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Parts of Campaign Finance Reform law ruled unconstituti... - 6/25/2007 11:06:59 AM   
cyberdude611


Posts: 2596
Joined: 5/7/2006
Status: offline 		One of the rare times you will see the ACLU and the NRA both applaud the same Supreme Court decision....

Senator John McCain's campaign finance reform law took a major hit in the US Supreme Court today.
The Justices today ruled 5-4 that the law goes too far and conflicts with the first amendment. Chief Justice John Roberts said in the decision, "Where the First Amendment is implicated, the tie always goes to the speaker, not the censor."

The law, passed by Congress and signed by President Bush 5 years ago (known frequently as "McCain-Feingold"), puts restrictions on campaign advertising and how much money entities are allowed to donate to candidates.
The court however did not remove all restrictions. Corporations, unions, and wealthy Americans are still capped under the law.

The ruling may have a major impact in the 2008 election, as organizations are now able to give more money to candidates, and advertising restrictions are lifted. It will also give groups like the ACLU or National Rifile Association more influence in the closing days of an election.

The dissenters were Souter, Breyer, Ginsberg, and Stevens.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070625/ap_on_el_pr/scotus_campaign_finance;_ylt=As6m4MIWefTJKQKuO8Fjor7MWM0F

< Message edited by cyberdude611 -- 6/25/2007 11:07:23 AM >
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RE: Parts of Campaign Finance Reform law ruled unconsti... - 6/25/2007 11:40:38 AM   
farglebargle


Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
Status: offline 		Lot of 5-4's from the court, eh?



_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to cyberdude611)
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RE: Parts of Campaign Finance Reform law ruled unconsti... - 6/25/2007 12:12:38 PM   
cyberdude611


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Joined: 5/7/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

Lot of 5-4's from the court, eh?




Been that way for most of the Rhenquist court as well. There is a pretty evident ideological divide on the court. Kennedy and O'Connor were the swing votes. O'Connor was replaced with Alito who is more conservative which explains why the court seems to be slightly more conservative this year. I think this is how it will be for quite some time...the conservative members are still reletively young while the liberal members are getting up in age. John Roberts is only in his 50's I believe. He could be the chief justice for 30-40 years.

I've been happy with Roberts so far. His decisions seem to be based pretty much on literal interpretation of the constitution and also common sense.

(in reply to farglebargle)
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RE: Parts of Campaign Finance Reform law ruled unconsti... - 6/25/2007 12:14:19 PM   
Lordandmaster


Posts: 10943
Joined: 6/22/2004
Status: offline 		Yeah.  This one actually went AGAINST the Administration though.  They didn't want groups like the ACLU to be able to launch ads under this ruling.

quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

Lot of 5-4's from the court, eh?

(in reply to farglebargle)
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RE: Parts of Campaign Finance Reform law ruled unconsti... - 6/25/2007 12:16:21 PM   
domiguy


Posts: 12952
Joined: 5/2/2006
Status: offline 		who really cares. As long as there are 527 groups...That can malign a candidate all to Hell, and then pay some sort of nominal fine....What difference does it really matter?

There is no longer any value placed on the words truth or honor..... just who has the most money and will go the lowest to win an election....527 groups are bullshit.

We need to get rid of the lobbyists...Since we live in a NASCAR nation perhaps it is time to develop some sort of restrictor plates which could be applied to our elections which would insure all of the candidates would be competing on a level playing field....I don't think the majority of Americans would argue with this type of an approach.



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RE: Parts of Campaign Finance Reform law ruled unconsti... - 6/25/2007 12:24:48 PM   
Lordandmaster


Posts: 10943
Joined: 6/22/2004
Status: offline 		I'd vote for restrictor plates on the ELECTORATE.

quote:

ORIGINAL: domiguy

We need to get rid of the lobbyists...Since we live in a NASCAR nation perhaps it is time to develop some sort of restrictor plates which could be applied to our elections which would insure all of the candidates would be competing on a level playing field....I don't think the majority of Americans would argue with this type of an approach.

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RE: Parts of Campaign Finance Reform law ruled unconsti... - 6/25/2007 12:28:34 PM   
farglebargle


Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: cyberdude611

quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

Lot of 5-4's from the court, eh?




Been that way for most of the Rhenquist court as well. There is a pretty evident ideological divide on the court. Kennedy and O'Connor were the swing votes. O'Connor was replaced with Alito who is more conservative which explains why the court seems to be slightly more conservative this year.


