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Sex as a reward? - 7/29/2007 11:37:10 AM   
mistoferin


Posts: 8284
Joined: 10/27/2004
Status: offline 		A thread in the "Ask a Master" section got me thinking about this and I thought it deserved it's own thread.

I often hear "D" types saying that sex in a power exchange relationship is a reward and shouldn't be the focus. While I agree, sex should never be the only glue that binds people in a long term, committed relationship, I don't understand the "sex is a reward" concept. From the other post I wrote this:

quote:

See, I don't get the whole "sex is a reward" concept. I can see where it is rewarding, but not a reward. To me, sex is a mutually fulfilling activity that is shared on a regular basis between two people who are in a loving and committed relationship. It should be spontaneous and not have to be "earned". If someone I was with only gave it to me as a "reward", I would assume that it was not something that they wanted to do because of their own natural desires to do so. "She did a great job scrubbing the floor today, I think I'll give her some dick as a reward". Huh?????? Nope, don't get it. I want sex with my partners to be because they desire it as much as I do. 


What are your thoughts on the subject?

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RE: Sex as a reward? - 7/29/2007 11:39:19 AM   
feastie


Posts: 1793
Joined: 6/4/2004
Status: offline 		Sex is not a reward.  It's a mutually fulfilling activity.

Cum, however...is another matter

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RE: Sex as a reward? - 7/29/2007 11:48:38 AM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline 		I don't either, unles sit's just a fun teasing game.  I can understanding using sex or a particular activity/position/addition to be used for fun reward type things, but if sex is part of the relationship as an integral way of connecting, using it seriously as a method of behavioral training (aka reward) does not make much sense.

But perhaps it's more a general gender dissonance?  Men often see sex as a reward in itself- asking for a threesome for an anniversary or a stripper for their birthday.  Women tend to see sex as a way to feel closer in the relationship.

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RE: Sex as a reward? - 7/29/2007 11:51:16 AM   
Tinman1960


Posts: 46
Joined: 5/19/2007
Status: offline 		Ok, I understand what you are saying BUT " I disagree to a degree".... sex is a great reward or gift  -  but only as long as one does not 'with-hold" sex as a punishment.

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RE: Sex as a reward? - 7/29/2007 12:00:30 PM   
mistoferin


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross
But perhaps it's more a general gender dissonance?  Men often see sex as a reward in itself- asking for a threesome for an anniversary or a stripper for their birthday.  Women tend to see sex as a way to feel closer in the relationship.


I do see this concept applied more often in female D/male s type relationships than in male D/female s relationships, although it is not exclusively so. Is this because female D types are playing on that male idea of sex as a reward? Wouldn't doing so shortchange them in the long run as you said that females tend to view sex as a means of establishing a closer bond? Or is it that maybe some use that as to defend against that very thing?

_____________________________

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~erin~

There are no victims here...only volunteers.

When you make a habit of playing on the tracks, you thereby forfeit the right to bitch when you get hit by a train.

"I did it! I admit it and I'm gonna do it again!"

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RE: Sex as a reward? - 7/29/2007 12:05:41 PM   
AquaticSub


Posts: 14867
Joined: 12/27/2005
Status: offline 		I don't see why it can't be both. Like I said in the other thread, we have sex when we are both randy and feel like it. But if I've been good he may reward me by letting me pick things I like, like him using his fangs or a particular way of binding me that is more complex and less of a "in the moment" thing.

It doesn't stop him from doing those things if he feels like it, but I enjoy them to the point where they work well as a treat and as something we just want to do to. Like going to an amusement park - we can do it just because we want to and as a treat to me for good behavior.

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RE: Sex as a reward? - 7/29/2007 12:07:16 PM   
ownedgirlie


Posts: 9184
Joined: 2/5/2006
Status: offline 		For me it's an indirect reward, since I can never seem to get enough and always want more...heh, so I'm greedy. 

But as for "Do such n such and you get to have sex" no, that doesn't fly.  "Do such n such because I want you to" is more the way to go.  My "reward" is that he owns me, and that I get to serve him. I do don't stuff for him for actual rewards.  My reward is the way the relationship develops.

As for the withholding sex for punishment...not that I get punished much anymore, but when he's not happy with me he's sure not going to be in the mood to fuck me. Knowing he is taking pleasure in me gives me joy.  When he doesn't feel like it, well that's plenty punishment right there.  He rarely withholds my orgasms though, even when he's mad, as that's one of our bonding mechanisms.  Even if he's unhappy with me, he prefers to keep that bond strong.

It's really all about frame of mind for us - the mental and emotional.  We don't really have a "reward and take away" kind of dynamic. 

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RE: Sex as a reward? - 7/29/2007 12:09:47 PM   
mistoferin


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quote:

ORIGINAL: AquaticSub
I don't see why it can't be both.


Oh, I think it can be. As LA expressed also, for something fun, out of the ordinary or extra special.

I also see the thought expressed by many D types that sex is done at their whim. Does that it is seen as not appropriate for s types to initiate sex? I can't personally imagine being in a relationship where I couldn't express my desires as they come up.

