pain pleasure conditioning

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imthatacheyouhav -> pain pleasure conditioning (6/8/2007 9:02:19 PM)
Hello, i did a search for pain training and while i found posts i was really hoping to find specific examples of how to train your body to equate pain with sexual pleasure...would you do simulate while flogging or spanking...how would you start the process of training the body? any input or information would be really appreciated thanks

viperess -> RE: pain pleasure conditioning (6/8/2007 9:29:30 PM)
Greetings, i am not sure how one would do that. Personally i am a "pain slut" but it is just something natural to me..now the more i receive it the higher my pain level goes. If it is awhle between say flogging then i have to be built back up some but for me there is just a natural pleasure in the pain.

WhiplashSmile -> RE: pain pleasure conditioning (6/8/2007 9:45:23 PM)
This may or may not work for you. I've found results using clothes pins on the body and on the nipples. They don't have to be attached for too long. Just long enough to experience the sensation of pain, however upon removing them the body experiences the sensation of blood flow along with nice little pleasure tingles. I know personally, that whenever I've had clothes pins on my nipples (yes, I'm somewhat maso) and after they were removed, That wow, the my body becomes very stimulated. Actually, my nipples are somewhat stimulated/arroused for a few days afterwards even. But this is just me. I normally don't play with my nipples! But I have an urge to do so, for a few days after clothes pins. Yeah Yeah Yeah... This is the very same effect it's had on most my partners as well. Not all, but most. All you need to do, is add some mild sexual stimulation during the tingles of clothes pins removal, along with some addition mild pain i.e. light flogging.. WOW.. then have intense sex. Pain=pleasure.. Though I don't have a clit, I've found the same reaction occurs in my partners, where there clit becomes extremely stimulated after removal. Arousal lasting for a few days and comments such as "Damn you, I've been horney as hell all day long after what you did to me last night".... LOL.. This may or may not work for you! Hopefully it does.

imthatacheyouhav -> RE: pain pleasure conditioning (6/8/2007 9:49:22 PM)
Thankyou...that sounds like it would start things along nicely ...and be fun too....LOL...i suppose i'll just keep turning up the volume...till i cant any more...LOL...one step at a time....

LuckyAlbatross -> RE: pain pleasure conditioning (6/8/2007 9:52:30 PM)
For me, if I decided to go down this road, first of course I'd have to learn the person's baseline- what do they already find pleasureable and painful? What degree shifts things over? Think of hair pulling- almost every submissive alive adores a nice tug on the nape of the neck. But how many enjoy yanking 20 hairs out at once by the root? Once I see where things are to start with, I'd play with them- change up speeds, change emotional and physical intensity by working with alcohol or endorphines or adrenalines, change intensity of hitting. My ex master was very fond of reminding me that "warm ups are for masochists." So if I want someone to begin to be a masochist, warming up would be important. But, more than anything, I'd make sure they knew they had done well no matter where we ended up going. I don't need to reach X number of strokes or Y intensity level, and I certainly don't need them to love my flogging in order to have a great time (but then I'm a sadist, I thoroughly enjoy when they hate it). I'd make sure to give lots of feedback and positive reinforcement for their willingness to try and explore things in themselves with me. There's never a rush :) Always time for more later.

WhiplashSmile -> RE: pain pleasure conditioning (6/8/2007 9:57:59 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: imthatacheyouhav Thankyou...that sounds like it would start things along nicely ...and be fun too....LOL...i suppose i'll just keep turning up the volume...till i cant any more...LOL...one step at a time.... Just experiment with a couple of clothes pins. In terms of how long you can tolerate them being on, them removing them. When I'm starting out light with somebody, I'll clip them on for a brief as 15-30 seconds remove, wait for a bit and reattach. Slowly increasing the length of time on and pauses between. Long enough so the full effects of removal can be felt. Turn up the volume slowly, yes. Slowly turn it up over a number of sessions as well. Something to try out and see how well it works. Everbody's body is a little different in how it responds. Hopefully this works out alright for you.

SlpBeauty333 -> RE: pain pleasure conditioning (6/8/2007 10:10:25 PM)
Clothespins on the nipples = lots of fun. Personally I find it worked best for me to go in small steps and make sure my nipples are hard already then put the clothespins below the nipple, not getting your nipple through the hole of the pin at first. Release slowly the first time, the pressure might be too much the first time you might not want to fully let it clamp down. Small steps is key here.

WhiplashSmile -> RE: pain pleasure conditioning (6/8/2007 11:38:32 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SlpBeauty333 Clothespins on the nipples = lots of fun. Personally I find it worked best for me to go in small steps and make sure my nipples are hard already then put the clothespins below the nipple, not getting your nipple through the hole of the pin at first. Release slowly the first time, the pressure might be too much the first time you might not want to fully let it clamp down. Small steps is key here. Actually, I love taking small steps as a form of teasing verses simply attaching clothes pins and leaving them on for prolong periods of times. Some people clamp them on wait x-minutes before completely removing and discarding them from futher use in a scene.

