Terrorists Everywhere!!! THEY ALL HATE AMERICA'S FREEDOM!!! (Full Version)

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Real0ne -> Terrorists Everywhere!!! THEY ALL HATE AMERICA'S FREEDOM!!! (8/18/2007 12:55:11 AM)




Russia, China, Iran warn US at summit


Saturday, August 18, 2007 - ©2005 IranMania.com

The leaders of Russia, China and Iran said that Central Asia should be left alone to manage its stability and security, an apparent warning to the United States to avoid interfering in the strategic, resource-rich region, The Associated Press (AP) reported.

LONDON, August 18 (IranMania) - The leaders of Russia, China and Iran said that Central Asia should be left alone to manage its stability and security, an apparent warning to the United States to avoid interfering in the strategic, resource-rich region, The Associated Press (AP) reported.

The veiled warning came at a meeting of the Shanghai Cooperation Organization and on the eve of major war games between Russia and China.

The SCO was created 11 years ago to address religious extremism and border security in Central Asia, but in recent years, with countries such as Iran signing on as observers, it has grown into a bloc aimed at defying US interests in the region.

"Stability and security in Central Asia are best ensured primarily through efforts taken by the nations of the region on the basis of the existing regional associations," the leaders said in a statement at the end of the organization's summit in the Kyrgyz capital, Bishkek.

Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, attending the summit for the second consecutive year, criticized US plans to put parts of a missile defense system in Eastern Europe as a threat to the entire region.

"These intentions go beyond just one country. They are of concern for much of the continent, Asia and SCO members," he said.

Washington has said the system would help protect against potential Iranian missiles.

Russian President Vladimir Putin didn't mention the United States in his speech, but he said that "any attempts to solve global and regional problems unilaterally are hopeless."

He also called for "strengthening a multi-polar international system that would ensure equal security and opportunities for all countries", comments echoing Russia's frequent complaints that the United States dominates world affairs.

Moscow has also bristled at Washington's plans to deploy the anti-missile system in Poland and the Czech Republic, saying the system would threaten Russian security.

Putin and Hu Jintao of China were set to attend Friday's military exercises in the Chelyabinsk region in Russia's Ural Mountains. Some 6,000 Russian and Chinese troops, dozens of aircraft and hundreds of armored vehicles and other heavy weapons will participate, the first such joint drills on Russia's territory.

China hosted the first-ever joint maneuvers in August 2005, which included a mock assault on the beaches of northern China and featured Russia's long-range bombers.

Moscow and Beijing have developed what they dubbed a "strategic partnership" after the Soviet collapse, cemented by their perceptions that the United States dominates global affairs.

In 2005, the SCO called for a timetable to be set for the withdrawal of US troops from two member countries, Uzbekistan and Kyrgyzstan. Uzbekistan evicted American forces later that year, but

http://www.iranmania.com/News/ArticleView/Default.asp?NewsCode=53603&NewsKind=Current%20Affairs



Tahnk goodness we have a thriving economy, taken out the evil doers and have homeland security to protect us.  DOnt we all feel cozy now?.








UtopianRanger -> RE: Terrorists Everywhere!!! THEY ALL HATE AMERICA'S FREEDOM!!! (8/18/2007 2:10:56 AM)

Yes---They want to attack us because they don't like our freedoms!


HAR! HAR! HAR! [:D]




- R




NorthernGent -> RE: Terrorists Everywhere!!! THEY ALL HATE AMERICA'S FREEDOM!!! (8/18/2007 3:31:17 AM)

Let's put some meat on the bones of the Russia situation:

Basically, the "cold war", or battle of ideas, continues: the West's utopian dream of individual sovereignty devoid of coercion versus the East's totalitarianism and dreams of a better world. The Americans tried to kill it off in 1991 with their "shock treatment" (the concept underpinning Iraq) applied to Russia. Basically, they helped install the centre-right and remove all state controls over the economy at a stroke, in the belief that this would create a natural order. The problem being that the cost of goods soared, millions had to sell their belongings to eat, and the new government auctioned off nationalised industries; from which the sharks cleaned up by buying industries for a fraction of what they were worth. So, economic genocide ensued: pissing off most of the people in the process. In order to maintain this American inspired/installed market "democracy", American-backed Yeltsin and associates suspended Parliament to maintain control and turned the army on dissenters. Next, Yeltsin announced he would rule by decree. When I say Americans, you can lump the West into this: the Americans are the most fanatical about this Market "Democracy", so they're the head of the beast, and quoted here. Yeltsin, inevitably, became the creature of those with real power in the new Russia i.e. the oligarchs: one of the defining features of market democracy, I suppose. In return for loans, Yeltsin gave away the rest of Russian industry to these oligarchs at a knock down price.

The problem for the Americans and wider Western governments, of course, is that their idea failed: they couldn't embed Market Democracy in Russia, nor, ultimately, kill off the cold war. In the wake of this economic genocide, people lacked food, electricity etc in Russia, and sought the order, security and dignity that Russian Natonalism, under Putin, could give them. The problem with Nationalism, of course, is that it lends towards wanting a place in the sun.

The lesson I see from the Russia siuation and the OP is this: piss off enough foreigners in developing countries, and they'll turn to Nationalism: which in turn will come back to haunt you/the West.




UtopianRanger -> RE: Terrorists Everywhere!!! THEY ALL HATE AMERICA'S FREEDOM!!! (8/18/2007 4:06:03 AM)

quote:

The lesson I see from the Russia siuation and the OP is this: piss off enough foreigners in developing countries, and they'll turn to Nationalism: which in turn will come back to haunt you/the West.



Well said Gent.  That is exactly what's happned. When they took away their measly state pensions and cheap vodka, the average Russkie had had enough. With Americans, they'll need to take away their reality TV programs and I-pods before we become unglued.

The antidote for uni-polar world is nationalism! [;)][:D]




- R




Focus50 -> RE: Terrorists Everywhere!!! THEY ALL HATE AMERICA'S FREEDOM!!! (8/18/2007 4:26:40 AM)

I think they particularly hate America's freedom to deploy missiles seemingly wherever you like - all in the name of peace, of course....  *wink*  Now, if the Russians were to do the same in, sayyyy, Cuba, that'd then be *provocative*, ay?  lol
 
Maybe these "terrorists everywhere" wouldn't hate America so much if America didn't spend so much time virtually occupying foreign countries and too often meddling in their affairs.  Arseholes that these mad muslims are, they see America as an army of occupation in their territory - some think they have a valid gripe.  Hows it go - out of sight, out of mind...? 
 
Focus.




Sinergy -> RE: Terrorists Everywhere!!! THEY ALL HATE AMERICA'S FREEDOM!!! (8/18/2007 7:17:40 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Focus50

I think they particularly hate America's freedom to deploy missiles seemingly wherever you like - all in the name of peace, of course....  *wink*  Now, if the Russians were to do the same in, sayyyy, Cuba, that'd then be *provocative*, ay?  lol
 


Uh...

We (well, and they, but we have more that work) can hit almost anywhere on the planet with undetectable (by radar) cruise missiles.  Any place we cannot hit with those can be hit by detectable ICBMs.

Cuba was relevant in an era that predates effective ICBMs, subs that can be underwater for months, and cruise missiles.  Putting missiles in Cuba now would be pointless and irrelevant.

Sinergy




kittinSol -> RE: Terrorists Everywhere!!! THEY ALL HATE AMERICA'S FREEDOM!!! (8/18/2007 7:46:04 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinergy

subs that can be underwater for months

Sinergy



Hijack alert: Sinergy, what kind of training does that involve?

Curiously.





Owner59 -> RE: Terrorists Everywhere!!! THEY ALL HATE AMERICA'S FREEDOM!!! (8/18/2007 8:21:52 AM)

That`a a different kind of sub,kittin.It`s full of seamen ,or was that semen......hmmm




kittinSol -> RE: Terrorists Everywhere!!! THEY ALL HATE AMERICA'S FREEDOM!!! (8/18/2007 9:45:32 AM)

Gag.




