Police walk in on exorcism

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cyberdude611 -> Police walk in on exorcism (7/29/2007 3:07:07 PM)
PHOENIX - Officers responding to a report of an exorcism on a young girl found her grandfather choking her and used stun guns to subdue the man, who later died, authorities said Sunday. The 3-year-old girl and her mother, who was also in the room during the struggle between 49-year-old Ronald Marquez and officers, were hospitalized, police said. Their condition was unavailable. The relative who called police said an exorcism had also been attempted Thursday. "The purpose was to release demons from this very young child," said Sgt. Joel Tranter. Officers arrived at the house Saturday and entered when they heard screaming coming from a bedroom, Tranter said. A bed had been pushed up against the door; the officers pushed it open a few inches and saw Marquez choking his bloodied granddaughter, who was crying in pain and gasping, Tranter said. A bloody, naked 19-year-old woman who police later determined to be Marquez's daughter and the girl's mother was in the room, chanting "something that was religious in nature," Tranter said. The officers forced open the door enough for one to enter, leading to a struggle in which an officer used a stun gun on Marquez, Tranter said. After the initial stun had no visible effect, another officer squeezed into the room and stunned him. The girl was freed and passed through the door to the relative, Tranter said. Marquez was placed in handcuffs after a struggle with officers and initially appeared normal, but then stopped breathing, Tranter said. He could not be revived and was pronounced dead at a hospital. Tranter declined to identify Marquez's daughter and granddaughter but said they lived in the house with Marquez. The mother was not arrested, but police will consider criminal charges, Tranter said. There was no phone listing at Ronald Marquez's address. http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070729/ap_on_re_us/exorcism_death;_ylt=AkcN4MP5NY2jIktf1IT2gd2s0NUE

popeye1250 -> RE: Police walk in on exorcism (7/29/2007 4:54:52 PM)
Let me guess, The Devil made him do it right?

philosophy -> RE: Police walk in on exorcism (7/29/2007 5:17:15 PM)
..bell, book and pepper-spray?

nyrisa -> RE: Police walk in on exorcism (7/29/2007 5:33:39 PM)
This is what happens when you have amateurs attempting exorcisms. You hire a professional to spray your house for cockroaches, but then you let your crazy grandfather exorcize your child. Sheesh.

cyberdude611 -> RE: Police walk in on exorcism (7/29/2007 5:40:45 PM)
He was probably reading, "Exorcism for Dummies."

thornhappy -> RE: Police walk in on exorcism (7/29/2007 8:55:26 PM)
Just out of curiousity, I thought the Catholic Church was getting away from exorcism... anyone got more recent info? thornhappy

Estring -> RE: Police walk in on exorcism (7/29/2007 9:34:08 PM)
I seriously doubt The Catholic Church had anything to do with this. Any truth to the rumor that this was a publicity stunt for "The Simpsons Movie"?

Real0ne -> RE: Police walk in on exorcism (7/29/2007 9:39:07 PM)
da charges wife: naked attempted exorcism wife charges police with: murder that could get real interesting me thinks

thelunabird -> RE: Police walk in on exorcism (7/29/2007 9:39:35 PM)
He was probably on drugs like PCP, cocaine, or some other drug that makes your heart race... thats why stun guns are illegal or not used by police departments in so many states. alot of people die from them because they were previously doing drugs and the added shock of the stun gun is too much for their heart to take and they die of heart attacks. Being on some sort of drug would explain his attack as well... or maybe he was just crazy.. but ethier way he probably died of a heart attack from the stun guns lune

cyberdude611 -> RE: Police walk in on exorcism (7/29/2007 10:11:41 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: nyrisa This is what happens when you have amateurs attempting exorcisms. You hire a professional to spray your house for cockroaches, but then you let your crazy grandfather exorcize your child. Sheesh. Im certain the Catholic Church had nothing to do with this. Catholics believe that only an ordained preist can perform an exorcism, and that priest must get permission from the church.

nyrisa -> RE: Police walk in on exorcism (7/29/2007 11:21:33 PM)
Yes, I felt sure it was not a church sanctioned rite.