_____________________________

Peace and light,
~erin~

There are no victims here...only volunteers.

When you make a habit of playing on the tracks, you thereby forfeit the right to bitch when you get hit by a train.

"I did it! I admit it and I'm gonna do it again!"

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RE: Sex as a reward? - 7/29/2007 12:15:12 PM   
AquaticSub


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quote:

ORIGINAL: mistoferin

I also see the thought expressed by many D types that sex is done at their whim. Does that it is seen as not appropriate for s types to initiate sex? I can't personally imagine being in a relationship where I couldn't express my desires as they come up.


I guess for some that is how it works for some but I also couldn't imagine being in it. We prefer having me tell Valyraen when I want sex and then he decides if he wants to or not. And, of course, sometimes he surprises me.

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

(in reply to mistoferin)
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RE: Sex as a reward? - 7/29/2007 12:16:37 PM   
mistoferin


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quote:

ORIGINAL: ownedgirlie
As for the withholding sex for punishment...not that I get punished much anymore, but when he's not happy with me he's sure not going to be in the mood to fuck me. 


Ooooo....not even the occasional "grudge fuck"? Sometimes that kind of sex can be awesome....provided of course that it's not used as an abusive tool meant to do harm. I'm talking the "Gawd, you're so fucking sexy when your mad" kind of sex. Sometimes though a good fucking can seem to make what you might be quarreling over seem completely unimportant.

_____________________________

Peace and light,
~erin~

There are no victims here...only volunteers.

When you make a habit of playing on the tracks, you thereby forfeit the right to bitch when you get hit by a train.

"I did it! I admit it and I'm gonna do it again!"

(in reply to ownedgirlie)
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RE: Sex as a reward? - 7/29/2007 12:20:20 PM   
Grlwithboy


Posts: 655
Joined: 2/8/2005
Status: offline 		Sex serves different purposes and there's different types of sex. Sometimes it's a kind of psychic and emotional glue, and sometimes having control of something the other person wants so bad is a wonderful means to control them, see begging, sweat and tears and all that good stuff. I have sex to reinforce power and because I want to w/in my relationship with my boy.


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RE: Sex as a reward? - 7/29/2007 12:24:23 PM   
ownedgirlie


Posts: 9184
Joined: 2/5/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mistoferin

quote:

ORIGINAL: ownedgirlie
As for the withholding sex for punishment...not that I get punished much anymore, but when he's not happy with me he's sure not going to be in the mood to fuck me. 


Ooooo....not even the occasional "grudge fuck"? Sometimes that kind of sex can be awesome....provided of course that it's not used as an abusive tool meant to do harm. I'm talking the "Gawd, you're so fucking sexy when your mad" kind of sex. Sometimes though a good fucking can seem to make what you might be quarreling over seem completely unimportant.


Ohhhh....come to think of it, I remember ONE time when he had me drive 90 minutes to meet him midway (he left an out of town meeting in the afternoon for this) to have my hide practically whipped off for being a drama queen (long story).  Yep, I do believe he fucked the hell out of me after that, got dressed, and left.

It made an impact.  But I really wouldn't want a repeat, LOL.

And if we're quarreling, it's because I didn't obey his directive to stop quarreling

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RE: Sex as a reward? - 7/29/2007 12:30:35 PM   
domiguy


Posts: 12952
Joined: 5/2/2006
Status: offline 		Can you imagine how cool it would be if you could grudge fuck the folks out here...Just look up their profile and click the "Grudge Fuck" button.....Never mind....I doubt I would ever stop bleeding....

Anywhoooo....sex....I don't use it as punishment or a reward.....But when I want it, I want it....Poor lil' subsusie just might have got done watching the rape scene in the movie "Frances" where Jessica Lange gets raped in the loonie bin.

She might not be exactly in the mood....Either way she will willingly accept the task at hand.....God bless her.

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RE: Sex as a reward? - 7/29/2007 12:42:13 PM   
Tinman1960


Posts: 46
Joined: 5/19/2007
Status: offline 		Ok," I see with-holding sex as punishment" and" being upset or angry and not in the mood for sex"  as being different. Admittedly, they can be or may seem to be related at times but, in my mind at least, they are different. And "make up fucks" are GREAT !!! lol

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RE: Sex as a reward? - 7/29/2007 1:08:37 PM   
MasterMataeo


Posts: 215
Joined: 1/24/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mistoferin

A thread in the "Ask a Master" section got me thinking about this and I thought it deserved it's own thread.

I often hear "D" types saying that sex in a power exchange relationship is a reward and shouldn't be the focus. While I agree, sex should never be the only glue that binds people in a long term, committed relationship, I don't understand the "sex is a reward" concept. From the other post I wrote this:

quote:

See, I don't get the whole "sex is a reward" concept. I can see where it is rewarding, but not a reward. To me, sex is a mutually fulfilling activity that is shared on a regular basis between two people who are in a loving and committed relationship. It should be spontaneous and not have to be "earned". If someone I was with only gave it to me as a "reward", I would assume that it was not something that they wanted to do because of their own natural desires to do so. "She did a great job scrubbing the floor today, I think I'll give her some dick as a reward". Huh?????? Nope, don't get it. I want sex with my partners to be because they desire it as much as I do. 