Termyn8or -> RE: Terrorists Everywhere!!! THEY ALL HATE AMERICA'S FREEDOM!!! (8/18/2007 9:58:19 AM)

How about this for an analogy, not very realistic but........

At the playground there is a bully. Nobody can play baseball because the bully knows that someone could brain him with a baseball bat. So he takes all the baseball bats. Later, the bully makes some "friends"" and they cover the entrances and police the playground, diligently making sure nobody else has baseball bats.

Of course these cohorts are allowed to have baseball bats to enforce the rules, and they are kept in line by the fact that the main bully has more baseball bats, in case they want to betray the great bully. Also the lunch money business is booming and they like it.

So it is plain to see, nobody else can have any WMDs, and we can have them anywhere in the world we want. Don't you see how simple it is ? It is simple, this message of democracy, from a country that is supposed to be a republic. Very simple "You will capitulate, you will give up all your weapons and we will take that land over there for a military base to protect you".

It would take a very interesting deficiency in reasoning for a normally intelligent person not to see this bullying mentality for what it is. Of course that is provided by the media. When you learn to put a slant on your writings to further your agenda, to get to be a writer, as long as your agenda coincides with theirs. At one journalist's guild or something meeting, one got up and debunked the whole premise of the affair saying something to the effect "We are paid to keep our opinions out of the news, we are whores".

But I digress. I did say I was going to do less hijacking, so in that spirit I will get back on topic at this point.

So they hate our freedom and democracy. Hmmm, let me look out the window. Hang on, I'll turn on the TV. Let me take a drive in the cool breeze on a sunny day at almost three bucks a gallon. Let me have a look at these nymphomaniac subhumans with the food card at the store, draining on tax dollars, which aren't even enough to pay the interest on the national debt. Haliburton moves to Dubai. Hmmmmm.

PERHAPS I HATE OUR FREEDOM AND DEMOCRACY !

But don't worry about me, for me to do like a suicide bombing would take a specific enemy. I will not fight an army alone, and give them more ammunition to take away our means. Remember what I said about McVeigh.

For a revolution to be morally acceptable we would need the support of over 50% of the people. With the percentage of people now dependent upon the government for their livelyhood, it is not going to happen, and that is described in the Protocols, and is in operation today. I am not just talking those who subsist on welfare or social security, I am talking scores of others whos jobs depend on the military. Many will think of what is good for them alone, discarding the rest of humanity like used toilet paper. This is the world we live in.

I am proud to say that people here are generally the exception to what I am about to say.

Most people will vote for a candidate who they think will put more money in their pocket. I have heard statements such as "Gotta vote for _______ because he will give us more welfare". I do not associate with that person anymore. But there is another class, the working class who will vote based on whoever they think will lower taxes. While there is a difference between those two classes, the end result is the same.

The change will come in the hearts and minds of the People. Whether this change manifests itself at the ballot box or the cartridge box is anybody's guess.

T




NorthernGent -> RE: Terrorists Everywhere!!! THEY ALL HATE AMERICA'S FREEDOM!!! (8/18/2007 10:42:15 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Termyn8or

The change will come in the hearts and minds of the People. Whether this change manifests itself at the ballot box or the cartridge box is anybody's guess.

T


We tend to find common ground in these types of discussions, Termyn8or, but I'm not convinced that any people is a single entity. Next door neighbours can't agree on how much each others' dogs shit on their front garden, so I'm not convinced that the people are capable of striking an agreement and pursuing a common interest.....maybe the people just don't agree with each other. Maybe some of the people thrive on the consumer lifestyle and have no wish to change.




Sinergy -> RE: Terrorists Everywhere!!! THEY ALL HATE AMERICA'S FREEDOM!!! (8/18/2007 11:05:49 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinergy

subs that can be underwater for months

Sinergy



Hijack alert: Sinergy, what kind of training does that involve?