WhiplashSmile -> RE: pain pleasure conditioning (6/9/2007 12:10:31 AM)
Here's is another idea regarding pleasure and pain to explore. Floggers and your back. You can exert just enough force with a flogger that it feels like recieving a back massage. In fact I've incorperated this into body massages, as form of sensation play. I might start off working the whole back side of my partner with a light massage. Then pull out the flogger, begin with light strikes, not too heavy. Get them warmed up to it a little, continue with the massage but make it a deeper mouth drooling one, then pull out the flogger again with heavier strikes. The focus being upon their back. Keep in mind the intensity of blows in relation to where the kideys are and the neck, you know safe play kind of stuff. The idea is to alernate between back massage and flogging. In fact flogging at the right intensity feels pleasurable like the back massage itself, believe it or not. Floggers can deliver both pleasure and pain. The idea here is to slowly intenisfiy the flogging along with the massage going on. The key is good communication between you an your partner at the time, in terms if they are feeling pleasure or pain. At least, when you are new to doing this with your partner. It helps you guage the intensity of pleasure and pain they are experiencing. The idea is to bring the level of flogging up to the pleasure vs. pain threshold. Instead of keeping a focus upon the back alone, you can do this up and down the whole backside of thier body. Back, Ass, Thighs.. well you get the picture. Try not to focus on one specific spot, but make it a bit of a guessing game. Don't make what you are doing too predictable. If you find yourself repeating things in a preductable manner, change it up to another pattern. The idea is to at first making the flogging experience give pleasure, along with the massage.. slowly make it more intense, until the point Pain happens. Maintain flogging a little past the pain threashold but don't intensify it. Slowly back off in the intensity until you reach a point where you are lightly striking and finish it off by caressing their body with the flogger itself. You can do more with a flogger besides strike somebody with it. Floggers can be associated with both pleasure and pain. This is why I often equate flogging to recieving a great back massage. I realize some people must cringe and think I'm nutz whenever I've mentioned this in my previous posts. LOL..

chellekitty -> RE: pain pleasure conditioning (6/9/2007 12:14:51 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross Once I see where things are to start with, I'd play with them- change up speeds, change emotional and physical intensity by working with alcohol or endorphines or adrenalines, change intensity of hitting. My ex master was very fond of reminding me that "warm ups are for masochists." So if I want someone to begin to be a masochist, warming up would be important. umm that doesn't sound like such a good idea, at least by any standard i've seen, that is unless you mean by applying rubbing alcohol to the outside of the body and not ingesting drinking alcohol but by the context i would guess the latter...just my not so humble opinion

ErusUxor -> RE: pain pleasure conditioning (6/9/2007 12:16:46 AM)
hmmm...from a scientific standpoint...it seems it would be like any other psycological conditioning.. Pavlovs dogs seem like a good enough example. Every time they are fed a bell rings...soon a bell rings and they are salivating reguardless of wheather there is food present or not. They simply learn (over a period of time) to associate the sound of the bell ringing with a pleasurable experience....food. I don't think people are much different is our basic psychology....its all just a matter of figuring out how to tweak the reward centers of the brain and get them to recognize pain as a preclude to pleasure... Of course I did say our "basic" psychology.... our humaness gives us the unique state of self awareness that also plays into everything....our physical/ sexual expectations, moral beliefs, emotional attachments all have the ability to complicate how we may experience or respond to our basic psychologic drives.

CitizenCane -> RE: pain pleasure conditioning (6/9/2007 1:01:41 AM)
I think there are two different processes that can work in this regard. In one, there is conditioning- by alternating sexual and painful stimuli, or giving them simultaneously, a mental connection is made and reinforced. In the other, the pain itself is used to cause arousal, due to endorphin and adrenaline action, the rush of blood to sensitive areas (nipples, genitals) and the sexual stimulation of force/submission itself on some people. The second, obviously, is a lot more immediate, but depends on correctly reading the headspace of the recipient- apply this to the wrong person in the wrong frame of mind, and you have an assault charge.

