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RE: Bush is strategically setting the board for an Amer... - 7/23/2007 8:58:19 AM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY

quote:

ORIGINAL: SugarMyChurro

http://www.roncan.com/iranwar.html

-----

Sounds about right to me. I've been ranting about the PNAC for some time now. It's all very worrying.

I don't really know who this Estanislao Carter guy is. This is the first I've seen of his commentary.

Personally, I like everything about Ron Paul except his stand on abortion. I just don't know that our country can function under the Constitution any longer - it's all gone too far I fear.

The Constitutional republic is the comforting lie they tell us in order to get us to accept a de facto plutocracy. That's reality.


There is so much idiocy on that link, that it bogles the mind.

Just two examples:

   First we have the PNAC agenda

   This clearly calls for a 3 - 4 front war. It calls for domination of resources and it calls for military oversight of those resources indefinitely. This has been the neocon controlling agenda even before Bush's Presidency.


He links to the "Rebuilding America's Defenses" white paper put out by a non-governmental think tank that discusses the US's strategic miitary doctrine.  The "3-4 front war" as he calls it, is little more than a call to return to a previous (i.e. Cold War era) level of military preparedness.  For decades, it was US strategic doctrine to be able to fight two full war theatres, along with one or two, or three small conflicts all at the same time.

Far from calling for war, it simply is calling for a return to that level of military capability.

But it sounds so much more alarming to say "the neocons want a 3-4 front war".  An emotional appeal to those already convinced of the "evilness of 'neocons'" and Bush.  In other words, he is using fear to cloud your mind, and get you to agree to his arguments that any clear minded, intelligent person wouldn't.

Manipulation.

   Sixth we have Bush's Executive Order outlawing war protest

   This EO is written so generally, that it essentially kills the 5th Amendment

Ok, here is the full EO: Blocking Property of Certain Persons Who Threaten Stabilization Efforts in Iraq (for those few of you who actually want to make your own minds up).

Here are excerpts from the article he relies on to make the claim that it "outlaws" war protest:

   Bush Outlaws All War Protest In United States

   According to Russian legal experts,  the greatest concern to the American people are the underlying provisions of this new law, and which, they state, are written 'so broadly' as to outlaw all forms of protest against the war. These provisions state:

   ...

   To the subsection of this new US law, according to these legal experts, that says "...the making of any contribution or provision of funds, goods, or services by, to, or for the benefit...", the insertion of the word 'services' has broad, and catastrophic, consequences for the American people in that any act deemed by their government to be against the Iraqi war is, in fact, supporting the 'enemy' and therefore threatens the 'stabilization of Iraq'.

   In an even greater affront to the American people are the provisions of a law called The Patriot Act, and that should they run afoul of this new law they are forbidden to allow anyone to know about it, and as we can read as reported by the Seattle Times News Service:

   ...

   It is interesting to note, too, that this is not the first time that the United States has unleashed the brutal power of their government against its citizens to further their war aims and stifle domestic dissent,

   Today, as the United States faces an imminent economic collapse, while at the same time its war bill has reached the staggering amount of $648 billion, one of the last freedoms the American people have had to protest their leaders actions against them, and other peoples in the World, has now been taken away from them, the freedom to speak and write in opposition to what is being done to them.  [emphasis added]

If you want to know anything about the crediblity of the site this comes from, just glance over the hompage: http://rense.com/

Again, he is using a manipulation tactic commonly used in propaganda - generating fear in order to cloud the mind, and cause a stampede to go the way the propagandists wishs.

Fear mongering.  Manipulation.

And you guys claim Bush does this?

FirmKY


Fear mongering?  Idoicy?

Since where is there a provision in the constitution for the president to "write law"?   Where is your outrage?  Why are you not speaking out against this unconstitutional consolidation of power?