Lordandmaster -> RE: Police walk in on exorcism (7/29/2007 11:34:35 PM)
So let me get this straight...if this had been a Church-sanctioned exorcism under the direction of a real professional, they would have been able to get the demons out of that poor girl? quote: ORIGINAL: nyrisa This is what happens when you have amateurs attempting exorcisms. You hire a professional to spray your house for cockroaches, but then you let your crazy grandfather exorcize your child. Sheesh.

nyrisa -> RE: Police walk in on exorcism (7/29/2007 11:43:46 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Lordandmaster So let me get this straight...if this had been a Church-sanctioned exorcism under the direction of a real professional, they would have been able to get the demons out of that poor girl? quote: ORIGINAL: nyrisa This is what happens when you have amateurs attempting exorcisms. You hire a professional to spray your house for cockroaches, but then you let your crazy grandfather exorcize your child. Sheesh. No, I don't believe that. I am not Catholic, but I believe they have to go through some process among the church heirarchy to "verify" a need for exorcism. The Catholic church does not want to wrongly attribute possession when it may be mental illness, epilepsy, or, in the case of a 3 year old girl, could even be simply night terrors. So very few cases get accepted for the rite, from what I've heard. In my own personal belief, I don't believe in possession and exorcism, so I would not expect to see a "cure" happen. But even so, if it was a legit exorcism, it would have been done under the control and guidance of priests, and you'd not find the grandfather choking the child, with his daughter naked and bloodied in the room. I think when the full story is known, it is likely to involve more evil human intervention than any demonic forces. Hopefully no exorcism would have even been attempted, and if it had, it would not have had so much violence, I would think.

Lordandmaster -> RE: Police walk in on exorcism (7/29/2007 11:45:10 PM)
OK, I understand.

Real0ne -> RE: Police walk in on exorcism (7/30/2007 6:15:46 AM)
i wonder how much that is going to cost the cop shop when its all said and done.

DomKen -> RE: Police walk in on exorcism (7/30/2007 7:12:28 AM)
Shouldn't cost them anything. The grandfather attacked a sworn officer, a felony, while the officer was attempting stop the abuse of a child, a few more felonies, and the officers used non lethal force and didn't initially resort to batons and the like. The grandfather's cause of death is almost certainly going to be drug related although a bum ticker is an outside possibility. Juries don't often decide in favor of the estate of a guy abusing his child when it sues the peace officers that were trying to save the child.

Real0ne -> RE: Police walk in on exorcism (7/30/2007 7:17:23 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DomKen Shouldn't cost them anything. The grandfather attacked a sworn officer, a felony, while the officer was attempting stop the abuse of a child, a few more felonies, and the officers used non lethal force and didn't initially resort to batons and the like. The grandfather's cause of death is almost certainly going to be drug related although a bum ticker is an outside possibility. Juries don't often decide in favor of the estate of a guy abusing his child when it sues the peace officers that were trying to save the child. well it is going ot be interesting and we will have to keep an eye on it, killing an unarmed man is "murder" regardless if it is intentional or not. THe archilles heel here is that the man from what i could tell had no weapon.

luckydog1 -> RE: Police walk in on exorcism (7/30/2007 8:59:52 AM)
"killing an unarmed man is "murder" regardless if it is intentional or not. " Nonsense, there are several catagories of killing, of which murder is simply one. There is negligent homicide, manslaughter, and several others. Whether the person is armed (whcich oculd be concelaed and not brandished) has no bearing on whether the event would be defined as a murder. A police officer accidentaly and unintentionally killing a suspect while activly stopping an ongoing crime is not murder in any way shape or form.

Alumbrado -> RE: Police walk in on exorcism (7/30/2007 9:02:58 AM)
quote: "killing an unarmed man is "murder" regardless if it is intentional or not. " [sm=biggrin.gif][sm=biggrin.gif]

Lordandmaster -> RE: Police walk in on exorcism (7/30/2007 9:32:49 AM)
You need to look up the definition of "murder." If it's not intentional, it's not murder. Intent is one of the necessary elements of murder. quote: ORIGINAL: Real0ne killing an unarmed man is "murder" regardless if it is intentional or not.

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