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Slave it vs. Slave Being - 10/8/2007 7:06:13 AM   
Owner4SexSlave


Posts: 1311
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline 		When it comes down to a slave being an "it" or a "human being", I have always found greater value in ownership of a "human being" compared to a mere it.   Then again, this is my own personal tastes and perspective from M/s relationships.

I'm not certain is this is a somewhat Romanistic perspective or not.   For me having a slave means finding as much use, enjoyment and value as I humanly can.  Not just for Sex or kinky BDSM activities, and not just for Fetching cups of coffee.   I enjoy slaves with creative talents as well.   Being it drawing, painting, musical or otherwise.    I also find value in the mind of a Slave as well.  To be able to get the feedback and thoughts of a slave.   To use a slave as a soundboard for my own thoughts and ideas even.   Basically tap into what I own (mind, body and soul).   It appears that there are those that simply value the Body and want to gut out the rest of their slave.   Dehumanize all aspects of the mind and soul as best they can.

Perhaps, this appears to be some what of a double standard, because when it comes to scene play, I can have and will dehumanized and degrade one.  In fact, in many regards I'm drawn towards engaging in more edgy play.  I can become or be very sadistic with one who gives themself to me in that way.   However, I'm in control of my sadistic streak instead of it having control over me.   Heavy SadoMaso play has always been optional for me, not a must.   Because there are so many other things I look for in a prospective slave.    I have things I look for and not look for in a Domme for prospective Dom couple relationship.   I'm open to a couple of different types of relationships and know what I want.

In terms of M/s relationships, I enjoy finding out what a slaves natural abilities are and trying best to cultivate those.  It's a nurturing aspect that perhaps the "Daddy Dom" label can be applied to.   Basically, I look at things as such.  A slave is like holding clay in my hands,  I get to shape and mold it into something of my desire, wants, wishes and whims.   Some people make some really simple and ugly looking things.  Personally, why not take it all the way?  Fully tap into the power of what another human being has to offer and can be molded.

It appears there are those that just want to take advantage of the Body and have a slave become an IT, instead of taking full advantage of owning another Human being.

I realize there are those who have an opposing view to this school of thought.   But what are the Benifits of Owning an "IT" over a "Being"?  For you sub/slaves out there who would rather be Owned as an "IT" compared to a "Being"?  For you Master/Doms out there why do you enjoy owning an "IT" over a "Being"?   Who here agrees with the same lines of thinking as I do?
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RE: Slave it vs. Slave Being - 10/8/2007 7:30:15 AM   
CelticPrince


Posts: 3613
Joined: 4/15/2005
Status: offline 		Owner,

Many fems just prefer the "it" as it keeps things simple but for me the "being" is what it is all about. But then again, I do not do slaves!

CP

(in reply to Owner4SexSlave)
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RE: Slave it vs. Slave Being - 10/8/2007 8:05:23 AM   
toservez


Posts: 1733
Joined: 9/7/2006
From: All over now in Minnesota
Status: offline 		Depends on the relationship. I see the “it” version you describe in more casual and not 24/7, not that there is not people that live like that, I just personally think the number is extremely minute.

In healthy relationships and where two people are getting all of their needs from the other person then what you describe is basically M/s in a reality based situation.

The “it” situation is more for the people who romanticize their M/s relationship on a fictional level then actually live that way and for all the cyber people with manifestos and definitions from various dictionaries of what a slave is.

The reality is a healthy human being is not going to dedicate their life to someone who truly treats them like an “it” because to actually be treated like an “it” means that person is not dedicated to you in the slightest.


_____________________________

I am sorry I do not fit Webster's defintion of a slave but thankfully my Master is not Webster.

"Anything that contradicts experience and logic should be abandoned." - H.H. The 14th Dalai Lama

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RE: Slave it vs. Slave Being - 10/8/2007 8:13:04 AM   
thetammyjo


Posts: 6322
Joined: 9/8/2005
Status: offline 		I see the idea of a human slave as an "it" as a purposeful ignoring of reality. Even in the ancient Mediterranean world when chattel slavery was pretty intense, the legal underpinnings of slavery tell of a dual model -- slave as tool or object or it and slave as human being.

The simply fact is that you cannot control a human slave as you would a pencil so equating a human slave with only "it" status is denying the reality of what is happening and can happen.

I think the closest you can get to the "it" status is to equate the human slave with an animal though this then open debates about what separates humans from other animals.

Personally I like my Ds and Ms grounded in reality so I don't think of my slave or trainees at "it" regardless of the duration of the scene or dynamic. I find dealing with things on the level of reality increases my chances of success and enjoyment.