While executive orders themselves have the authority of law, supporters of this process hold that the power to issue such orders is not the same as the power to make new laws. As shall be demonstrated, that is a point of debate; surely, the ability of the executive branch to issue executive orders and to interpret law – and to influence the courts along the way – tells us that we are close to having an all-powerful and all-encompassing branch of government that ultimately is not accountable to anyone. That certainly was not the intent of those who framed the Constitution when they created the office of president of the United States.
http://www.lewrockwell.com/anderson/anderson184.html

Oh yeh speaking of idiocy......

quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne
quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY
quote:

ORIGINAL: CuriousLord

Watch out, Real.. you're getting close to the Truth.. something might have to be done about you.. ..keep your mouth shut, unless you want to be a mindless puppet of the state..


hehe ... don't you realize, Curious, that what R0 truly is, is a stalking horse for the Illuminati?

He posts all this true stuff, so that the true rulers of the world can identify possible dangerous people who have come to know the truth.

Once they are identified, then they'll be whisked away by the Black Helicopters, and either placed in the UN compound in Kansas for medical experiments in mind-control, or simply "disappeared" if they cause too much of a hassle to our true lords and masters.

FirmKY



FROM:
The National Security Archive
Gelman Library, The George Washington University
2130 H Street, N.W., Suite 701
Washington, D.C. 20037
Phone: edited out
Fax: edited out

List of MKULTRA Unclassified Documents
(including subprojects)

This information was transcribed from faxes and brochures which are available from the National Security Archive.

Please note that the documents listed are only those requested by John Marks for research purposes. Some of the information in the released documents has been verified, other information has not. Also please note that there have been some transciption errors.

The National Security Archive is a non-governmental research institute and library that collects and publishes declassified documents obtained through the U.S. Freedom of Information Act, a public interest law firm defending and expanding public access to government information through the FOIA, and an indexer and publisher of the documents in books, microfische, and electronic formats.

The National Security Archive was founded in 1985 by a group of journalists and scholars who had obtained documentation under the FOIA and sought a centralized repository for these materials. Over the past twelve years, the Archive has become the world's largest non-governmental library of declassified documents.

This is the inventory list of donated materials in the National Security Archive's collection, from John Marks' FOIA request results which he used to do research for his book The Search For The Manchurian Candidate: The CIA and Mind Control, The Secret History of the Behavioral Sciences. (1979) W. W. Norton, published as Norton paperback in 1991, ISBN 0-393-30794-8).


INVENTORY: CIA Behavior Experiments Collection (John Marks Donation)
Date Range: 1940s-1970s



Box #1 (OF 12 BOXES) - Artichoke Documents--MKULTRA DOCS 1-57

Burch, Dr. Neil/LSD and the Air Force: Smithsonian: Index and Institutional Notifications
Subproject 1: MKULTRA: Plants Isolation and Characterization of Rivea Corymbosa
Subproject 2: MKULTRA: Drugs
Subproject 3: MKULTRA: Testing
Subproject 4: MKULTRA: Mulholland's Manual
Subproject 5a: MKULTRA
Subproject 5b: MKULTRA: Denver University Hypnosis
Subproject 6: MKULTRA: Testing of Plants by HEF
Subproject 7: MKULTRA: Funding; ONR Probably Abramson
Subproject 8: MKULTRA: Boston Psychopathic Hospital
Subproject 9: MKULTRA: Depressants, Schizophrenics, Alcoholics
Subproject 10: MKULTRA: Personality Assessment
Subproject 11: MKULTRA: Botanicals Popkin (Documents and articles on Luis Angel Castillo)
Subproject 12: MKULTRA: Financial Records
Subproject 13: MKULTRA: CIA Support to Fort Detrick
Subproject 14: MKULTRA: Paying Bureau of Narcotics for White
Subproject 15: MKULTRA: Magic Support; Mulholland Supplement
Subproject 16: MKULTRA: Testing Apartment Rental
Subproject 17: MKULTRA: LSD Studies of [excised] University
Subproject 19: MKULTRA: Magic Manual
Subproject 20: MKULTRA: Synthesis Derivative of Yohimbine Hydrochloride
Subproject 21: MKULTRA: Defector Study: originally Drug Study
Subproject 22: MKULTRA: William Cook and Co. Research: Amanita Muscaria, Rivea Corymbosa
Subproject 26: MKULTRA: Pfeiffer, Finances
Subproject 27: MKULTRA: ONR Funding, LSD Research
Subproject 28: MKULTRA: Pfeiffer
Subproject 30: MKULTRA: Fort Detrick (1)
Subproject 30: MKULTRA: Fort Detrick (2)
Subproject 30: MKULTRA: Fort Detrick (3)
Subproject 31: MKULTRA: Manufacture of Drugs by Pellow Wease Chemical Co.
Subproject 32: MKULTRA: Collection of Plants
Subproject 33: MKULTRA: Collection of 400 for SUBPR #27


The ultra list of projects that you think is so hilarious go on for pages more...

