Group Input Needed

Group Input Needed (Full Version)

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PoligamistMaster -> Group Input Needed (9/24/2007 9:30:16 PM)
Having only been in the leather community for a year or so, I am needing some input on the following situation. Any thoughts from those who have more experience would be greatly appreciated. Here is the issue: Is a formal "written" contract or other evidence of a power exchange relationship (such as collaring) required to establish a legitimate power exchange relationship between two people? If no such formal written contract or other evidence is known to others in the BDSM community to exist, then should others in the lifestyle honor and respect a relationship between the two people that has not been formalized?

LuckyAlbatross -> RE: Group Input Needed (9/24/2007 9:41:11 PM)
You don't need a contract for anything. Not having a contract does not equal not being formalized. It's appropriate for people to respect boundaries and commitments- but you shouldn't expect it, there's tons of assholes out there. Ignore them. The only reason they would have meaning is if your relationship weren't actually secure.

SimplyMichael -> RE: Group Input Needed (9/24/2007 9:46:23 PM)
If she is cute, people will hit on her. If she isn't that into you, she will stray. Relationships are only what two people make of them.

crouchingtigress -> RE: Group Input Needed (9/24/2007 9:51:45 PM)
no but honestly it is helpful to have the basic structure on paper, because when the going gets rough, it can be a big help to be able to sit down and talk about not only the commiments but also the reasons you made the coomittments to this journey in the fist place. i dont think i would use the term evidence, there is no one or group that assertains the level you and your partner play at, but as a tool...it is very helpful esp if you are going to take the collaring seriously because there is a process in becoming a slave, and releasing free will, that will involve growing pains (bites screams and punches in some cases) and having a understanding of what eaxcly each person agrees to, greases the wheels.

RRafe -> RE: Group Input Needed (9/24/2007 9:58:02 PM)
You can't nail custard to the wall.

laurell3 -> RE: Group Input Needed (9/24/2007 10:39:48 PM)
A contract is a symbol, there are quite a few in d/s, it's not going to keep others from hitting on her, it's not going to keep her from straying. It might demonstrate your clear desire to commit to that type of relationship, it might be too rigid, it's up to the two of you. I have seen some over the years, mostly formalizing what your expectations and limits are, some with an actual stated time and requirement of a type of debriefing to discuss what is good and not so good prior to renewing. Hope this was helpful. l

spanklette -> RE: Group Input Needed (9/24/2007 10:46:03 PM)
Personally, I find contracts too static for my tastes. I prefer simple rules and to respect them. That's just my view, of course, which should answer your question...no, contracts are not a required component of D/s relationships.

CuriousLord -> RE: Group Input Needed (9/25/2007 12:07:04 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: PoligamistMaster Is a formal "written" contract or other evidence of a power exchange relationship (such as collaring) required to establish a legitimate power exchange relationship between two people? Nope. quote: ORIGINAL: PoligamistMaster If no such formal written contract or other evidence is known to others in the BDSM community to exist, then should others in the lifestyle honor and respect a relationship between the two people that has not been formalized? By the standards of this community, respect is to be given without regard for the existence, or lack thereof, of a contract. I am under the impression that most couples do not use a contract. Many seem to disdain the implications that a contract would seem to carry.

Prinsexx -> RE: Group Input Needed (9/25/2007 1:05:00 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: PoligamistMaster Is a formal "written" contract or other evidence of a power exchange relationship (such as collaring) required to establish a legitimate power exchange relationship between two people? If any piece of paper was worth anything more than a carbon footprint issue then formal marriages would work.............

iammachine -> RE: Group Input Needed (9/25/2007 1:49:32 AM)
In short, no. You might find a contract to be useful, you may not. Whatever the case, should you choose to use one or not, that is entirely personal to you and really is not the concern of anyone that is not directly involved in the relationship.

Celeste43 -> RE: Group Input Needed (9/25/2007 2:32:04 AM)
Even if you have a contract, how do you suppose this will be magically apparent to anyone else? Unless you are going to pin a sign to her saying "Formally contracted slave, do not contact". And I bet people would then come up to read the sign and ask her about it. If you walk into a party with your arm around her, people will see that you are a couple and she'll still get hit upon. Unless you stay with her during the evening, she'll appear to be on her own and available.

feastie -> RE: Group Input Needed (9/25/2007 3:57:09 AM)
Nope and nope. Why do you ask?

TreasureKY -> RE: Group Input Needed (9/25/2007 4:12:47 AM)
Personally, I wouldn't want to associate with any group who wouldn't respect a couple's relationship just because there wasn't some signed piece of paper between them.

