Remember the Liberty! (Full Version)

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Jack45 -> Remember the Liberty! (6/8/2007 12:47:46 PM)

40 YEARS AGO TODAY:

Remember the Liberty!

quote:

It was 40 years ago this June 8 that the USS Liberty – a large, armorless, refitted freighter that was gathering intelligence in the Mediterranean at the outset of the Six Day War – was attacked by Israeli fighter jets and torpedoes. Thirty-four U.S. sailors were killed, and 172 were wounded. The Liberty limped back to Malta. A U.S. Navy court of inquiry was on board investigating the damage, but – for some reason – the investigators were not allowed to proceed to Israel to find out what really went on. Orders from the top echelons of the Pentagon nixed the inquiry, and today, the families of the fallen still haven't gotten any answers as to why Israel was allowed to get away with it without even so much as a slap on the wrist – nor even any public acknowledgment that it was a deliberate attack.







LadyEllen -> RE: Remember the Liberty! (6/8/2007 1:06:23 PM)

Whilst I wouldnt want in any way to dishonour the memory of those who died and were injured Jack, I think you'll find this is a very similar incident to that in Iraq just recently, when with the best targetting and communications equipment available, US pilots managed to attack a British unit with lethal effect.

And the Pentagon refused point blank to assist the inquest into the deaths, whilst an enquiry into the incident was suppressed - presumably for the same reason an enquiry into the Liberty was suppressed; international relations.

War is a shitty business all round. And politics and diplomacy never had morality written into them.

E




meatcleaver -> RE: Remember the Liberty! (6/8/2007 1:18:51 PM)

I think the US accepted it was purposely targeted 40 years ago didn't they or at least they strongly suspected it.

Its funny really, when you think that the US esculated the Vietnam conflict on a ghost attack but a real attack has them bank rolling their attackers. Funny old world.

I think it is also accepted that the UN listening post was purposely targeted in Lebanon last year too.




FatDomDaddy -> RE: Remember the Liberty! (6/8/2007 1:32:43 PM)

Both countries concluded that it was fired upon by mistake and the nation of Israel apologized for the incident and paid $13 million to the survivors and families of the dead.

The families got both answers and money.




meatcleaver -> RE: Remember the Liberty! (6/8/2007 2:14:31 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: FatDomDaddy

Both countries concluded that it was fired upon by mistake and the nation of Israel apologized for the incident and paid $13 million to the survivors and families of the dead.

The families got both answers and money.


Has anyone seen the thorough report that was made? Only the other day on the BBC world service there seemed to be enough American ex-intelligence people saying they strongly suspected it was on purpose.

One has to remember that the '67 war was sanctioned by America and while they might have been pissed off with the Israelis, Israel was the US's foot hold in the middle east and the bigger picture was more important to them. Especially with all the Arab states being friendly with the USSR and were deeply suspicious of the US at best.

As for the 13million, no doubt that was US aid anyway.[;)]




Jack45 -> RE: Remember the Liberty! (6/8/2007 3:15:05 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

Only the other day on the BBC world service there seemed to be enough American ex-intelligence people saying they strongly suspected it was on purpose.

One has to remember that the '67 war was sanctioned by America and while they might have been pissed off with the Israelis, Israel was the US's foot hold in the middle east and the bigger picture was more important to them. Especially with all the Arab states being friendly with the USSR and were deeply suspicious of the US at best.

As for the 13million, no doubt that was US aid anyway.


Rockets, Napalm, Torpedoes & Lie

Israel's Attack on the USS Liberty,  Revisited
quote:

Ennes notes that even testimony by the Liberty's communications officers about the jamming of the ship's radios was classified as "Top Secret". The reason? It proved that Israel knew it was attacking an American ship. "Here was strong evidence that the attack was planned in advance and that our ship's identity was known to the attackers (for it its practically impossible to jam the radio of a stranger), but this information was hushed up and no conclusions were drawn from it," Ennes writes.