We have an old saying.  Talk is cheap.  Put your site where your ,mouth is, since you feel you are the reigning expert on the subject i am sure you have mounds of (MK) DATA to back up your laughter but dont let anything as insignificant as facts blur your vision of reality.   I already proved the existance of the illuminati, maybe you missed it?  Maybe you would like to give a rational explantion for the nearly 120 people that were met with a mysterious and untimely death within 1 year of the kennedy assasination?

So do elaborate on that and by all means educate us where in the constitution the president has the authority to write law or that which is indistinguishable from or acted upon as law?

Then when you cannot find it since it does not exist, do elaborate why we should NOT be FEARFUL of a government out of control and why you take the position and identify being fearful of the same runaway government and those who would bring it to the attention of this board as idiocy.    It wouldnt have anythjing to do with letting facts get in the way  of course.


quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY
quote:

ORIGINAL: SugarMyChurro
Everybody is selling something.

Anyone that still defends Bush is just shoveling shit, FirmhandKY. The only question is: do you work for free?


Who's defending Bush?

I'm simply against intellectual garbage.

Which the article's author (and you, apparently) wallow in.

FirmKY


cough!

In a word YOU are defending staus quo and that includes bush...  To state the blindingly obvious


quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY
quote:

ORIGINAL: SugarMyChurro
I don't really know who this Estanislao Carter guy is. This is the first I've seen of his commentary.

Occam's razor (!) says he is just an author trying to sell his books:  http://www.lulu.com/ealchemy

In other words, all his alarmist manipulation could likely be classified as marketing.

FirmKY


Yeh baby that locks it up!!!!  Lets use occams razor and get on the stoopid wagon, while complex thinkers, (like in the think tanks), who are capable of more than one chess move bend us over and play drop the soap bonzia LOLOL

YUP EVERYONE BUT THE GOVERNMENT is a fraud with an agenda.....





_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to FirmhandKY)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: Bush is strategically setting the board for an Amer... - 7/23/2007 9:29:09 AM   
FirmhandKY


Posts: 8948
Joined: 9/21/2004
Status: offline
Since where is there a provision in the constitution for the president to "write law"?   Where is your outrage?  Why are you not speaking out against this unconstitutional consolidation of power?


Executive Orders:

What is an Executive Order?

Executive Orders (EOs) are legally binding orders given by the President, acting as the head of the Executive Branch, to Federal Administrative Agencies. Executive Orders are generally used to direct federal agencies and officials in their execution of congressionally established laws or policies.

...

Executive Orders do not require Congressional approval to take effect but they have the same legal weight as laws passed by Congress. The President's source of authority to issue Executive Orders can be found in the Article II, Section 1 of the Constitution which grants to the President the "executive Power." Section 3 of Article II further directs the President to "take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed." To implement or execute the laws of the land, Presidents give direction and guidance to Executive Branch agencies and departments, often in the form of Executive Orders.

Other sources of information about EO's:

The Use and Abuse of Executive Orders and Other Presidential Directives

Executive order (United States)


MKULTRA:

What programs of government mind control are in current use, which came from the MKULTRA research?


Government:

Then when you cannot find it since it does not exist

Proving a negative is impossible.  However, the "fear" of government is a good thing.  My political and personal philosophy sees government as a necessary evil that must be tolerated - barely.


"intellectual garbage":


It appears to you (and some others) that I'm defending Bush, when in actuality I'm simply trying to squelch bad thinking, regardless of it's source, and who it may "support". 

Reality is a much solider base to affect change in society and political institutions, rather than fantasy and wishful thinking.

FirmKY

_____________________________

Some people are just idiots.

(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: Bush is strategically setting the board for an Amer... - 7/23/2007 9:37:18 AM   
Sinergy


Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY
 
Executive Orders are generally used to direct federal agencies and officials in their execution of congressionally established laws or policies.