SlpBeauty333 -> RE: pain pleasure conditioning (6/9/2007 1:04:16 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: imthatacheyouhav how would you start the process of training the body? any input or information would be really appreciated thanks Just a quick thought, I know I experience things more intensely when I have PMS so that might not be the best time to try out any new pain experiences or to go extra lightly.

sublimelysensual -> RE: pain pleasure conditioning (6/9/2007 3:41:07 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: chellekitty quote: ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross Once I see where things are to start with, I'd play with them- change up speeds, change emotional and physical intensity by working with alcohol or endorphines or adrenalines, change intensity of hitting. My ex master was very fond of reminding me that "warm ups are for masochists." So if I want someone to begin to be a masochist, warming up would be important. umm that doesn't sound like such a good idea, at least by any standard i've seen, that is unless you mean by applying rubbing alcohol to the outside of the body and not ingesting drinking alcohol but by the context i would guess the latter...just my not so humble opinion Though I could be wrong, I think what LA meant was a glass of wine or a drink to loosen up the nerves somewhat, not getting someone drunk then playing with them..there's a big difference between someone who's totally inebriated and someone with a bit of a buzz.. just my two cents.. As for the OP..I hate pain, detest it, but throw in some sexual stimulation and it's a whole different story..clothespins are also great, as has been mentioned. Pinning something ..nipples, earlobes, etc etc, then going to the point of orgasm and removing them at the same instant -grinz- you may want to try it. That being said, I don't know that I will ever equate pain with pleasure, other than the psychological pleasure I get from knowing I'm pleasing the person I'm with, which is enough for me in most cases.. -a

ExSteelAgain -> RE: pain pleasure conditioning (6/9/2007 3:57:54 AM)
Thanks for the detailed, helpful posts, WhiplashSmile.

slaveish -> RE: pain pleasure conditioning (6/9/2007 5:25:29 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: WhiplashSmile This may or may not work for you. I've found results using clothes pins on the body and on the nipples. They don't have to be attached for too long. Just long enough to experience the sensation of pain, however upon removing them the body experiences the sensation of blood flow along with nice little pleasure tingles. Yeah, agreed. Clothespins are a great way to train the body. Get the wooden kind (the pressure is very firm and they do not have a tendency to fall of when the pain makes you sweat, as will plastic ones). Put clothes pins on sensitive areas - nipples, under the breast (use as many as you can clip onto little pinches of skin under there), lips (facial and vaginal) ears and tongue. Ouch. The pain can be very distracting at first, but focus. Breathe through it. Imagine your One saying "Do this for me. Please me" or whatever gets you going. Masturbate until you cum, then remove the pins. Removing the pins is as painful as putting them on. You can also use minty toothpaste on your clit, followed by ice. It burns. Masturbate through the pain. (Make sure you wash well afterward - toothpaste isn't meant for this particular orifice.) Just a couple of ideas.

SeeksOnlyOne -> RE: pain pleasure conditioning (6/9/2007 6:03:33 AM)
something that happened with me after discovering i enjoyed the pain/pleasure thing.....i found my self (unintentionally i think) adjusting my reactions to normal daily things. the freezer door tries to shut and lands on my bare skin when wearing a gown or something, while i am getting ice. 5 years ago, i would have jerked away and been irritated. now, i stand there and just feel it........and somehow it always travels from my back to my brain, then to my crotch.[:)] lying in the sun and i feel a bug land on my skin......same thing-5 years ago i would have swatted it away-irritated by the sensation-now i lay there and fell it walk on my skin-and hope it is not a stinging varmit-but once i was stung and managed to lie completely still and feel even that in a very nice way(i am not allergic to any insect bites thank goodness) same thing with sweat running down me if i am sunbathing, i no longer reach to wipe it away, i just feel it. i manage a cafeteria at an elementary school-and on our field day i managed to get one of the teachers with a super soaker water gun. he thought it would be funny to wait until my hands were occupied(helping my ladies get the sandwiches ready for sack lunches that day), and then dump a 12 oz glass of ice water down my back. so he came and pulled my shirt out at the back, and did this. that icey water ran down my back-down the crack of my ass all the way to my crotch. he was laughing at me, as i felt it and stood completely still, praying that ice water would make it to my clit-lmfao. i must have gotten quite an expression on my face-because he turned red and said "omg you like that shit dontcha", grinned really big and turned a bit red, then walked off. somehow i think he will be eating lunch more in the cafeteria when school starts back.[sm=biggrin.gif] i dont know if this helps you any-but i hope so. it amazes me the things that used to upset me, that now thrill me, because of my mindset.