This is from the survivors' website:
The Wisconsin Library Wars
quote:

The village of Grafton, Wisconsin, chose to honor the USS Liberty by naming its new library after the ship. The complaints that followed filled the local newspapers and airwaves for months. This is the story of the USS Liberty Memorial Public Library and the controversy that followed.





Arpig -> RE: Remember the Liberty! (6/8/2007 4:15:30 PM)

And.......?




selfbnd411 -> RE: Remember the Liberty! (6/8/2007 5:01:33 PM)

Yah, I guess the part where they machine gunned the Liberty's survival rafts shows how much of an "accident" this was.

Seriously, people...don't believe everything you read.  Do your own reading and thinking.




Real0ne -> RE: Remember the Liberty! (6/10/2007 7:47:53 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jack45

quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

Only the other day on the BBC world service there seemed to be enough American ex-intelligence people saying they strongly suspected it was on purpose.

One has to remember that the '67 war was sanctioned by America and while they might have been pissed off with the Israelis, Israel was the US's foot hold in the middle east and the bigger picture was more important to them. Especially with all the Arab states being friendly with the USSR and were deeply suspicious of the US at best.

As for the 13million, no doubt that was US aid anyway.


Rockets, Napalm, Torpedoes & Lie

Israel's Attack on the USS Liberty,  Revisited
quote:

Ennes notes that even testimony by the Liberty's communications officers about the jamming of the ship's radios was classified as "Top Secret". The reason? It proved that Israel knew it was attacking an American ship. "Here was strong evidence that the attack was planned in advance and that our ship's identity was known to the attackers (for it its practically impossible to jam the radio of a stranger), but this information was hushed up and no conclusions were drawn from it," Ennes writes.


This is from the survivors' website:
The Wisconsin Library Wars
quote:

The village of Grafton, Wisconsin, chose to honor the USS Liberty by naming its new library after the ship. The complaints that followed filled the local newspapers and airwaves for months. This is the story of the USS Liberty Memorial Public Library and the controversy that followed.




This is the article from the survivors' website:    The Wisconsin Library Wars


Jack that is a totally superb and excellent post!

That write up is beyond awesome!

It demonstrates both the federal and local discrimination that takes place all over his country!

i have to go to grafton sometime in the next couple weeks and i am going to personally go over and shake the hand of the grob's for what they have done!   This country needs more people like them!

Excellent article and dead on target!


That little debacle goes all the way up to johnson and macnamera.  that was supposed to be his little pretext to get into the middle east.  to bad the article does not take it in that direction and elaborate on that part of it.




Termyn8or -> RE: Remember the Liberty! (6/10/2007 11:14:07 PM)

I remember, and like they will never forget , WE WILL NEVER FORGET either.

But it really doesn't matter, it has been going on since the pilgrims won their independence fron the Native Americans (Injuns for the illiterate). How dare they fuck with us, didn't they realaize who we are ? They should know to just leave and give us their land. How stupid could they be ?

This should fill the sarcasm bill quite well tonight, but think about it. Things are not right and they have not been for a very very long time. And changing this shit is not easy.

Yeah, keep bringing everything up, and never offer any type of solution. Then maybe I will go out in a blaze of glory.

I have figured out where now, but not going to go into it.

Double standard, I wasn't going to go into it but, oh well. Girl I know lived out in the stix. She was pretty cool, I didn't know her all that well after so many years, but she was crippled by a police cruiser on silent running at about 100MPH. If you or I were to do that we would be in prison, not even jail..

Similarly, there is a very blatant international double standard. Israel can have all the nukes it wants but nobody else can. It really is that simple.

Actually one day someone will figure out how to get a nuke into the Negev desert and hit the Dimora nuclear plant. And they will know it is suicide for them and all their loved ones, but things will get so bad for them they will no longer care.

And the guy who said "The only thing to fear is fear itself" was wrong, thetre is another thing to fear. People who are not afraid to, or want to, die.Some of them have had their soul stripped by watching their children get killed. Or perhaps family members, whatever.

Some of them have watched their relatives die when our fucking tax dollars bombed the hospital they just dropped them off at. Some of them don't have water anymore.

Your tax dollars at work.

Flame me good, if you can :-P

T




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