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Lets even the playing field - 8/13/2007 10:02:29 PM   
satyrsnymph28


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Look what I found:

Ode to the Nice Guys

This rant was written for the Wharton Undergraduate Journal
This is a tribute to the nice guys. The nice guys that finish last, that never become more than friends, that endure hours of whining and bitching about what assholes guys are, while disproving the very point. This is dedicated to those guys who always provide a shoulder to lean on but restrain themselves to tentative hugs, those guys who hold open doors and give reassuring pats on the back and sit patiently outside the changing room at department stores. This is in honor of the guys that obligingly reiterate how cute/beautiful/smart/funny/sexy their female friends are at the appropriate moment, because they know most girls need that litany of support. This is in honor of the guys with open minds, with laid-back attitudes, with honest concern. This is in honor of the guys who respect a girl’s every facet, from her privacy to her theology to her clothing style. This is for the guys who escort their drunk, bewildered female friends back from parties and never take advantage once they’re at her door, for the guys who accompany girls to bars as buffers against the rest of the creepy male population, for the guys who know a girl is fishing for compliments but give them out anyway, for the guys who always play by the rules in a game where the rules favor cheaters, for the guys who are accredited as boyfriend material but somehow don’t end up being boyfriends, for all the nice guys who are overlooked, underestimated, and unappreciated, for all the nice guys who are manipulated, misled, and unjustly abandoned, this is for you. This is for that time she left 40 urgent messages on your cell phone, and when you called her back, she spent three hours painstakingly dissecting two sentences her boyfriend said to her over dinner. And even though you thought her boyfriend was a chump and a jerk, you assured her that it was all ok and she shouldn’t worry about it. This is for that time she interrupted the best killing spree you’d ever orchestrated in GTA3 to rant about a rumor that romantically linked her and the guy she thinks is the most repulsive person in the world. And even though you thought it was immature and you had nothing against the guy, you paused the game for two hours and helped her concoct a counter-rumor to spread around the floor. This is also for that time she didn’t have a date, so after numerous vows that there was nothing “serious” between the two of you, she dragged you to a party where you knew nobody, the beer was awful, and she flirted shamelessly with you, justifying each fit of reckless teasing by announcing to everyone: “oh, but we’re just friends!” And even though you were invited purely as a symbolic warm body for her ego, you went anyways. Because you’re nice like that. The nice guys don’t often get credit where credit is due. And perhaps more disturbing, the nice guys don’t seem to get laid as often as they should. And I wish I could logically explain this trend, but I can’t. From what I have observed on campus and what I have learned from talking to friends at other schools and in the workplace, the only conclusion I can form is that many girls are just illogical, manipulative bitches. Many of them claim they just want to date a nice guy, but when presented with such a specimen, they say irrational, confusing things such as “oh, he’s too nice to date” or “he would be a good boyfriend but he’s not for me” or “he already puts up with so much from me, I couldn’t possibly ask him out!” or the most frustrating of all: “no, it would ruin our friendship.” Yet, they continue to lament the lack of datable men in the world, and they expect their too-nice-to-date male friends to sympathize and apologize for the men that are jerks. Sorry, guys, girls like that are beyond my ability to fathom. I can’t figure out why the connection breaks down between what they say (I want a nice guy!) and what they do (I’m going to sleep with this complete ass now!). But one thing I can do, is say that the nice-guy-finishes-last phenomenon doesn’t last forever. There are definitely many girls who grow out of that train of thought and realize they should be dating the nice guys, not taking them for granted. The tricky part is finding those girls, and even trickier, finding the ones that are single. So, until those girls are found, I propose a toast to all the nice guys. You know who you are, and I know you’re sick of hearing yourself described as ubiquitously nice. But the truth of the matter is, the world needs your patience in the department store, your holding open of doors, your party escorting services, your propensity to be a sucker for a pretty smile. For all the crazy, inane, absurd things you tolerate, for all the situations where you are the faceless, nameless hero, my accolades, my acknowledgement, and my gratitude go out to you. You do have credibility in this society, and your well deserved vindication is coming. Fu-zu Jen, SEAS/WH, 2003
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RE: Lets even the playing field - 8/13/2007 10:25:58 PM   
BruisedHick


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This is a great reassurance to any guy who can't get a date.

All of us are just too nice.  Yeah, that's it.  We're too nice.

Way to create a new generation of delusional bachelors.

_____________________________

Guess who?

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RE: Lets even the playing field - 8/13/2007 11:00:47 PM   
Sinergy


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I was that sort of chump most of my life.  I never lost the ability to be that sort of chump, but I refuse to go out with a woman who treats me that way.