 
Thank you for posting this, FirmKY.
 
I would like to draw special attention to the phrases "directing federal agencies" and "execution of congressionally established laws or policies."
 
AnencephalyBoy is directing federal agencies (e.g. the DOD, the FBI) to engage in illegal (by laws of Congress) activities.
 
For example:
 
Having the FBI obtain cell phone records from phone companies without a search warrant obtained by the office of the judiciary.
 
Establishing the use of torture against "enemy combatants" in violation of Miranda rights.  The suspension of habeas corpus.  Etc.
 
I agree that incorrect thinking needs to be squelched whenever possible, and your own sources prove that AnencephalyBoy is attempting to circumvent both the spirit and the letter of Constitutional Law.
 
Sinergy
 
 


_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle


(in reply to FirmhandKY)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: Bush is strategically setting the board for an Amer... - 7/23/2007 10:52:40 AM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY


Since where is there a provision in the constitution for the president to "write law"?   Where is your outrage?  Why are you not speaking out against this unconstitutional consolidation of power?


Executive Orders:

What is an Executive Order?

Executive Orders (EOs) are legally binding orders given by the President, acting as the head of the Executive Branch, to Federal Administrative Agencies. Executive Orders are generally used to direct federal agencies and officials in their execution of congressionally established laws or policies.

...

Executive Orders do not require Congressional approval to take effect but they have the same legal weight as laws passed by Congress. The President's source of authority to issue Executive Orders can be found in the Article II, Section 1 of the Constitution which grants to the President the "executive Power." Section 3 of Article II further directs the President to "take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed." To implement or execute the laws of the land, Presidents give direction and guidance to Executive Branch agencies and departments, often in the form of Executive Orders.

Other sources of information about EO's:

The Use and Abuse of Executive Orders and Other Presidential Directives

Executive order (United States)


MKULTRA:

What programs of government mind control are in current use, which came from the MKULTRA research?


Government:

Then when you cannot find it since it does not exist

Proving a negative is impossible.  However, the "fear" of government is a good thing.  My political and personal philosophy sees government as a necessary evil that must be tolerated - barely.


"intellectual garbage":


It appears to you (and some others) that I'm defending Bush, when in actuality I'm simply trying to squelch bad thinking, regardless of it's source, and who it may "support". 

Reality is a much solider base to affect change in society and political institutions, rather than fantasy and wishful thinking.

FirmKY



ah huh......................

direct from your wesite above

Executive Orders (EOs) are legally binding orders given by the President, acting as the head of the Executive Branch, to Federal Administrative Agencies. Executive Orders are generally used to direct federal agencies and officials in their execution of congressionally established laws or policies. However, in many instances they have been used to guide agencies in directions contrary to congressional intent. 


Hopefully that will help you understand the idiocy of everyone else out here.

Your post do not reflect your stated philosophy on government.  To the contrary your posts reflect maintaining the status quo.  Since it is done in text i suppose i cannot label it double-think so i will label it double-write. a quick way to lose your credibility.

The government has been and is working on elctromagnetic mind control and other related weapons for years there is nothing new about that.  whether it came from mk ultra or otherwise is moot to the centeral point i was making.  Which was your little comedy act over a very serious threat to the securiity of the us citizenry of this country. please do not build strawmen for me to defend.

i have not read all of this so i do not know the bulk of its content so i may not agree with everything said withhin it:
"It's undeniable that the technology exists," Girard says, "but if you go to the police and say, 'I'm hearing voices,' they're going to lock you up for psychiatric evaluation."
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/01/10/AR2007011001399.html

In the end only a complete fool would laugh at and discard mind control as trivial and nothing to be concerend about.   Some things simply do not need proof.   The obvious uses and benefits of mind control to ANYONE or GROUP with such a device be it the elite to governments as well as corporations is worth far beyond its weight in platinum.  Its worth the whole fucking world at large.

Rest assured with our government out of control which is my interpretation of the OP and the requirement of the FOIA which is repugnant to what the framers of the constitution as well as the constitution of this land represents you can bet your sweet ass it is classified and out of reach to public scrutiny.   We have a secret government and it is no secret.