_____________________________

Love, Peace, Hugs, Kisses, Whips & Chains,

TammyJo

Check out my website at http://www.thetammyjo.com Or www.tammyjoeckhart.com

And my LJ where I post fiction in progress if you "friend" me at http://thetammyjo.livejournal.com/

(in reply to Owner4SexSlave)
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RE: Slave it vs. Slave Being - 10/8/2007 8:24:03 AM   
IamJustMe2C


Posts: 94
Joined: 10/2/2007
Status: offline 		I see the "IT" only in the Hollywood porn and novel reading. Not to say we havent herd of it in RL but I dont know anybody that can be that truely cruel and heartless as to treat another human being like that 24/7/365.  For a few hours maybe if that is what they wanted and agreeded upon. But then again who am I. I actually care about the people I "play" with to much to do that to them.

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RE: Slave it vs. Slave Being - 10/8/2007 8:53:16 AM   
RRafe


Posts: 2060
Joined: 8/29/2007
Status: offline 		"It" is hot for those into objectification. I see no reason they can't coexist.

_____________________________

I seem to be some wierd combination of Ren and Stimpy

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RE: Slave it vs. Slave Being - 10/8/2007 9:11:27 AM   
daddysprop247


Posts: 1712
Joined: 6/24/2005
From: DC Metro area
Status: offline 		actually i think that a few assumptions are being made here about the "it" model of slavery. i've known people who live such a way of life 24/7, and i can't say that in any of them the slave was viewed as just a body or that the slave was not being used to what the Master viewed as their full capabilities. for example, a Master of an "it"-type slave may provide for the slave's higher education so they can obtain a degree in an area in which they excel or are naturally inclined...then use that slave's newfound skill and degree for the Master's profit and benefit. this not unlike a situation which could occur in a "human being"-type slavery, the only difference being that in the "it"-type slavery there is no concern for the slave's well-being beyond what may effect the Master.

believe it or not, there are some people out there who are quite fulfilled being an "it" as opposed to a beloved or cherished piece of property, and who would be quite uncomfortable and unhappy in a different sort of dynamic. i think that one should strive for whatever dynamic or way of life which fulfills them, regardless of how uncommon or unpopular it may be.

(in reply to RRafe)
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RE: Slave it vs. Slave Being - 10/8/2007 9:39:37 AM   
Bobkgin


Posts: 1335
Joined: 7/28/2007
From: Kawarthas, Ontario, Canada
Status: offline 		OP:

The "its" I've spoken to over the years desired extreme forms of abuse, humiliation, degradation, objectification.
They had either claimed they'd never been human, or that they wished to shed all the expectations/obligations of being human in favour of a relatively simple life.

Bear in mind I've neither owned one nor met one, so the above is based strictly on what I've been told the times I've spoken to someone claiming to be, or wishing to be, an "it".



Prop:

I am curious as to whether you/Daddy see you as a human or an "it".


_____________________________

When all is said and done, what will you regret?

That you never really lived?

Or there was so much living left to do?

For those interested: pics and poetry have been added to my profile.

(in reply to daddysprop247)
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RE: Slave it vs. Slave Being - 10/8/2007 9:43:22 AM   
daddysprop247


Posts: 1712
Joined: 6/24/2005
From: DC Metro area
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Bobkgin

Prop:

I am curious as to whether you/Daddy see you as a human or an "it".



Bob, i thought the answer to that one would be pretty obvious. the "it" model is not for us. i'm not just his property but also his daughter, his love, his friend.

(in reply to Bobkgin)
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RE: Slave it vs. Slave Being - 10/8/2007 9:47:41 AM   
Bobkgin


Posts: 1335
Joined: 7/28/2007
From: Kawarthas, Ontario, Canada
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: daddysprop247

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bobkgin

Prop:

I am curious as to whether you/Daddy see you as a human or an "it".



Bob, i thought the answer to that one would be pretty obvious. the "it" model is not for us. i'm not just his property but also his daughter, his love, his friend.


Prop, I'm still new enough to this board not to know such things.

No offense was intended. I hope none was taken.


_____________________________

When all is said and done, what will you regret?

That you never really lived?

Or there was so much living left to do?

For those interested: pics and poetry have been added to my profile.

(in reply to daddysprop247)
Profile   Post #: 10
RE: Slave it vs. Slave Being - 10/8/2007 10:41:08 AM   
leatherette


Posts: 255
Status: offline 		  i feel very silly.. but Cousin It was treated with great respect!  He was welcome down the chimney  +  up too he went! ( isn't that how he travelled?) What pleasure he brought the household!

Anyway: i find "it" to be an affectionate nick of objectectification ( blah..spelling?) in a trusting partnership.