I am a forever friend, but I have needs, and I am not going to sacrifice those needs for an uncaring drama queen.

Sinergy

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RE: Lets even the playing field - 8/13/2007 11:39:16 PM   
CuriousLord


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The nice guy versus ass thing is likely why I started the Dom/sub lifestyle.  Observing human interactions (I'm very much the outsider), I decided that females, despite what they may think, truly desire to be treated in a used manner (it is important to make the distinction between being used and being treated as though).

Ignore them.  Talk down to them.  Don't acknowledge their thoughts.  Their opinions are worthless.  They'll think of you.  You'll be the one that they have to impress.  The one that they have to give it up for.  The one that they're devoted to.  And, that nice guy?  The one that listens to them?  They're getting what they want from him.  They're too selfish to realize their own abusive nature.

Empirically, it works.  I'll leave others to debate as to why this is.

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RE: Lets even the playing field - 8/14/2007 1:35:09 AM   
meatcleaver


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When I worked in the probation service it never ceased to amaze me how inarticulate muscle brains, would have beautiful, otherwise intelligent, articulate, educated women following in their wake, happy to be treated like a piece of crap.

I have to admit after being stabbed in the back once I don't make any concessions to the women I date and the old cliche, treat 'em mean, keep 'em keen, really does seem to work. I can't work it but they seem to enjoy the martyrdom of being treated like you wouldn't treat a dog but there you go.

EDIT  Having someone treat you like a dog is not what I find an attractive trait but since I'm not looking for a partner, just a good time, it matters little to me.

< Message edited by meatcleaver -- 8/14/2007 1:42:44 AM >


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RE: Lets even the playing field - 8/14/2007 2:21:40 AM   
UtopianRanger


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quote:


I am a forever friend, but I have needs, and I am not going to sacrifice those needs for an uncaring drama queen.


Or narcissist.

Having spent ten years of my life in the bar/entertainment business, I know first hand that shrewdness pays handsomely.





- R



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"If you are going to win any battle, you have to do one thing. You have to make the mind run the body. Never let the body tell the mind what to do... the body is never tired if the mind is not tired."

-General George S. Patton


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RE: Lets even the playing field - 8/14/2007 7:09:14 AM   
sophia37


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This is an intereting post. Not that I could read all the way thru the opener. But it matters not.

I actually went for the "nice guy" boyfriend. And for all the reasons the opening post says are the mark of a nice guy.

I dont see my partner as a nice guy though. I see him as a "good person". I think thats how women need to think, once they meet the "nice guy". Change the label and change the man. 

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RE: Lets even the playing field - 8/14/2007 8:04:54 AM   
DomKen


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This is so true it's almost funny. I remember in high school when the girl I spent hours comforting over her asshole bf finally broke up with him and I asked her out she said "I couldn't date you you're like a brother." and she proceeded to find some other halfwit to treat her like shit which meant she expected me to be available as a shoulder to cry on again. I was such a chump.

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RE: Lets even the playing field - 8/14/2007 8:46:12 AM   
sophia37


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Yes. But...are you still a "nice guy"? 

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RE: Lets even the playing field - 8/14/2007 8:54:47 AM   
kiyari


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Speaking purely for myself, I can be 'friends' with a man who does not interest me (or even repels me) physically, has habits I would never accept in a partner, is married, gay, and etc.

Where the man has more (read: other than an interest in 'friends') interest in the 'friendship' than I have, then there is where such abuses (shoulder to cry on, listening ear to regale and tax) may occur and become habit: he uncomplaining, and I being ego-stroked and having outlet for personal venting, in an unconsidered presumption, that he is voluntarily in that role.

If the friendship is genuine (we each actually enjoy each other's company), I inevitably come to desire my friend as more-than-a-friend, irrespective of the physical. This presents difficulty, when the friend has no such reciprocal interest, is otherwise involved or married... and so may truly jeopardize the friendship.

Again, just me n my perspective

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RE: Lets even the playing field - 8/14/2007 8:57:45 AM   
ownedgirlie


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I never had friends like that.  If I was dating a chump, my friends would tell me he's a chump.  Nor would I use a friendship like that....which is probably why I never had friends like that.  My male friends rocked, and they'd talk about their chicks as much as I'd talk about my guys. 

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RE: Lets even the playing field - 8/14/2007 9:09:19 AM   
SugarMyChurro


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I wouldn't go so far as to say that I treat women poorly - that's not necessary. But will I enable all kinds of tedious behavior just to be close with someone - no. I am okay with quid pro quo relationships, but I won't waste a moment on anyone that is simply abusing my good nature.

