I'm liking our new prime minister

I'm liking our new prime minister (Full Version)

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LadyEllen -> I'm liking our new prime minister (7/11/2007 11:06:41 AM)
Just reported on Channel 4 news here - our new PM Gordon Brown has scrapped the supercasino project! And on top of that, he's planning the massive increase in housebuilding that we need. And earlier this week he tampered with a few other policies of his predecessor that were less than agreeable to me. I wonder when he'll get around to Iraq......? And how long before the Murdoch press crucifies him? E

pahunkboy -> RE: I'm liking our new prime minister (7/11/2007 11:14:01 AM)
Lady E, I have been observing your new prime minister. Is he moderate? conservative? liberal??? he isnt sexy like Blair is. i was impressed to see him interviewed on a BUS!! a rep here take a bus??? NEVER!!!!!! we might need our friends in the UK and EU- to bail our azz out........ [parish the thought] books not bombs!!

NorthernGent -> RE: I'm liking our new prime minister (7/11/2007 11:55:03 AM)
'Thought you middle class types were up in the arms at the thought of a Scottish PM? 'Fickle lot, or what? "Our Prime Minister" Ha! I'll give it 6 months and it'll be "that Scottish wanker....."

LadyEllen -> RE: I'm liking our new prime minister (7/11/2007 12:23:06 PM)
Wondering whether "middle class" is at least as meaningless and irrelevant as "PC brigade"....... You know? I couldnt care less who it was that was PM as long as they serve the needs of the country, which is the people - which naturally excludes the Tories. The Labour Party isnt my cup of tea NG, but even so I'll say so if their PM does what I think is right, and equally say so otherwise too. E

LadyEllen -> RE: I'm liking our new prime minister (7/11/2007 12:32:30 PM)
Hi PAH Mr Brown is old Labour (real Labour) - a socialist basically, but he's also operating in a climate where socialism isnt popular by virtue of Murdoch's right wing press - which is why Blair et al came up with New Labour (soft Conservatism, named "the third way" as a mix of socialist policies with Thatcherite). He also has to operate with the legacy left from the Blair years - and slowly it seems he is already unravelling the less tasteful parts of that. He also strikes me as very much the disciplined religious minister's son made good, and one should not ignore that he has been compared to comrade Stalin in his methods of working and described as dour, humourless etc. But what the heck, if he keeps doing what he's doing, its all good. E

popeye1250 -> RE: I'm liking our new prime minister (7/11/2007 12:47:42 PM)
Isn't Scotland a seperate country now with their own flag and all that stuff?

Aneirin -> RE: I'm liking our new prime minister (7/11/2007 12:55:15 PM)
I agree with you Lady Ellen,what is in power now,despite my beliefs,I have some hope for this new PM,a case of wait and see.Promises have been made,I await delivery.I have to admit it sounds good so far,but I will wait and see if those words become reality.Promises were made in the past by his predecessor,but what came if it did was largely unpalatable. I don't care what ethnicity is PM,be they English,Scots,Wesh,Irish or other,what does matter is that they serve the country,not the country serve their ego. I much prefer a PM who just does his job,the razamatazz I can do without.

Raechard -> RE: I'm liking our new prime minister (7/11/2007 12:56:01 PM)
All I want him to address is the West Lothiam question. I also don’t like the way he gulps in air like a goldfish at the end of every sentence he speaks but given the choice of him or Cameron I’d pick him.

philosophy -> RE: I'm liking our new prime minister (7/11/2007 1:42:43 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: popeye1250 Isn't Scotland a seperate country now with their own flag and all that stuff? ...not entirely.......while it has a flag, a parliament and a vociferous independence party it isn't in control of macro economic policy or defence policy. If each state in the USA is a seperate country then Scotland is a seperate country.A bit like Wales really..........(sighs and waits for LE to say something anti-welsh)

LadyEllen -> RE: I'm liking our new prime minister (7/11/2007 1:43:15 PM)
Hi Popeye Its a strange situation with Scotland and Wales now. The UK still consists of England, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland, but the latter three have their own parliaments with various powers that are devolved from the main UK government - the Scots situation being the most devolved. The issue arises in that Scottish, Welsh and N Irish MPs also sit in the UK parliament and are able to vote on matters affecting England but not affecting their home countries because those matters are devolved to their home parliaments. This is a fudge which is barely acceptable, when one has decisions such as charging university students at English universities put through into law because of Scottish and Welsh MPs votes, when students in Scotland and Wales get no charge or heavy subsidy on account of decisions by the Scots and Welsh parliaments. Same thing with medical prescription costs. Meanwhile, English MPs have no presence or power whatever in the Scots and Welsh parliaments. E

LadyEllen -> RE: I'm liking our new prime minister (7/11/2007 1:45:39 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: philosophy ..........(sighs and waits for LE to say something anti-welsh) Me? As if! I mean, the Welsh might all be funny looking types with a speech impediment, but they sure have their politics worked out with all this devolution stuff. E edited to add - you will let me know if get Canadian citizenship wont you? I mean, Welsh and Canadian? I just wont be able to resist........! (only joking)

philosophy -> RE: I'm liking our new prime minister (7/11/2007 1:48:39 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LadyEllen Hi Popeye Its a strange situation with Scotland and Wales now. The UK still consists of England, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland, but the latter three have their own parliaments with various powers that are devolved from the main UK government - the Scots situation being the most devolved. The issue arises in that Scottish, Welsh and N Irish MPs also sit in the UK parliament and are able to vote on matters affecting England but not affecting their home countries because those matters are devolved to their home parliaments. This is a fudge which is barely acceptable, when one has decisions such as charging university students at English universities put through into law because of Scottish and Welsh MPs votes, when students in Scotland and Wales get no charge or heavy subsidy on account of decisions by the Scots and Welsh parliaments. Same thing with medical prescription costs. Meanwhile, English MPs have no presence or power whatever in the Scots and Welsh parliaments. E .....mind you, this problem doesn't lie entirely with the politicians. If people in England wanted a seperate parliament they'd vote for one. Which is something that, when given the opportunity, they've so far failed to do.