There's nothing "Conservative" about telling People who attend school they are Slaves who must obey Speech Restrictions.



_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

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RE: Parts of Campaign Finance Reform law ruled unconsti... - 6/25/2007 12:29:13 PM   
Lordandmaster


Posts: 10943
Joined: 6/22/2004
Status: offline 		A propos of those 5-4 votes, here's yet another one:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070625/ap_on_go_su_co/scotus_faith_based

I think this one is probably the worst of all.

quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

Lot of 5-4's from the court, eh?

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RE: Parts of Campaign Finance Reform law ruled unconsti... - 6/25/2007 12:29:52 PM   
cyberdude611


Posts: 2596
Joined: 5/7/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lordandmaster

Yeah.  This one actually went AGAINST the Administration though.  They didn't want groups like the ACLU to be able to launch ads under this ruling.



Well I don't think the Bush administration gives a damn because they can't run for re-election. So if the ACLU wants to lauch attack ads against someone who isn't running...that's their own money down the drain. This election will be unique because it is the first one since 1928 that an incumbant is not running. So the GOP candidate can easily distance himself from the Bush admin....especially if it is someone like Fred Thompson or Mitt Romney. These guys had nothing to do with the Bush admin.

Also it is a loss for Dems as well. The NRA has even more money and influence than the ACLU. It will make it more difficult for the Democrats to win anything in the South.
Also all the Republican PACs will be having a field day bashing Hillary if she's the nominee.

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RE: Parts of Campaign Finance Reform law ruled unconsti... - 6/25/2007 12:31:07 PM   
Lordandmaster


Posts: 10943
Joined: 6/22/2004
Status: offline 		Right, that's why the Administration asked the court to rule against this.

Funny how what you think is always trumped what really is.

quote:

ORIGINAL: cyberdude611

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lordandmaster

Yeah.  This one actually went AGAINST the Administration though.  They didn't want groups like the ACLU to be able to launch ads under this ruling.



Well I don't think the Bush administration gives a damn because they can't run for re-election.

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RE: Parts of Campaign Finance Reform law ruled unconsti... - 6/25/2007 12:36:23 PM   
cyberdude611


Posts: 2596
Joined: 5/7/2006
Status: offline 		Well I am certain they have an opinion on it. And we do know that Bush supported the law because he signed it. It also is a hit against his legacy.

But I doubt Bush will be crying himself to sleep tonight over it.... I think in the long term, it helps the GOP.

(in reply to Lordandmaster)
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RE: Parts of Campaign Finance Reform law ruled unconsti... - 6/25/2007 1:31:52 PM   
domiguy


Posts: 12952
Joined: 5/2/2006
Status: offline 		I agree with Cyberdude...Any lack of campaign financing helps the GOP....The Dems (Which I have to consider myself a part of since there really is no viable alternative) are way to unorganized to perform a full, balls to the wall, smear campaign against their political opponent.  We don't care enough about each other "to come together." The party is way to diverse to begin to share a truly common ideaology....And quite frankly we are collectively not mean enough motherfuckers to do what must be done to win elections nowadays.

The only way hard core Republican strategists can begin to show any signs of fair play or empathy for others is when diagnosed with some horrid, terminal disease....(Lee Atwater).

This is why there must be political reform..."Election restrictor plates" It is something that America would be capable of understanding.....Because by the time the Swift Boat Vets can be rebuked the damage has been done...And we, as a Nascar Nation, are simply to dumb and pliable to begin to question anything that we see or read.

< Message edited by domiguy -- 6/25/2007 1:34:17 PM >

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RE: Parts of Campaign Finance Reform law ruled unconsti... - 6/25/2007 7:34:55 PM   
cyberdude611


Posts: 2596
Joined: 5/7/2006
Status: offline 		Al Gore was at one point in September 11 points ahead of Bush. Then when Gore lost all three debates, the polls evened up. And then the GOP ground campaign kicked in. Bill Clinton said the same thing. He said the debated killed Gore.
Same thing with Kerry. Kerry was ahead in practically every poll until October. Then the polls evened up and the GOP took control of the momentum.

If the polls are even in October next year....Democrats should be nervous because history is not on their side in that scenario. Republicans are very good at elections...especially in the closing weeks. And with this law being stricken dead, it only adds an extra cylinder the GOP slime-machine in late October. And like I said, Hillary carries baggage. She has some skeletons in her past. She has done some unethical things. And the GOP will attack that next year, This is probably why Hillary is not the best choice for the Dems nomination. I think Democrats are nominating the wrong type of people. Gore, Kerry, and Hillary all come off as being a bit rough, dry, and elitist. And I dont think the people like that image very much. I dont think Democrats have an ideological problem...they have an image problem.