RCdc -> RE: Group Input Needed (9/25/2007 4:31:10 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: TreasureKY Personally, I wouldn't want to associate with any group who wouldn't respect a couple's relationship just because there wasn't some signed piece of paper between them. QFT To the OP - quote: Is a formal "written" contract or other evidence of a power exchange relationship (such as collaring) required to establish a legitimate power exchange relationship between two people? No. quote: If no such formal written contract or other evidence is known to others in the BDSM community to exist, then should others in the lifestyle honor and respect a relationship between the two people that has not been formalized? Formalized how? Fluid bonding could mean formalized to some people. Is all subjective. There are people who don't have any respect for any relationship so a 'formalized contract' wouldn't deter them. Just ignore their stupidity and accept assholes exist everywhere, even in BDSM 'circles'. Peace the.dark.

slimcontroller -> RE: Group Input Needed (9/25/2007 5:31:25 AM)
Contract A contract is no use if you cannot enforce it. If you can enforce why have the contract ? Catch22a Slimc

amelliagrace -> RE: Group Input Needed (9/25/2007 5:58:47 AM)
A contract is never necessary unless the individuals in the relationship want one. It shouldn't be necessary, either, in order for others to respect the relationship. However, as LA pointed out, assholes abound, and there is nothing you can do about that. The only thing I'd recommend is that it be obvious that you are a serious pair, and not casual play buddies or just friends who sometimes scene together. (Just because that isn't your type of relationship doesn't mean there aren't relationships like that around.) That is the only way to ensure that the non-assholes know there is a relationship there who's boundaries are to be respected. You might think that your relationship to each other would be obvious to others, but sometimes in a first meeting social or play party situation it might not be (hey, some people are just a little slower on the uptake than others, and nothing is gonna change that). Making sure it a known fact seperates those who might accidentally cross a line with no ill intent from the assholes. Once upon a time, early in my relationship with Master, prior to a visit where we were going to push some limits, I got concerned about what might happen if we had an accident during play. I wasn't worried about me, but about him should I ever require medical care for a scene related injury. The last thing this subbie would want is for Master to get hauled off to jail for something I'd asked politely, and waited patiently, for...or for one of those "OOOOPS" things that can happen. The solution, for me, was to type a statement of the "to whom it may concern" variety, explaining the relationship, the verbal agreement regarding specific activities, and what types of injuries would be the most likely to occur if things when awry. I emailed him a copy, and had another notarized, which I took with me. We never usd it. He didn't demand it to cover his own behind. It was more a token of my trust in him, and desire to serve and preserve. Contracts serve various purposes, but IMO, they are of more use for reasons of couple dynamic than for much else. A contract between two kinksters is no protection from jerks and asses, and probably about as effective if you happen to run afowl of a judge, police officer, or physician who's an ^##$&^^$ . *-grace*

Phoenix2raven -> RE: Group Input Needed (9/25/2007 6:04:11 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: PoligamistMaster Is a formal "written" contract or other evidence of a power exchange relationship (such as collaring) required to establish a legitimate power exchange relationship between two people? If no such formal written contract or other evidence is known to others in the BDSM community to exist, then should others in the lifestyle honor and respect a relationship between the two people that has not been formalized? There are no requirements who ever is telling you its a requirement to have a verbal or written contract is mistaken. If lifestylers cant recognize a power exchange is solid with or with out a contract they need to back off. It doesn't take a uber Dom to see that there is a power exchange between two people. If they don't respect or honor one with out a contract or collar, etc. they are probably control freaks. That being said I was in a similar situation and we basically ignored them until they hit on my submissive at a social. They were egected quickly and most of the other lifestylers were glad. ~phoenix~

AquaticSub -> RE: Group Input Needed (9/25/2007 8:36:17 AM)
quote: Is a formal "written" contract or other evidence of a power exchange relationship (such as collaring) required to establish a legitimate power exchange relationship between two people? Nope. I highly doubt that Valyraen and I will ever a contract. We understand that it is helpful in nailing down what is expected from both sides, but we simply don't feel the need for one. That may change or not. quote: If no such formal written contract or other evidence is known to others in the BDSM community to exist, then should others in the lifestyle honor and respect a relationship between the two people that has not been formalized? I'm going to give your relationship as much respect as it warrents. Doesn't matter how many contracts you sign. Relationships where trust and the agreed on terms are being violated all the time isn't going to get much respect even though you have a nifty piece of paper. Now, if you feel that my relationship with Valyraen is not "formalized" or invalid simply because we don't feel the need to have that nifty piece of paper, I would suggest you attend some local groups and munchs. Not everyone uses contracts and, to be honest, this is the first time I have ever heard anyone so much as hint at the idea that the relationships without contracts shouldn't be respected on their merits.

AquaticSub -> RE: Group Input Needed (9/25/2007 8:38:47 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Celeste43 Even if you have a contract, how do you suppose this will be magically apparent to anyone else? Unless you are going to pin a sign to her saying "Formally contracted slave, do not contact". And I bet people would then come up to read the sign and ask her about it. .... That would be awfully tempting... He would have to attach a booklet to her so that everyone could read about the situation.

domiguy -> RE: Group Input Needed (9/25/2007 8:41:35 AM)
You have to put it in writing...Everyone respects a written contract...EVERYONE!!! If you sign your name to it...It makes it so.

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