Curiously.




Not sure, KittinSol, simply going on what I read about US nuclear submarines...

Sinergy




Real0ne -> RE: Terrorists Everywhere!!! THEY ALL HATE AMERICA'S FREEDOM!!! (8/18/2007 3:32:43 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: NorthernGent

quote:

ORIGINAL: Termyn8or

The change will come in the hearts and minds of the People. Whether this change manifests itself at the ballot box or the cartridge box is anybody's guess.

T


We tend to find common ground in these types of discussions, Termyn8or, but I'm not convinced that any people is a single entity. Next door neighbours can't agree on how much each others' dogs shit on their front garden, so I'm not convinced that the people are capable of striking an agreement and pursuing a common interest.....maybe the people just don't agree with each other. Maybe some of the people thrive on the consumer lifestyle and have no wish to change.


Well the problem i think is the way in which solutions come to bear.   Rather than picking up the neighbors dog shit and sending him an invoice for your labor and setting a precedence that you will pay me for the time it takes to clean your dogs mess people prefer to complain to the government such they get sick of hearing it and pass an ordinance so you pay a fine to none other the government.  We enslave ourselves through our own ignorance.




Griswold -> RE: Terrorists Everywhere!!! THEY ALL HATE AMERICA'S FREEDOM!!! (8/18/2007 4:31:57 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

Russia, China, Iran warn US at summit


Saturday, August 18, 2007 - ©2005 IranMania.com

The leaders of Russia, China and Iran said that Central Asia should be left alone to manage its stability and security, an apparent warning to the United States to avoid interfering in the strategic, resource-rich region, The Associated Press (AP) reported.

LONDON, August 18 (IranMania) - The leaders of Russia, China and Iran said that Central Asia should be left alone to manage its stability and security, an apparent warning to the United States to avoid interfering in the strategic, resource-rich region, The Associated Press (AP) reported.

The veiled warning came at a meeting of the Shanghai Cooperation Organization and on the eve of major war games between Russia and China.

The SCO was created 11 years ago to address religious extremism and border security in Central Asia, but in recent years, with countries such as Iran signing on as observers, it has grown into a bloc aimed at defying US interests in the region.

"Stability and security in Central Asia are best ensured primarily through efforts taken by the nations of the region on the basis of the existing regional associations," the leaders said in a statement at the end of the organization's summit in the Kyrgyz capital, Bishkek.

Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, attending the summit for the second consecutive year, criticized US plans to put parts of a missile defense system in Eastern Europe as a threat to the entire region.

"These intentions go beyond just one country. They are of concern for much of the continent, Asia and SCO members," he said.

Washington has said the system would help protect against potential Iranian missiles.

Russian President Vladimir Putin didn't mention the United States in his speech, but he said that "any attempts to solve global and regional problems unilaterally are hopeless."

He also called for "strengthening a multi-polar international system that would ensure equal security and opportunities for all countries", comments echoing Russia's frequent complaints that the United States dominates world affairs.

Moscow has also bristled at Washington's plans to deploy the anti-missile system in Poland and the Czech Republic, saying the system would threaten Russian security.

Putin and Hu Jintao of China were set to attend Friday's military exercises in the Chelyabinsk region in Russia's Ural Mountains. Some 6,000 Russian and Chinese troops, dozens of aircraft and hundreds of armored vehicles and other heavy weapons will participate, the first such joint drills on Russia's territory.

China hosted the first-ever joint maneuvers in August 2005, which included a mock assault on the beaches of northern China and featured Russia's long-range bombers.

Moscow and Beijing have developed what they dubbed a "strategic partnership" after the Soviet collapse, cemented by their perceptions that the United States dominates global affairs.