Here you go from your favorite rense.com
When it was formed in 1947, the CIA was forbidden to have any domestic police or internal security powers. In short, it was authorized only to operate 'overseas'. From the very start MK-ULTRA staff broke this Congressional stipulation and began testing on unwitting American citizens.   (and canadians)

Precisely how extensive illegal testing became will never be known. Richard Helms, CIA Director and chief architect of the program, ordered the destruction of all MK-ULTRA records shortly before leaving office in 1973. Despite these precautions some documents were misfiled and came to light in the late 1970's. They laid bare the spy

You would have us all believe this is all hogwash fear mongering and a bunch of tin hat conspiracy while in your arrogance this and other government atrocities are going on right under your nose.

In 1994, 77 of the mostly unwitting Canadian patients were awarded $100,000 each from the federal government but only those who suffered "total depatterning" -- were rendered to a childlike state. More than 250 others were denied compensation because their treatment was less intense and had fewer long-term effects. In 2004, a federal appeal court overruled that decision and awarded a former patient the $100,000. "There are many, many former patients of Dr. Cameron who applied for the $100,000 whose applications were denied on the same basis . . . because they misapplied the decree," Alan Stein, Ms. Huard's lawyer, said. The federal appeal court's decision means hundreds of other former patients should also have received compensation, he said. "Even though [Ms. Huard] might not have had the number of electroshock treatments as other applicants, she was subject to psychic driving, she was given experimental drugs and she had electroshock treatments," Mr. Stein said. Government lawyers have argued that too much time has passed for patients to appeal a federal panel decision.
http://www.orwelltoday.com/ciabrainwashing.shtml

FUCK THAT PAY THEM!!!!

You got the balls to go on record and say IT IS NOT HAPPENING TODAY in good old fashion plain language instead of by your comedy act and innuendo?


i find your doublethink approach to some of the most important issues we face today disturbing to say the least.



< Message edited by Real0ne -- 7/23/2007 10:53:36 AM >

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to FirmhandKY)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: Bush is strategically setting the board for an Amer... - 7/23/2007 11:24:38 AM   
FirmhandKY


Posts: 8948
Joined: 9/21/2004
Status: offline 		Executive Orders:

You tried to make the claim that Executive Orders were, by definition, unconstitutional.  I showed that they are constitutional.

Now you are saying that Bush has overstepped his boundaries by this specific EO.  EO's can be gutted, and overturned by the same legal process as bad laws, as well as by Congress, or withdrawn due to public pressure.

It's part of our system, just as the way that legally enacted laws of Congress have been sometimes been overturned by the Supreme Court when challenged.

Just because you don't like, or don't agree with an EO, doesn't make it automatically "illegal", my friend.

Anything has the possibility of being abused. That's why we have a system of checks-and-balances.



Mind Control:

Attempts at "mind control" have been going on since before recorded history.

Such attempts currently include marketing, advertising, political ideological indoctrination, religious upbringing, child rearing, network news, military service training, fraternity and sorority pledging, a whole host of psychological techniques and methods ... and posts on CM.

Am I concerned?

Not really.

FirmKY


_____________________________

Some people are just idiots.

(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: Bush is strategically setting the board for an Amer... - 7/23/2007 12:24:16 PM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY

Executive Orders:

You tried to make the claim that Executive Orders were, by definition, unconstitutional.  I showed that they are constitutional.

Now you are saying that Bush has overstepped his boundaries by this specific EO.  EO's can be gutted, and overturned by the same legal process as bad laws, as well as by Congress, or withdrawn due to public pressure.

It's part of our system, just as the way that legally enacted laws of Congress have been sometimes been overturned by the Supreme Court when challenged.

Just because you don't like, or don't agree with an EO, doesn't make it automatically "illegal", my friend.

Anything has the possibility of being abused. That's why we have a system of checks-and-balances.



Mind Control:

Attempts at "mind control" have been going on since before recorded history.

Such attempts currently include marketing, advertising, political ideological indoctrination, religious upbringing, child rearing, network news, military service training, fraternity and sorority pledging, a whole host of psychological techniques and methods ... and posts on CM.

Am I concerned?

Not really.

