has been around for awhile but few people know who they are. I get quotes. Company A will move my widgets for a dollar each, while Company B will do it for 50 cents. Company A has to pay for their marketing program somehow, while Company B has a lower overhead. The lower price gets the job, every time.

(in reply to subtee)

Post #: 20

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