(in reply to Bobkgin)
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RE: Slave it vs. Slave Being - 10/8/2007 11:09:40 AM   
Bobkgin


Posts: 1335
Joined: 7/28/2007
From: Kawarthas, Ontario, Canada
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: leatherette

  i feel very silly.. but Cousin It was treated with great respect!  He was welcome down the chimney  +  up too he went! ( isn't that how he travelled?) What pleasure he brought the household!


Wasn't that Samantha's aunt in "Bewitched"?

I thought Cousin It walked in the front door (I can recall Lurch holding the door for him).

And then there was Thing.

The pervertable potential for Thing is incalculable

(forgive me for I have strayed off-topic)

_____________________________

When all is said and done, what will you regret?

That you never really lived?

Or there was so much living left to do?

For those interested: pics and poetry have been added to my profile.

(in reply to leatherette)
Profile   Post #: 12
RE: Slave it vs. Slave Being - 10/8/2007 12:08:13 PM   
BitaTruble


Posts: 9779
Joined: 1/12/2006
From: Texas
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner4SexSlave

I realize there are those who have an opposing view to this school of thought.   But what are the Benifits of Owning an "IT" over a "Being"?  For you sub/slaves out there who would rather be Owned as an "IT" compared to a "Being"?  For you Master/Doms out there why do you enjoy owning an "IT" over a "Being"?   Who here agrees with the same lines of thinking as I do?


I don't see them as mutually exclusive. There are many facets to my own nature which are fed in different ways and a steady diet to feed only a single part of me will not nourish me any more than a steady diet of chicken will give me all the vitamins I need to sustain my body in a healthy manner. Being owned as an 'it' is not enough and being owned as a 'being' is not enough. I need to be owned as Celeste, all the parts of me fed by the proper diet so that it doesn't die of starvation. Sometimes I'm fed by objectification, sometimes by love, sometimes by pain, sometimes by service and a myriad of other diets for each of my unique characteristics.

The benefit (to me) of having my 'it' fed is that it often manifests in feeding another part of me as well. If I'm a foot stool, that feeds my 'it' but it also feeds the part of me that would whither without being able to serve, so it's a two-fold benefit. It benefits the part of Master who wants the comfort of a fleshy footstool and to indulge exercising his power to command his slave to be a foot stool.

In other words .. it's this and that.. not this or that.



Celeste

_____________________________

"Oh, so it's just like
Rock, paper, scissors."

He laughed. "You are the wisest woman I know."


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RE: Slave it vs. Slave Being - 10/8/2007 12:14:06 PM   
Stephann


Posts: 4214
Joined: 12/27/2006
From: Portland, OR
Status: offline 		Briefly,

Sometimes I enjoy objectification.  It's usually in a limited context, with a clearly defined 'beginning' and 'ending.'

Beyond this, I want a relationship with a person (female persons, to be exact; I've never had any driving urge to own a man up to this point.)  I also enjoy 'owning' cats (though any cat 'owner' knows the truth there.)  I suppose it shows my desire for creatures in my life with lots of personality.

Stephan


_____________________________

Nosce Te Ipsum

"The blade itself incites to violence" - Homer

Men: Find a Woman here

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RE: Slave it vs. Slave Being - 10/8/2007 2:12:53 PM   
Owner4SexSlave


Posts: 1311
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline 		Since some people have posted some great thoughts already, I want to further explain what an "IT" is in the context I am using this word.

IT is not permitted to work outside the home,  IT is not enouraged to go to school, IT is a house slave at best.  IT is not allowed to have a social life, Chances are IT would probally not even be Permitted Free unsupervised use of the Internet.  IT leads a highly micromanaged Life in fact.   IT is conditioned to be completely and fully dependent upon IT's owner.   As I mentioned before, IT's mind and soul have become surpressed and considered of no great Value to the owner.

I'm not talking about a Slave that simply becomes IT for scene play, but for day to day life in general.   Basically, I'm not talking about those that play the ROLE of IT from time to time, but Rather those that live the role of it.

Somebody mentioned that they see "IT" only in Hollywood porn or Novel Reading, however there are those that do become "IT" and those seeking an "IT".    Yes, this is an extreme of objectfication taken to 24/7.   I'm certain even IT's have a bit of break and have some form of humanity to themselves.   They are not completely broken down from being a human, after all.

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RE: Slave it vs. Slave Being - 10/8/2007 2:33:39 PM   
toservez


Posts: 1733
Joined: 9/7/2006
From: All over now in Minnesota
Status: offline
quote:

  As I mentioned before, IT's mind and soul have become surpressed and considered of no great Value to the owner.