FirmKY



Oh yeh there it is!  Lets make this "my attack on bush" now...   you do not like it when people do this to you why do it to me?  i am saying we are in an out of control government.   EO's as they are being used by the out of control government are not constitutional.

I stand by what i said.  The constitution does not have provisions for president to "make"  or create law. Regardless if other branches of government have the authority to over rule it. 

If you care to read my post it seems those "attempts" as you put it were pretty damned effective aye?  Every example you mentioned are in our faces, and at least people have a fighting chance of "getting it" where as subliminal or by electromagnetic devices one is totally unaware, pretty much the same as the government lying to us and we are unaware of what is going on.

Its seems the 9th district court was concerned enough to award them all a legal win against the cia but you are not cncerned.

your posts do not reflect your claimed political convictions.



_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to FirmhandKY)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: Bush is strategically setting the board for an Amer... - 7/23/2007 12:47:16 PM   
FirmhandKY


Posts: 8948
Joined: 9/21/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

Oh yeh there it is!  Lets make this "my attack on bush" now...   you do not like it when people do this to you why do it to me?

This makes no sense.  Where have I said anything about your "attack on Bush"?


quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

i am saying we are in an out of control government.   EO's as they are being used by the out of control government are not constitutional.

I stand by what i said.  The constitution does not have provisions for president to "make"  or create law. Regardless if other branches of government have the authority to over rule it. 

EO's don't (or aren't suppose to) create "laws".  They clarify executive agencies priorities, methods and focuses on enforcing the laws of Congress.  They aren't laws, but have the "force of law"


quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

If you care to read my post it seems those "attempts" as you put it were pretty damned effective aye?  Every example you mentioned are in our faces, and at least people have a fighting chance of "getting it" where as subliminal or by electromagnetic devices one is totally unaware, pretty much the same as the government lying to us and we are unaware of what is going on.

The existence of actual, effective subliminal and electromagnetic mind control devices are fantasies.  Period.


quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

Its seems the 9th district court was concerned enough to award them all a legal win against the cia but you are not cncerned.

They were awarded damages for torts to their person.  What is your point?  Destroying someone emotionally and psychologically has been done from time immemorial, and is done more by individuals against individuals than by any government.

An example of "mind control" like this is the battered and beaten wife (vanilla flavor ) who can't seem to leave her abuser, or conceive of a life without him.  This is much more common than your government conspiracy mind control crap.


quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

your posts do not reflect your claimed political convictions.

Yes they do.  Completely.

My beliefs simply don't including buying into to your paranoiac fantasies.

FirmKY


_____________________________

Some people are just idiots.

(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: Bush is strategically setting the board for an Amer... - 7/23/2007 1:01:03 PM   
submittous


Posts: 345
Joined: 6/12/2004
Status: offline 		I'm new here, FirmhandKY is a spoof, right?

As for 30 million pot gutted "militia men" surrounding DC and forcing the government to be attentive to the public, if that fantasy was ever going to happen this administration would have been the one to cause it...  I'm betting no way.

As for the OP, using Bush and strategy in the same sentence verges on an oxymoron.

just saying...

Bill

_____________________________

"If you are lucky enough to find a way of life you love, you have to find the courage to live it." John Irving

(in reply to FirmhandKY)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: Bush is strategically setting the board for an Amer... - 7/23/2007 1:46:45 PM   
FirmhandKY


Posts: 8948
Joined: 9/21/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: submittous

I'm new here, FirmhandKY is a spoof, right?


Hi Bill.  Welcome to the OTF.  Gets mighty interesting here, at times.

So ... what favorite "cherished belief" have you got that I've stepped on already?

Come on ... spit it out!  I'll pick it up, and finish roasting it for ya. 

FirmKY


_____________________________

Some people are just idiots.

(in reply to submittous)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: Bush is strategically setting the board for an Amer... - 7/23/2007 2:36:00 PM   
Alumbrado


Posts: 5560
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: submittous

I'm new here, FirmhandKY is a spoof, right?



He is my sock puppet. 
(And yes, I now know that there is no 'd' in 'Hanky'... mistakes happen, OK?)

(in reply to submittous)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: Bush is strategically setting the board for an Amer... - 7/23/2007 2:55:24 PM   
FirmhandKY


Posts: 8948
Joined: 9/21/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Alumbrado

quote:

ORIGINAL: submittous

I'm new here, FirmhandKY is a spoof, right?