In 2005, the SCO called for a timetable to be set for the withdrawal of US troops from two member countries, Uzbekistan and Kyrgyzstan. Uzbekistan evicted American forces later that year, but

http://www.iranmania.com/News/ArticleView/Default.asp?NewsCode=53603&NewsKind=Current%20Affairs

Tahnk goodness we have a thriving economy, taken out the evil doers and have homeland security to protect us.  DOnt we all feel cozy now?.



What's your point?

That the USA's days are numbered?

That the rest of the world is ganging up on Uncle Sam?

That no one likes us?

That we're evildoers?

Wake the fuck up.

Britain tried to capture most of Mesopotamia and a good portion of South Africa and the Middle East during WW1

America's finance houses such as the House of Morgan among others attempted to vet Britains claim on various oil producing areas (which, at that time, oil production could only be guessed at, but oil growth as a percentage of GDP could be mathematically assumed) through usury, and in short order, the US was the economic powerhouse....but....

We did so, much the same as Britain did with the Ottoman Empire, India and then Mesopotamia, through debt...which we negotiated, with the sole complicity of the federal government (as the lender of last resort...ergo...usurptation of said international debt) on the hope, indeed, the assumption that they would never be able to repay the debt.

And so, at the appropriate time, our politicos devised new trade agreements which allowed the US to have advantage in world markets.

And we enjoyed that for a time.  And all was rosy.

But a new world order has appeared.  It includes the fact that the world is now our banker. 

And they have the ability to say..."Ya know...I'm just not comfortable with those Yankees ability to pay their bills anymore...I want a larger risk premium".

And that's where we stand today. 

The world is indeed our banker...and we are theirs as well.  The economic future of our planned existence is no longer predicated on our own ability to produce the goods.  We are subject to our neighbors...and they to us.

All those shows that some enjoyed in the 70's...with Mr & Mrs C, "The Fonz"...and all those late 50's visuals that reminded us of a "better time"...keep in mind, that better time was the result of our ability in WWII to control world finance (years later, more formalised in the Brettonwood agreement) as well as world debt...ergo, control...those were a manufactured time.

Which is not to say we can't regain our stature.

But, Russia has new found wealth.  Their gross national product has quadrupled since 2004.

Oil.

Thank George for our current energy bill (I'm a reforming Republican...so...sue me).

Our GDP has risen in the single digits in a similar time frame.

The Middle East is on a tear.  Syria...never our friend...has become a bastion of "unfriendlies".

Even Lebanon...a symptomatic pariah in the Middle East....and but for Isreal, our only link to vital ports....is changing their stripes....hence why we throw money at them.

(Lots of money).

There's a lot of crazy shit going on out there....none of which makes a whole lot of sense to you and me, the general public buying hot dogs and trying to make our lawn mowers work every time.....

But you know what? 

If you dig deep enough...it just gets fucking weirder.




Focus50 -> RE: Terrorists Everywhere!!! THEY ALL HATE AMERICA'S FREEDOM!!! (8/19/2007 4:21:33 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinergy

quote:

ORIGINAL: Focus50

I think they particularly hate America's freedom to deploy missiles seemingly wherever you like - all in the name of peace, of course....  *wink*  Now, if the Russians were to do the same in, sayyyy, Cuba, that'd then be *provocative*, ay?  lol
 


We (well, and they, but we have more that work) can hit almost anywhere on the planet with undetectable (by radar) cruise missiles.  Any place we cannot hit with those can be hit by detectable ICBMs.

I think you've got a bit too much confidence in technology.  Watching cruise missiles with their pin point accuracy on the News always looks impressive but they never do show the ones that miss.  And lets not mention the "smoke and mirrors" propoganda of the Patriot missile system....
 
No matter how good any technology gets, in general *everything* works more efficiently over shorter distances and time spans.


quote:

Cuba was relevant in an era that predates effective ICBMs, subs that can be underwater for months, and cruise missiles.  Putting missiles in Cuba now would be pointless and irrelevant.

Pointless and irrelevant....?  So if the Ruskies did deploy in Cuba again, it wouldn't be construed as provocative?  The White House would just shrug it off?  Righttttt.....
 
Focus.




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