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RE: Parts of Campaign Finance Reform law ruled unconsti... - 6/25/2007 8:02:52 PM   
OrionTheWolf


Posts: 7803
Joined: 10/11/2006
Status: offline 		I completely agree here. I have never understood why a specific dollar limit for the entire campaign war chest could not be implemented.


quote:

ORIGINAL: domiguy

who really cares. As long as there are 527 groups...That can malign a candidate all to Hell, and then pay some sort of nominal fine....What difference does it really matter?

There is no longer any value placed on the words truth or honor..... just who has the most money and will go the lowest to win an election....527 groups are bullshit.

We need to get rid of the lobbyists...Since we live in a NASCAR nation perhaps it is time to develop some sort of restrictor plates which could be applied to our elections which would insure all of the candidates would be competing on a level playing field....I don't think the majority of Americans would argue with this type of an approach.




_____________________________

When speaking of slaves people always tend to ignore this definition "One who is abjectly subservient to a specified person or influence."

(in reply to domiguy)
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RE: Parts of Campaign Finance Reform law ruled unconsti... - 6/25/2007 9:41:08 PM   
Lordandmaster


Posts: 10943
Joined: 6/22/2004
Status: offline 		I agree with most of this, but I don't think the Republicans are good at elections generally.  They're good at the Presidential election, but that's it.  If they were so good at elections they wouldn't be in the minority in Congress right now.

Edited to add: Oh, they're also good at gerrymandering districts so as to maximize their presence on Capitol Hill.  Dems haven't mastered that one yet.

quote:

ORIGINAL: cyberdude611

If the polls are even in October next year....Democrats should be nervous because history is not on their side in that scenario. Republicans are very good at elections...especially in the closing weeks. And with this law being stricken dead, it only adds an extra cylinder the GOP slime-machine in late October. And like I said, Hillary carries baggage. She has some skeletons in her past. She has done some unethical things. And the GOP will attack that next year, This is probably why Hillary is not the best choice for the Dems nomination. I think Democrats are nominating the wrong type of people. Gore, Kerry, and Hillary all come off as being a bit rough, dry, and elitist. And I dont think the people like that image very much. I dont think Democrats have an ideological problem...they have an image problem.


< Message edited by Lordandmaster -- 6/25/2007 9:42:47 PM >

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RE: Parts of Campaign Finance Reform law ruled unconsti... - 6/25/2007 10:11:05 PM   
uwinceismile


Posts: 365
Joined: 5/29/2007
Status: offline 		lol,,
repubs learned gerrymandering from the dems :) its just been too long (last administration) since they have had the power to do it....
i agree with much of what has been said here. im a repub. simply because i identify with what they are "suppose" to stand for. but i would love to see a level playing field. frankly, none of the folks running have anything in common with us. they are all super rich, elitist, on both sides of the aisle, and only care for what they can do for themselves, or thier friends.
todays politicians are usually "professional"....its all they have ever wanted to be. gore was raised to be a president someday, went to the finest schools etc. and the same is true for the repubs....
in the beginning, towns folks would grab a hold of a local business guy,,and drag him kicking and screaming to put his bid into running for office,,he would begrudgingly oblige,,do his term,,then high tail it back to private life.... todays politicians are all spineless wonders, who live to be politicians. they dont want a real job. which is why they make it damn near impossible for an incumberant to lose his/her office.
with the exception of the 94 midterms,,,and the last midterms,,,,,and that was just due process of the american public flexing its collective muscle,(and thank god we did on both counts)..
i hope i live long enuff to see a real person take on the challenges that our country faces. and do what is best for our country... and nor for his/hers own benifit,the benifit of thier party, or some pac!
<<steps off of soap box,,,stumbles a bit,,and goes to sleep :)

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RE: Parts of Campaign Finance Reform law ruled unconsti... - 6/25/2007 10:23:58 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Lordandmaster

I'd vote for restrictor plates on the ELECTORATE.




       Damn, LaM, we are in complete agreement.  But would it last when it came time to pick who should never be allowed to mark a ballot?

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.


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RE: Parts of Campaign Finance Reform law ruled unconsti... - 6/25/2007 10:36:08 PM   
Lordandmaster


Posts: 10943
Joined: 6/22/2004
Status: offline 		Alas, no.

(in reply to TheHeretic)
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