What are your thoughts on the subject?


i think i responded to that thread ,, but if not ,,
for the record ,, if there are certain acts that a sub/salve enjoys,, then yes why not save it for a reward,,
i know i have in the past and it has made that moment even more intense not just for me  but for the sub/slave as well ,,
for instance ,, if the sub/slave  enjoys preforming before  company ,, and you only allow them to do it as a reward ,, they have a tendency to act better and more egar to do things if they know that company is coming over,
and another situation comes to mind,,
at one time i had a sub/slave whom really enjoyed anal ,, and in order for her to be rewarded with that pleasure  , she had certain things to do ,, weather it was having the house clean ,, getting certain items that i needed ,, or other tasks that i have laid out,, i found that the sub/slave would go to great lengths to make sure that the tasks were complete,, and sometimes more,
and there have been times that i have cut off a sub/slave for insolents, and failure to do the chores and follow simple requests,,
for like there are Pain-Sluts,, there are Sex-Sluts as well < not quite the sex-addict, but close enough>
and that is where knowing how to and what punishment is best for the time and situation


MasterMataeo

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Try anything Once, Twice if you like it, Three times to make sure, four makes it a habit, and five makes it's a fetish.


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RE: Sex as a reward? - 7/29/2007 2:10:06 PM   
DarkDaddyZ


Posts: 805
Joined: 4/7/2006
Status: offline 		I treat sex like I treat play, it's about fun and a connection.  If I'm in a Power Exchange relationship with a nymph masochist and I'm trying to correct (okay discipline her) then having sex and beating her probably wouldn't correct diddly.

When things are great beating her and having sex with her is mutual fun and quite exciting!

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RE: Sex as a reward? - 7/29/2007 2:18:25 PM   
mistoferin


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Joined: 10/27/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterMataeo
and another situation comes to mind,,
at one time i had a sub/slave whom really enjoyed anal ,, and in order for her to be rewarded with that pleasure  , she had certain things to do ,, weather it was having the house clean ,, getting certain items that i needed ,, or other tasks that i have laid out,, i found that the sub/slave would go to great lengths to make sure that the tasks were complete,, and sometimes more,


I guess I just see these things as part of my responsibility in a relationship. I don't need to be rewarded to get them done.

quote:

and there have been times that i have cut off a sub/slave for insolents, and failure to do the chores and follow simple requests,,   

Aren't you then cutting yourself off as well? If they aint "gettin any", you aint either....unless of course the situation is poly.

quote:

for like there are Pain-Sluts,, there are Sex-Sluts as well < not quite the sex-addict, but close enough>
and that is where knowing how to and what punishment is best for the time and situation

Well I wouldn't call myself a sex addict, but I would definitely say I am a sex slut....I have a REAL healthy sexual appetite. But using something that I see as an integral part of our relationship (sex) as punishment, would only serve to damage that relationship in my eyes.


_____________________________

Peace and light,
~erin~

There are no victims here...only volunteers.

When you make a habit of playing on the tracks, you thereby forfeit the right to bitch when you get hit by a train.

"I did it! I admit it and I'm gonna do it again!"

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RE: Sex as a reward? - 7/29/2007 2:56:56 PM   
thetammyjo


Posts: 6322
Joined: 9/8/2005
Status: offline 		I don't use sex as a reward primarily for a very selfish reason -- I want to be in control of our sexual interactions.

As soon as it becomes a reward, I've lost that control. For a reward system to work it must be used and that takes away my control over when, where, and how I have sex with my slave.

The second reason is that I find sex to be best when it is passionate and yet relaxing. Doing on a schedule or doing it as a reward might result it feeling like it is being forced for one or both of us. That feeling of force, at least on my end of things, is very unerotic, not very passionate, and completely unrelaxing. Perhaps the sense of force feels better for others but for this dominant it is not good.

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RE: Sex as a reward? - 7/29/2007 3:14:53 PM   
daddysprop247


Posts: 1712
Joined: 6/24/2005
From: DC Metro area
Status: offline 		sex is not any sort of reward in this relationship, it's not a tool of control in general, at least not in the sense most use it here. for me, sex is about use and service, period. i serve, my Master (or whoever he has loaned me to) uses me for his pleasure. my personal sexual desires/arousal/etc. are irrelevant, i'm just a tool. therefore the idea of it being a reward just wouldn't make any sense in our union.

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RE: Sex as a reward? - 7/29/2007 3:16:35 PM   
lateralist1


Posts: 886
Joined: 11/22/2006
Status: offline 		It's really interesting to hear how others view their relationships.
I tend to think that sex should be something that both people enjoy/want.
I would of course deny a sub if I wasn't in the mood. It would help him to do what he knows will get me in the mood. But then I would expect him to want to do that anyway. In my opinion service of whatever type should be mutually rewarding.
If a sub didn't want to do as I wanted him to then the relationship isn't really working that well and I would think that maybe we had made a mistake getting together.

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