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RE: Lets even the playing field - 8/14/2007 9:17:22 AM   
Alumbrado


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quote:

But will I enable all kinds of tedious behavior just to be close with someone - no.


Bingo.

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RE: Lets even the playing field - 8/14/2007 9:26:13 AM   
kiyari


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quote:

ORIGINAL: SugarMyChurro

I wouldn't go so far as to say that I treat women poorly - that's not necessary.

But will I enable all kinds of tedious behavior just to be close with someone - no.

I am okay with quid pro quo relationships,
but I won't waste a moment on anyone that is simply abusing my good nature.

Respectfully Submitted:

In my perspective, genuine friends care about the distress of friends. That distress, when the friend is female, may (granted) ofttimes be of relatively trivial (apparent) nature.

One may tire of a friend who gets stuck in a self-pity or self-defeating rut.

My post does say, that (for me) a true friend, is one who WILL become a love-interest.

...but that's Just Me (and has been... awkward at times LOL)

If your interest in the female friend is... more than friendly... then there is where you have set yourself up. I see a bit of dishonesty or self-delusion in that ... just saying.

As well, there ARE 'Lifestyle Opportunists' among us... some are just That Way. 
It is not a gender thing

If your relationship ('friend' 'foe' ... whatever) is not feeding you what you need... move on, it Only Makes Sense.

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Black Water Dragon

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RE: Lets even the playing field - 8/14/2007 9:28:14 AM   
satyrsnymph28


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here's my problem with all of this though...

i am the kind of girl who values the "nice guys"

i recognize it in someone right away and prefer to date them as opposed to just befriending them.

but then they never want to get involved with me, and instead, date the GIRLS who treat them like shit... and complain about why they can never find a nice girl who won't break their hearts.. or why the nice girls are never interested in them as anything more than friends

i guess i'm the female equivalent of a "nice guy"

a rare one who isn't looking for an abuser or an alcoholic...

yet the nice ones see me as their friend... or in some cases when they detect my interest, they  see me as their personal bank. 

No, I won't give you money... yes, i get used a lot...

:: sigh ::

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RE: Lets even the playing field - 8/14/2007 9:45:25 AM   
boytoy4female


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Nice guys do finish last. The nice, stable guys attract the nutty girls who need stability. I leanred later in life that there is medical proof that nice guys finish last. I married a wonderful girl. Of course she had already been married to the jerk and had one kid. After we got married, she began having severe nightmares and depression. After some candid conversatons with her counselor, I was advised that because she was now in a stable loving relationship, her mind had decided it could now deal with some past abuse issues, which she had blocked out. Being the male closest to her, I became the representation of the evil. I asked the counselor if she was telling me that nice guys finish last and she agreed that indeed she was.

So, to all you women who looked past the nice guy, married the asshole and your life went to hell..ha ha ha. Im going to my lake house to go water skiing in my ski boat. Oh and if I dated you and you dropped me for that jerk, quit calling me and telling me how wrong you now realize you were....tuff shit, you did me a favor

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RE: Lets even the playing field - 8/14/2007 10:01:10 AM   
kiyari


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Awww... poor baby!!!

...feel better now?



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RE: Lets even the playing field - 8/14/2007 11:33:18 AM   
windchymes


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Sorry, but the very same all goes for you guys who passed over the "nice" girl because you wanted the high-maintenance glamour queen decorating your arm and making you feel like a Big Man.  Then you come crying back to the nice girl, whining about how glamour queen maxed out your credit cards for beauty treatments and clothes and then dumped you for the new studlier guy.

And your answer when we ask why you kept her and put up with her shit?  "Because she was drop-dead gorgeous!" 

Enjoy.

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You know it's going to be a GOOD blow job when she puts a Breathe Right strip on first.

Pick-up artists and garbage men should trade names.

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RE: Lets even the playing field - 8/14/2007 11:35:29 AM   
mnottertail


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lolololol, how you gonna max out a credit card naked, collared and cuffed?  Revlon doesn't make that much eyeshadow.

Ron 

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Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


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RE: Lets even the playing field - 8/14/2007 11:40:25 AM   
GhitaAmati


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Voice activated computer Ron, how do you think all us naked collared and cuffed sub chat online all day. You can buy anything online or over the phone these days.

ghita~

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Sex without love is a meaningless experience, but as far as meaningless experiences go its pretty damn good.
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