I'm not talking about a Slave that simply becomes IT for scene play, but for day to day life in general.   Basically, I'm not talking about those that play the ROLE of IT from time to time, but Rather those that live the role of it.



I will stand by my answer. Your “it” in both posts are for either the mentally unhealthy or the work of over romancing in a sad way a person’s fictionalized view of how they live that is not true to the actual reality or theoretical cyber doctrine babble.

Both posts you mention no great value to the dominant. A healthy person and most unhealthy people are not going to get anywhere remotely to the level you describe if the dominant does not show, whether true or not, in some form and combination respect, dedication and concern for the other person. Our soul is who we are and cannot be separated for a theoretical discussion.

Objectification can be done in scenes, yummy and even done in a prolonged certain area of life but just not all the time, still yummy, but at no time does objectification mean not being respected, cared for or even loved. It simply is not an either/or situation in reality! If you are truly talking about 24/7 objectification as your contraints just do not add up.

I am just not sure what you are looking for as I do not think you are going to find anyone here going to write that they treat or are slaves on a severe 24/7 level that the dominant has no regard or feelings for them that they could simply walk away. It is cyber fantasy dribble or the admittance to a truly mentally sick person.




_____________________________

I am sorry I do not fit Webster's defintion of a slave but thankfully my Master is not Webster.

"Anything that contradicts experience and logic should be abandoned." - H.H. The 14th Dalai Lama

(in reply to Owner4SexSlave)
Profile   Post #: 16
RE: Slave it vs. Slave Being - 10/8/2007 2:42:25 PM   
Bobkgin


Posts: 1335
Joined: 7/28/2007
From: Kawarthas, Ontario, Canada
Status: offline 		From the OP:

quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner4SexSlave

But what are the Benifits of Owning an "IT" over a "Being"?  For you sub/slaves out there who would rather be Owned as an "IT" compared to a "Being"? 



Now:

quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner4SexSlave

IT is not permitted to work outside the home,  IT is not enouraged to go to school, IT is a house slave at best.  IT is not allowed to have a social life, Chances are IT would probally not even be Permitted Free unsupervised use of the Internet.  IT leads a highly micromanaged Life in fact.   IT is conditioned to be completely and fully dependent upon IT's owner.   As I mentioned before, IT's mind and soul have become surpressed and considered of no great Value to the owner.

...

I'm certain even IT's have a bit of break and have some form of humanity to themselves.   They are not completely broken down from being a human, after all.


I'm a little fuzzy about the purpose for the thread, O.

You're asking "its" about the benefits they receive, but you don't expect them to have unsupervised internet access?

Would the "it" you've most recently described even want to access the internet?

_____________________________

When all is said and done, what will you regret?

That you never really lived?

Or there was so much living left to do?

For those interested: pics and poetry have been added to my profile.

(in reply to Owner4SexSlave)
Profile   Post #: 17
RE: Slave it vs. Slave Being - 10/8/2007 2:52:38 PM   
breatheasone


Posts: 4004
Joined: 7/14/2007
Status: offline 		To the OP...I personally have about as much respect for a person that would call another "it", as they do for calling someone "it"....which is not much...if any.

_____________________________

Romans 10:13,For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
Mike posts in black font
candy posts in pink font

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RE: Slave it vs. Slave Being - 10/8/2007 3:07:00 PM   
Owner4SexSlave


Posts: 1311
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: breatheasone

To the OP...I personally have about as much respect for a person that would call another "it", as they do for calling someone "it"....which is not much...if any.


This is what my own of thinking had been regarding this as wel.  However, I thought I would start a thread regarding this topic.  See perhaps those among us that have lived in such an extreme relationship or desire it.

I suspect if I had an account on the other side, I might have responses in private email regarding this thread.  There have been times when people have wrote me in private due to posting so as to avoid being condemned by others.

I have encountered a couple of slaves that wanted to live and breath and exist in life as "IT", and a few that have been "IT" or almost an "IT".   This topic intriques me to degree, mainly because it conflicts with my own personal tastes, interests and views.

I'm guilty of having thought or felt this was more the invention of Hollywood porn or novel reading myself.  However, I've had to come to grips that this is valid flavor of the BDSM lifestyle, as extreme as it might appear to me or others.

(in reply to breatheasone)
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RE: Slave it vs. Slave Being - 10/10/2007 7:00:21 PM   
AEslaveM


Posts: 126
Joined: 9/4/2007
Status: offline 		i am certainly a "being" in Master's eyes..................If i was an "it", i personally would not exist...............and certainly would not be able to enjoy being a slave..............Master looks at me as a slave, certainly, but i am SO much more than that to him than just an "it".

Just my .02................

M

_____________________________

M


(in reply to Owner4SexSlave)
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