He is my sock puppet. 

(And yes, I now know that there is no 'd' in 'Hanky'... mistakes happen, OK?)


oooooohhhhhh .... I like sock puppets!   And owning certain "boxes" ...

Firmhand_KY <--- New Sig   

edited to add:

Hell ... better yet ...

FirmHand.

nahhh ... screw it ....

Firm.


< Message edited by FirmhandKY -- 7/23/2007 2:59:59 PM >

_____________________________

Some people are just idiots.

(in reply to Alumbrado)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Bush is strategically setting the board for an Amer... - 7/23/2007 3:02:58 PM   
losttreasure


Posts: 875
Joined: 12/17/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Alumbrado

quote:

ORIGINAL: submittous

I'm new here, FirmhandKY is a spoof, right?



He is my sock puppet. 
(And yes, I now know that there is no 'd' in 'Hanky'... mistakes happen, OK?)


lol...

Early on in our relationship I teased him by confessing that every time I saw his name on the forums I would read it as "firm hanky", even though I knew it was "firmhand ky".  Of course, the first time we met, he replaced my dyslexic impression with one more fitting. 

(I  assure you all... he is no ones sock puppet. )

(in reply to Alumbrado)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: Bush is strategically setting the board for an Amer... - 7/23/2007 3:20:51 PM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: submittous

As for 30 million pot gutted "militia men" surrounding DC and forcing the government to be attentive to the public, if that fantasy was ever going to happen this administration would have been the one to cause it...  I'm betting no way.






It`s a fantasy,but a big one ,in the "militia" movement.A paradox w/ bush,being that so much of the movement votes republican,IMO.

It won`t happen,god forbid.Just that people are concerned that it could,is telling.Who would`ve thought?

However(Popeye),there are 80+ major battles to fight(and lose),before we get to the point of surrounding DC w/ armed men.These fights are not fought with guns,but rather w/ votes,letters to congress,calls to congress,emails,etc,to your congress people,marches and political action.I hope the Popeyes of the world ,do not sit out those important fights.There are a few being fought right now, as we write.
I`m sure Popeye votes and all,I wasn`t talk`n about him personally.

As an aside,who`s gonna lead the hordes of pot-bellied men,anyway? Will they be megalomaniacs,like what we have now? And who`s gonna protect us from them?

Peace


< Message edited by Owner59 -- 7/23/2007 3:24:33 PM >

(in reply to submittous)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: Bush is strategically setting the board for an Amer... - 7/23/2007 5:09:13 PM   
submittous


Posts: 345
Joined: 6/12/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY

quote:

ORIGINAL: submittous

I'm new here, FirmhandKY is a spoof, right?


Hi Bill.  Welcome to the OTF.  Gets mighty interesting here, at times.

So ... what favorite "cherished belief" have you got that I've stepped on already?

Come on ... spit it out!  I'll pick it up, and finish roasting it for ya. 

FirmKY



Thanks for the welcome, we are refugees from the alt.com take over of Bondage.com... Not new to forums but really new to the ones here.

I have no "cherished beliefs" but am a reformed Republican Viet Nam vet who is opposed to most wars and our current folly in Iraq in particular. I hate the incompetence of this administration that is rapidly destroying the country that I have loved.

I'm sure we'll disagree on occasion...

Bill

_____________________________

"If you are lucky enough to find a way of life you love, you have to find the courage to live it." John Irving

(in reply to FirmhandKY)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: Bush is strategically setting the board for an Amer... - 7/23/2007 5:10:58 PM   
submittous


Posts: 345
Joined: 6/12/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Alumbrado

quote:

ORIGINAL: submittous

I'm new here, FirmhandKY is a spoof, right?



He is my sock puppet. 
(And yes, I now know that there is no 'd' in 'Hanky'... mistakes happen, OK?)


Nice sock......

_____________________________

"If you are lucky enough to find a way of life you love, you have to find the courage to live it." John Irving

(in reply to Alumbrado)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: Bush is strategically setting the board for an Amer... - 7/23/2007 5:37:44 PM   
Sinergy


Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline 		 
When some spoof-like sock puppet individuals post things which contradict the point they are trying to make, they often take two approaches.