LadyEllen -> RE: I'm liking our new prime minister (7/11/2007 1:54:05 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: philosophy .....mind you, this problem doesn't lie entirely with the politicians. If people in England wanted a seperate parliament they'd vote for one. Which is something that, when given the opportunity, they've so far failed to do. Youre right - the problem with the UK as a whole is that its so very partisan when it comes to political majorities in elections. England votes mainly Conservative, Scotland (until lately) Labour and so on. England will never get its own parliament for this reason alone - Tory types want the Union, and lets face it Scotland and Wales only got a devolution vote as a sop to their Labour parties anyway. The other issue is that whilst its perfectly OK to be a Welsh nationalist or Scottish nationalist, being an English nationalist makes one a nazi. But overall, the Labour party knows too well that England being separated would keep them out of power here forever - they need the Scottish and Welsh labour vote to acquire UK national power. E

philosophy -> RE: I'm liking our new prime minister (7/11/2007 1:57:55 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LadyEllen The other issue is that whilst its perfectly OK to be a Welsh nationalist or Scottish nationalist, being an English nationalist makes one a nazi. ......thing is, i don't think English nationalism has really worked itself out. Once we discount those who merely want out of the EU and those who want to retain the union at all costs, i'm not sure there's anyone left who calls themself an English Nationalist. The nationalist movements in the Celtic countries has evolved over decades, if not centuries......English nationalism may well take as long to identify itself.

LadyEllen -> RE: I'm liking our new prime minister (7/11/2007 2:02:27 PM)
Yep, I think the problem is that we are perceived as the bad guys you know? Whilst the Welsh have a legitimate claim to freedom to work towards - having been conquered (by the Normans, not the English I'll add), and see us as the enemy and thereby define themselves as nationalists, and the Scots by alike means due to a misunderstanding of what the Union was about (they were bankrupt and needed us to bail them out), the English are the bad guys with no such struggle to define themselves by. E

NorthernGent -> RE: I'm liking our new prime minister (7/11/2007 2:05:57 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LadyEllen Wondering whether "middle class" is at least as meaningless and irrelevant as "PC brigade"....... Now that is a fair enough response. I'd still say no, however, because middle class can be measured in income and value system, unlike the mythical PC brigade. Point taken, though. quote: ORIGINAL: LadyEllen You know? I couldnt care less who it was that was PM as long as they serve the needs of the country, which is the people - which naturally excludes the Tories. The Labour Party isnt my cup of tea NG, but even so I'll say so if their PM does what I think is right, and equally say so otherwise too. E Serving the average man on the street is a distant dream. I suppose there are shades of taking the piss, though. Brown was in the cabinet that voted for Iraq and kept silent on Southern Lebanon. I'm far from convinced it'll be anything more than passing on the baton.

NorthernGent -> RE: I'm liking our new prime minister (7/11/2007 2:08:23 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: popeye1250 Isn't Scotland a seperate country now with their own flag and all that stuff? Always was a separate country. Some of the proudest people you'll ever wish to meet, and they've punched well above their weight for the size of the population. Take a moment to look back at what the Scots have given the world, then take a look at the population size - you'll be amazed.

NorthernGent -> RE: I'm liking our new prime minister (7/11/2007 2:14:50 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: philosophy The nationalist movements in the Celtic countries has evolved over decades, if not centuries......English nationalism may well take as long to identify itself. The nationalist movements in the "celtic" countries largely came about in the 18th century when the Irish and Scottish were attempting to distance themselves from England. In fact, this notion of "celtic" was imagined in that period to give themselves a sense of identity distinct from the English. Recent studies have shown that the Irish and Scottish are no more Celtic than the English, and if there is one nation with a disproportionate amount of Celtic ancestry it is Wales. There you go Philosophy, all this time and the celtic thing was bollocks!

seeksfemslave -> RE: I'm liking our new prime minister (7/11/2007 2:38:10 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LadyEllen Hi PAH Mr Brown is old Labour (real Labour) - a socialist basically, but he's also operating in a climate where socialism isnt popular by virtue of Murdoch's right wing press - which is why Blair et al came up with New Labour (soft Conservatism, named "the third way" as a mix of socialist policies with Thatcherite).E LadyE: perleese. You sound like NG in drag ! Socialism isn't popular because when it was tried it didn't work. See the steel industry, car industry, coal industry and almost any industry you can think of except people industry on the public payroll. Give most a subsidy and and tax the rest till the pips squeek and watch the economy spiral down to oblivion.

NorthernGent -> RE: I'm liking our new prime minister (7/11/2007 2:43:04 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: seeksfemslave LadyE: perleese. You sound like NG in drag ! Don't know what you're on about. As you're a character I created, by your logic you're NG in drag, too. Problem with you is you're like Frankenstein...I created you and you've turned into a conservative monster with a BNP mind of your own.

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