SexyRed -> RE: pain pleasure conditioning (6/9/2007 6:08:44 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: WhiplashSmile Here's is another idea regarding pleasure and pain to explore. Floggers and your back. You can exert just enough force with a flogger that it feels like recieving a back massage. In fact I've incorperated this into body massages, as form of sensation play. I might start off working the whole back side of my partner with a light massage. Then pull out the flogger, begin with light strikes, not too heavy. Get them warmed up to it a little, continue with the massage but make it a deeper mouth drooling one, then pull out the flogger again with heavier strikes. The focus being upon their back. Keep in mind the intensity of blows in relation to where the kideys are and the neck, you know safe play kind of stuff. The idea is to alernate between back massage and flogging. In fact flogging at the right intensity feels pleasurable like the back massage itself, believe it or not. Floggers can deliver both pleasure and pain. The idea here is to slowly intenisfiy the flogging along with the massage going on. The key is good communication between you an your partner at the time, in terms if they are feeling pleasure or pain. At least, when you are new to doing this with your partner. It helps you guage the intensity of pleasure and pain they are experiencing. The idea is to bring the level of flogging up to the pleasure vs. pain threshold. Instead of keeping a focus upon the back alone, you can do this up and down the whole backside of thier body. Back, Ass, Thighs.. well you get the picture. Try not to focus on one specific spot, but make it a bit of a guessing game. Don't make what you are doing too predictable. If you find yourself repeating things in a preductable manner, change it up to another pattern. The idea is to at first making the flogging experience give pleasure, along with the massage.. slowly make it more intense, until the point Pain happens. Maintain flogging a little past the pain threashold but don't intensify it. Slowly back off in the intensity until you reach a point where you are lightly striking and finish it off by caressing their body with the flogger itself. You can do more with a flogger besides strike somebody with it. Floggers can be associated with both pleasure and pain. This is why I often equate flogging to recieving a great back massage. I realize some people must cringe and think I'm nutz whenever I've mentioned this in my previous posts. LOL.. Oh no cringing here. You are not nuts. It can be exactly how you describe and that is why I love the delicious dichotomy of floggers.

KnightofMists -> RE: pain pleasure conditioning (6/9/2007 6:27:33 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: imthatacheyouhav Hello, i did a search for pain training and while i found posts i was really hoping to find specific examples of how to train your body to equate pain with sexual pleasure...would you do simulate while flogging or spanking...how would you start the process of training the body? any input or information would be really appreciated thanks there are lots of specific techinques and tactics. But in the end there is only one basic strategy to use. Look at as a continum on a fulcrum. On one end is Sexual Response then other is pain. The ideal is to keep the balance tilted to the sexual pleasure at all times.... the weight should always be in a moment sexual pleasure. With this in mind... a person slowly introduces pain aspects to the moment. Slowly sliding this aspect on the other end of continum closer and closer to the Sexual pleasure and always keeping the balance tilted that way. Lastly and more important... the Mind! It must be primed and focused on that sexual pleasure. One needs to keep the mind focused o that Perception in what is occuring. You are in essense changing perception of the mind on what it is recieving. Slowly you teach the mind that a flogger instead of painful is pleasurable. It is one of the reasons many individuals start slow with warm and work themselves up to a more intense level.... of course many don't actually realize what actuall affect this is having on the bottom. You are changiing the minds perception ! There is no one tactic that will work for everyone.. understanding the strategy is key to understanding what tactic is needed in the moment. Also keep in mind... some individuals Sexual Response is Closer related to Pain and some it is very wide apart. Editted to add: This has a definite deep psychological effect on a person. Changing their perception of Sexual Pleasure is significant. In time this will affect what intensity levels must be maintained to for Sexual Pleasure to be preceived. This can be extremely damaging if this intensity can't be maintained or endured with the dynamics of the relationship.

LuckyAlbatross -> RE: pain pleasure conditioning (6/9/2007 7:53:31 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross Once I see where things are to start with, I'd play with them- change up speeds, change emotional and physical intensity by working with alcohol or endorphines or adrenalines, change intensity of hitting. My ex master was very fond of reminding me that "warm ups are for masochists." So if I want someone to begin to be a masochist, warming up would be important. umm that doesn't sound like such a good idea, at least by any standard i've seen, that is unless you mean by applying rubbing alcohol to the outside of the body and not ingesting drinking alcohol but by the context i would guess the latter...just my not so humble opinion Though I could be wrong, I think what LA meant was a glass of wine or a drink to loosen up the nerves somewhat, not getting someone drunk then playing with them..there's a big difference between someone who's totally inebriated and someone with a bit of a buzz.. just my two cents.. As for the OP..I hate pain, detest it, but throw in some sexual stimulation and it's a whole different story..clothespins are also great, as has been mentioned. Pinning something ..nipples, earlobes, etc etc, then going to the point of orgasm and removing them at the same instant -grinz- you may want to try it. That being said, I don't know that I will ever equate pain with pleasure, other than the psychological pleasure I get from knowing I'm pleasing the person I'm with, which is enough for me in most cases.. -a Well ditto to your whole darn post. Yes, I meant just a glass of wine or something to begin to relax and let the happy chemicals flow. And ditto on the non masochism thing as well- some people just don't have that sort of brain/body chemistry. I think we can all raise our endurance levels and gain pleasure from the painful experience through a myriad of motivations- but some people really aren't masochists, and some people really just don't process some forms of pain as pleasure.

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