1)  Go on the offensive against somebody else.

2)  Post a 15 page post taking some non sequiter (like computer modeling studies) and using it to try disprove a scientific study (like, for example, the loss of 35 cubic miles of ice mass in Antarctica as proven by satellites) posted in support of somebody else's argument.  When this is pointed out to him/her/it, see approach #1.

I am not sure it is an interesting or effective debate tactic, but I suppose it is a tactic.

Sinergy


_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle


(in reply to submittous)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: Bush is strategically setting the board for an Amer... - 7/23/2007 7:24:57 PM   
FirmhandKY


Posts: 8948
Joined: 9/21/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinergy


When some spoof-like sock puppet individuals post things which contradict the point they are trying to make, they often take two approaches.

1)  Go on the offensive against somebody else.

2)  Post a 15 page post taking some non sequiter (like computer modeling studies) and using it to try disprove a scientific study (like, for example, the loss of 35 cubic miles of ice mass in Antarctica as proven by satellites) posted in support of somebody else's argument.  When this is pointed out to him/her/it, see approach #1.

I am not sure it is an interesting or effective debate tactic, but I suppose it is a tactic.

Sinergy



Go have a 7 and 7, cinergy. 

Then you'll have someone - or something - that gives a crap about anything you have to say.

You endless and pointless sarcasms have worn thin.  And I suspect you don't have any other rhetorical weapons in your arsenal.

You still can't get over being wrong, which is why you post the "points' you do, above (otherwise, you'd post links to the threads you are referencing).

So ... bugger off, until you get sober, or sane.

Firm


_____________________________

Some people are just idiots.

(in reply to Sinergy)
Profile   Post #: 37
RE: Bush is strategically setting the board for an Amer... - 7/24/2007 12:13:18 PM   
Sinergy


Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY

So ... bugger off, until you get sober, or sane.

Firm



http://education.gsu.edu/spehar/FOCUS/EdPsy/misc/Fallacies.htm#hominem

This indicates an intellectual capitulation in a debate where the person employing abusive attacks is unable to attack the argument and endeavors to attack the other person. 

Presumably, in this instance, the abusive one is attempting to start a name calling argument.  I am not sure how well it is working out for him/her/it.

Sinergy

edited to change e to a


< Message edited by Sinergy -- 7/24/2007 12:14:08 PM >

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle


(in reply to FirmhandKY)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: Bush is strategically setting the board for an Amer... - 7/24/2007 12:18:53 PM   
SugarMyChurro


Posts: 1912
Joined: 4/26/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY
So ... bugger off...


Ah, the man in the glass house...

Where's your mommy now, FirmhandKY?





(in reply to FirmhandKY)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: Bush is strategically setting the board for an Amer... - 7/24/2007 1:01:01 PM   
Sinergy


Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SugarMyChurro

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY
So ... bugger off...


Ah, the man in the glass house...

Where's your mommy now, FirmhandKY?



One of the things I have found in life is that people tend to try to use against other people the particular things which frighten them or apply to them the most.

A man who chooses a weapon to use against somebody picks the one they are most afraid of, for example.

Additionally, there is the following psychiatric definition.  While I have not laid hands on FirmKY, nor do I have the
needed credentials, I wanted to throw out my lay opinion for whatever it is worth.

http://www.abess.com/glossary.html
projection A defense mechanism, operating unconsciously, in which what is emotionally unacceptable in the self is unconsciously rejected and attributed (projected) to others.


In his post, he talks about 7 and 7 (a type of mixed drink using Seagrams 7 (bourbon?) and Seven-Up.) and drunken posting.  I dont think I have ever had bourbon, and I generally dont drink soft drinks apart from diet coke or pepsi.  He/she/it is from Kentucky, in the south, where Bourbon comes from.  I imagine 7 and 7 is popular there, although I could not say for sure.

Putting these two things together, one wonders whether his accusations of drunken postings are targetted correctly, or whether the application of one's opinions would be more appropriate applied to the poster making the accusations.

Just me, etc.

Sinergy

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle


(in reply to SugarMyChurro)
Profile   Post #: 40
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